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  1. #1
    Bloodsail Admiral Avada Kedavra's Avatar
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    Do we still live in an archaic society?

    Why do we have to fight? Why is there war? In this day and age, our civilization should be so far past this its crazy stupid we are as primitive as we are. I'm not talking about primitive technology, but our social and political standards of practice are archaic. If there are disagreements, why cant they be handled peacefully. I know that people will say "only in a perfect world" but WHY CANT WE BE THERE! For example, I live in the USA and am very proud to be an American. Its been all over the news and media about the problems N. Korea government instigating controversy and making threats that could quite possibly lead to war. But why? Why don't the people of today use their intelligence? If people could get over the pointless power struggles, show of control, the need to intimidate and feel like they have something to prove and the only way to do it is with violence??? Now, factoring in human nature, there will always be some bad apples but, as a global society we will never make progress if there are 196 countries all pulling in different directions. I'm not saying that we need to unite as one per se but to be on a level where we don't have the issues and fears we have today would be amazing.

    My question to you is: How can this be fixed. Can it be fixed and how long do we have to wait before our societies realize there is a better way.
    Last edited by Avada Kedavra; 2013-02-10 at 04:44 AM. Reason: spelling

  2. #2
    Dreadlord Asics's Avatar
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    I'd like to preface with the fact that I honestly do not know how to fix it. I would like to say that I believe the world will be a better place when the current generation of world leaders dies and we (the 20-40 year olds) step in to their place in leadership.
    I drink craft beer, listen to a broad spectrum of music, and am an avid Seattle Seahawks and San Francisco Giants fan!

  3. #3
    Scarab Lord Loaf Lord's Avatar
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    I feel like every age of society will think that it's age is archaic. If humanity is still around 10k years from now, they'll probably claim their society is archaric and stone age just like us.

  4. #4
    Brewmaster WskyDK's Avatar
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    The day free thought is squashed, and we lose all sense of individuality, is the day the world will finally know peace.
    The instant there is any sort of inequality, is the instant that world is shattered.

    Edit: to actually answer your questions, the only way to fix it is to have a global indoctrination program.

  5. #5
    as long as the feeling "I want..." stays in this world, conflict will never end

  6. #6
    The Lightbringer Calzaeth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asics View Post
    I'd like to preface with the fact that I honestly do not know how to fix it. I would like to say that I believe the world will be a better place when the current generation of world leaders dies and we (the 20-40 year olds) step in to their place in leadership.
    The problem is that every generation has thought that. And we still fight the same damn wars.

    I honestly don't think it can be 'fixed', but I think it can be mitigated by trying anyway. After all, humans can't fly, but we still built airplanes
    If you add me on Steam, Skype or whatever program/client I share my info for, please write something to identify you in the "Dude/gal wants to join your club"-message. Just so I know that an actual human is on the other end :P

  7. #7
    Warchief Zethras's Avatar
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    (this is not intended as a religion bash, just my opinion)

    I think humanity will start getting along much better when we meet "the aliens".

    Once we discover we ARN"T alone in the universe, and that we arn't special little snowflakes in the vast, empty, cold cosmos, things will change.

    Religion will lose it's already waning grip on our society, so we won't need to fight over that anymore.
    We will strive ever harder to reach out into space, to discover all the new worlds and people.
    It will unify us as a race, and we will work together to do all these amazing things we're capable of.
    Walking with a friend in the dark is better than walking alone in the light.
    So I chose the path of the Ebon Blade, and not a day passes where i've regretted it.
    I am eternal, I am unyielding, I am UNDYING.
    I am Zethras, and my blood will be the end of you.

  8. #8
    Titan Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Because humans, at their base, are stupid. We've never gotten over that.

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  9. #9
    Brewmaster WskyDK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zethras View Post
    Awesome things.
    I can only hope.
    (I can also hope that your scenario wouldn't just turn into a huge "us vs. them" mentality)

  10. #10
    Bloodsail Admiral Avada Kedavra's Avatar
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    I wish that everyone had a higher level of thinking. It is a very hard concept to explain, but it makes sense in my head. But when you get there, it will blow your mind with the realization and understanding of ....life (for a lack of a better word)

  11. #11
    Warchief Zethras's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RunItsTheFuz View Post
    I can only hope.
    (I can also hope that your scenario wouldn't just turn into a huge "us vs. them" mentality)
    I hope with all my immense quantities of willpower that whatever group of people are leading us when the aliens show up, they would have enough common sense to realize if they can come to us, they outclass us in technology so vastly we would seem like monkeys, and therefor could glass the planet and exterminate us like insects.
    Walking with a friend in the dark is better than walking alone in the light.
    So I chose the path of the Ebon Blade, and not a day passes where i've regretted it.
    I am eternal, I am unyielding, I am UNDYING.
    I am Zethras, and my blood will be the end of you.

  12. #12
    The Lightbringer DEATHETERNAL's Avatar
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    There will never be that perfect world until the very human desire for power is wiped out of every mind of humanity, and that will never occur.
    And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him.
    Revelation 6:8

  13. #13
    I don't believe we live in an archaic society... but I do believe we live in a time of transition between two divergent mentalities and ideologies.

    The fear-based militaristic, capitalistic and religious ideology vs a mutual cooperation, balanced economic and science/knowledge based ideology.

    In short: "Survival of the fittest" vs "Strength in numbers"... those that put the two together still belong on the "Survival" side of things...

    In shorter: "ME!" Vs "Us..."... again, those who put the two together still belong on "ME!" side - they just extend it to more people who can defend his/her individual belief and lifestyle. :P
    Last edited by mvallas; 2013-02-10 at 04:56 AM.
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  14. #14
    Brewmaster WskyDK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avada Kedavra View Post
    I wish that everyone had a higher level of thinking. It is a very hard concept to explain, but it makes sense in my head. But when you get there, it will blow your mind with the realization and understanding of ....life (for a lack of a better word)
    The issue with being that, as a species, we're quite focused on the day to day aspects of survival.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zethras View Post
    I hope with all my immense quantities of willpower that whatever group of people are leading us when the aliens show up, they would have enough common sense to realize if they can come to us, they outclass us in technology so vastly we would seem like monkeys, and therefor could glass the planet and exterminate us like insects.
    Fear breeds resentment, and it would only be a matter of time before someone did something incredibly stupid.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Zethras View Post
    (this is not intended as a religion bash, just my opinion)

    I think humanity will start getting along much better when we meet "the aliens".

    Once we discover we ARN"T alone in the universe, and that we arn't special little snowflakes in the vast, empty, cold cosmos, things will change.

    Religion will lose it's already waning grip on our society, so we won't need to fight over that anymore.
    We will strive ever harder to reach out into space, to discover all the new worlds and people.
    It will unify us as a race, and we will work together to do all these amazing things we're capable of.
    Or religion will become even more important for some people becuase it will them why they are superior to those aliens. Why god made them first...and stuff like that.
    Just meeting another race (and the odds of having 2 planets meet eachother are very slim) alone won't change much i fear.

  16. #16
    I don't really know how to put this but.. I'll give it a shot.

    Like lions, wolves, primates and many other mammals we are social creatures that form communities, and just like those animals we establish a hierarchy. Different countries are like different animal packs and we don't necessarily get along very well, but having very evolved brains (compared to other animals on this planet) we are slightly better at restraining those aggressive tendencies (slightly).

    We fight for various reasons with many of those reasons having ties to our tribe/community/pack, this includes concepts such as religion and race but also the most base one which is territory. We often hear "It's a war about money!" or the like and if that is the truth.. We are just doing what we have always been doing albeit for more than just a larger area in which to gather food.

  17. #17
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avada Kedavra View Post
    Why do we have to fight? Why is there war?
    Because without war, we're doomed. "War" is the struggle to succeed. As we all strive to achieve more, we bump up against the struggles of others, and conflict emerges. When we band together, in larger and larger groups, those conflicts become wars.

    The ONLY way that war could ever be eliminated is if we're;
    1> Enslaved by some higher power that simply annihalates anyone who even debates fighting back, with no exceptions
    2> Under so much threat from the pressure of simple survival that we cannot spare any for fighting amongst ourselves, or
    3> Evolve such that we lack any ambition whatsoever, and essentially allow ourselves to die off through apathy.

    There's no chance of a happy civilization where everyone gets along and nobody ever fights about anything. And if such a civilization did somehow come about, it's one guy with a board that's got a nail through it from changing into another violent dictatorship. The only way to avoid that is option #1 above, where we're enslaved by some god-aliens or an AI that's so thoroughly in control that resistance really is futile and impossible.

    It can't possibly be "fixed", because it's not a flaw. It's the necessary result of our struggle to survive and improve our lot, which is the reason we developed literally every single technological advancement we have. It's absolutely integral to humanity. We're social apex predators. We're not cows or horses, who can be happy living in a big herd. We're wolves. And if another pack threatens our territory, we'll rip it apart. And that's a good thing, because the alternative is that we're dead.

    That's not to say we shouldn't pick our fights for good reasons, and try and avoid causing undue suffering, but the idea that fighting would just "go away"? Never gonna happen.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    The ONLY way that war could ever be eliminated is if we're;
    1> Enslaved by some higher power that simply annihalates anyone who even debates fighting back, with no exceptions
    2> Under so much threat from the pressure of simple survival that we cannot spare any for fighting amongst ourselves, or
    3> Evolve such that we lack any ambition whatsoever, and essentially allow ourselves to die off through apathy.
    .
    4> Realize that we can evolve beyond war and work as a mutual group together as a hive-mind for the benefit of all.

    It can't possibly be "fixed", because it's not a flaw. It's the necessary result of our struggle to survive and improve our lot, which is the reason we developed literally every single technological advancement we have.
    You are misinterpreting the desire to meet challenges... War is just a very violent bloody version of that.

    You can "wage war" on Poverty, scarcity and dissease and without firing a single gun. :P

    I also do not believe War is the ONLY motivation... Video Games were not a result of war (If your first thought said "Simulator" then you're showing how naieve you are... tell me how accurate any Atari 2600 game was as a "simulator"... MMORPGs were not a result of war... PEPSI wasn't a result of war... CARS weren't a result of war... the Aeroplane wasn't a result of war... the television wasn't a result of war... the light bulb wasn't a result of war...

    hell man... the COMPUTER you typed this on wasn't created as result of war! Honed? Sure the war efforts have helped... but I'd wager your gaming rig had little to do with War and had more to do with Microsoft pushing gaming platform for increased sales...

    What the above represent are results of ideas that challenged the current way of thinking. Not violent bloody war.

    You tell me that War is the only thing that improves us? How does a society that created a bomb 100x more powerful than the one used in Heroshima push us forward? if we used several of them - we'd be SET BACK to the stone age... BS on your theory of war evolving us...

    Tell me - what exactly happens if, say, the USA conquered the world? What happens when there's nobody left to fight?

    I'll tell you what would happen... we'd be stuck in a stagnation of linear thinking that the ONLY way to achieve results is war - and we'd go to war AGAINST OURSELVES. We'd break out into stupid little communities... divide ourselves on color, accent, if we're meat-eaters or vegetarians... doesn't matter.

    And we'd kill each other until there's ONE person left... and then what does that one wage war against? The rocks?

    You say history teaches us that violence pushes us forward... I say you're wrong.

    I say that History teaches us that we repeat the same violent mistakes over and over again, until somebody stands up and does something DIFFERENTLY.
    Last edited by mvallas; 2013-02-10 at 05:34 AM.
    "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead... and that World of Warcraft... died with him..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    That's the ONLY reason you would post 9600 posts over 3 years: a mission of hate.

  19. #19
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    4> Realize that we can evolve beyond war and work as a mutual group together as a hive-mind for the benefit of all.
    No, that's #3 or #1, depending on the iteration. If we're all subservient to the "hive mind", then we're slaves.

    You tell me that War is the only thing that improves us?
    That wasn't what I said. I said that the desire to improve our lot will, inevitably, lead to war. It can also be expressed other ways, too, but it will get expressed as violence, as well.

    Tell me - what exactly happens if, say, the USA conquered the world? What happens when there's nobody left to fight?
    Can't happen. There's always somebody left to fight. In that case, it's likely the US would end up fracturing into different groups in a civil war, eventually. The only way there's nobody left to fight is if everybody else is dead. More likely, the US wouldn't even get that far before it collapsed into violence. There's a reason empires don't last, and eventually shatter and fall to pieces; we're not a species that desires stability and security.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    we're not a species that desires stability and security.
    We do desire stability and security the only problem is that the majority of people only care about a certain group which is usually their own.

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