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  1. #1

    Can anyone help me get into this game?

    Hi - I already own GW2, and I know that somewhere in there is a game that I can really enjoy and play longterm.

    I really enjoy the questing and exploration experience so far, although the slow running speed drives me crazy, but my real issue is that I cannot find a class that I enjoy - like, at all. Normally I can get to max level on any class if it's my first, but I am really struggling with this game.

    So far, I have tried:

    Warrior
    I usually start most games with a Warrior. Greatsword annoyed me, because it basically only has one decent attack. Out of 5 skills (6 if you include F1), there are two charges? Isn't that a bit redundant? I'm sure it's good for PvP, but it strikes me as a criminal waste of an ability slot. What I did like was the Rifle - that was a perfectly designed weapon. Bleeds, power attacks, weakness debuffs, roots, a knockback, and a volley. Perfect. Except I picked Warrior to be a melee class - it feels HORRIBLY wrong to use a Rifle as a Warrior.

    Mesmer
    Mesmer sounded interesting, and the fact that it was primarily a caster that could use a Greatsword interested me greatly. However, the damage and defense compared to the other classes I tried was pitiful, and it made soloing very tedious. Certain skills were fun and useful though, but the one thing that really annoyed me was the poor AI on the illusions, and how they would disappear the instant I dropped combat, even though I was chain pulling. The Mesmer also had fairly long cooldowns on most moves, which again, seems criminal when you've got so few skill slots.

    Guardian
    Incredible damage with Greatsword and Hammer, and I like the group utility. However, the class seems a bit dull. Also they don't have a passive movement speed increase (at least that I could find) and this is a really big issue for me, as I hate moving so slowly everywhere. I actually had to delete my Human Guardian and remake it as an Asura, because the smaller model gave me the illusion of running faster. Although I like Greatsword and Hammer with the Guardian, it gets really boring using only the same 5 skills over and over, and I only get another 5 if I switch.

    Elementalist
    In an effort to try and resolve my issue with disliking tiny amounts of skills, I tried an Elementalist. Very disappointed to see that they cannot swap weapons, effectively removing another 20 or so skills from the player, but nevertheless, still quite nice to be able to use more skills. However, once again, the vast majority of them are useless. The damage and defense of the elementalist was also rather weak as I got past level 15 or so, and it got the point where I was dying a lot, and it got very frustrating. Bonus points for having Signet of Air as a movement speed increase.

    Engineer
    Tried to like level 3 but immediately hated the class, and don't really like the concept of it anyway. Don't know why I made it tbh.

    Please can someone suggest what class I should try next, or if I should continue with one of my other characters instead and reasons why? I would like to play WvW and do the end game dungeon thing (fractals I think?). One thing I've been struggling with is that it seems ranged is a must in WvW, and melee get destroyed. Yet, in PvE, due to there being no tank, I feel like I should be playing a melee class, otherwise I die so quickly, and I really dislike being squishy.

    Many thanks for your time if you read all of this, and your advice if you choose to give any.

  2. #2
    The ranger, is awesome!

  3. #3
    I've tried all the classes to about lvl 5-8, some a bit more.

    My favorite is my ranger by far, got her to lvl 25 in about 3 days of "coop" with a friend. Another I like is the guardian, but I see you aren't a huge fan of it.

    Apart from those, most of the classes I'm not a huge fan of.
    Engineer get's better once you learn what he's all about (there's skills for extra weapon kits), but still not entirely my cup of tea. I was looking forward to the mesmer, but after 10 lvls I just wasn't feeling it. I've never been big on casters, so both the necro and elementalist didn't sit too well with me either, though I had a reasonable time playing the elementalist. Thief is decent fun if you like rogue classes I guess, but I didn't really get into it.
    Last edited by Incognito Noctix; 2013-02-08 at 02:37 PM.
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  4. #4
    Till what level did you play each class? From what you're saying you seem to have played till <20 I sugest going to 30 on each toon before you cast judgement. The reason for this is that at 30 you have some traits and an elite which can change the playstyle quite a bit while if you're at for instance lvl 15 you've only gotten one minor trait which you'll hardly notice and won't do all that much.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Meledelion View Post
    Till what level did you play each class? From what you're saying you seem to have played till <20 I sugest going to 30 on each toon before you cast judgement. The reason for this is that at 30 you have some traits and an elite which can change the playstyle quite a bit while if you're at for instance lvl 15 you've only gotten one minor trait which you'll hardly notice and won't do all that much.
    All are between 15 and 20 except Engi, and Guardian I got to 25

    Thanks for the advice all. I think I will try Ranger next, I notice they can use Greatswords too, which is a plus, as I love them, but also short bow and longbow both look very stylish. Are there any racial bonuses that you think pertain to a Ranger the most?

    I understand the Ranger also has a passive movement speed bonus which is a real plus for me.

    I should say that of the classes I have tried so far, Guardian was the best. I will try Ranger over the weekend, and let you know how I get on.

    I'll check the official forums for some build advice.

  6. #6
    Moderator Shamanic's Avatar
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    Elementalist
    In an effort to try and resolve my issue with disliking tiny amounts of skills, I tried an Elementalist. Very disappointed to see that they cannot swap weapons, effectively removing another 20 or so skills from the player, but nevertheless, still quite nice to be able to use more skills. However, once again, the vast majority of them are useless. The damage and defense of the elementalist was also rather weak as I got past level 15 or so, and it got the point where I was dying a lot, and it got very frustrating. Bonus points for having Signet of Air as a movement speed increase.
    I think you're missing the point of elementalist not being able to swap weapons, they have four different elements they can switch between - in combat - meaning you essentially have 4 sets of skills that you need to be aware what they do, and also what the cooldown is, making it one of the most complicated classes to manage if you're using it to the maximum effectiveness. Unless I'm missing the point

    Defense is definitely quite weak at lower levels but if you use all the elements for combos they do actually put out quite a bit of damage.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamanic View Post
    I think you're missing the point of elementalist not being able to swap weapons, they have four different elements they can switch between - in combat - meaning you essentially have 4 sets of skills that you need to be aware what they do, and also what the cooldown is, making it one of the most complicated classes to manage if you're using it to the maximum effectiveness. Unless I'm missing the point

    Defense is definitely quite weak at lower levels but if you use all the elements for combos they do actually put out quite a bit of damage.
    Heh, nah I'm not missing the point with the elementalist. I can play it effectively (at least at the level I was; 20), and often cycled between elements using things from different schools etc.. My point is that even 20 skills isn't really enough for me. I really wanted to avoid drawing comparisons with WoW, but to give you an example, I have over 60 different keybound skills on my Warrior in WoW, and at least 30 on most characters that I play at a basic level. There are around 10 or so fundamental ones, and then a lot of different utility or "kit" ones for each class.

    Warrior's Greatsword, to me, is a great example of too many utility/kit moves instead of more fundamental attack moves, compared with the Rifle, that pretty much is perfect - it's just a shame it's on what I traditionally feel is a melee class.

    Other examples of weapons/classes I feel are well designed are Greatsword and Hammer for Guardian, because they once again have a lot of utility baked in with the fundamental skills. The little valor (I think it's called that) buff you get on the 3rd swing of the hammer auto attack combo, the ability to create your own fields and combo them (Greatsword 4 and then 2 for example), for great utility. That's well designed, and then you get a lot of "cool" stuff with the other skills, like summoned weapons, and crazy buffs etc, whereas I feel Warrior is doubling (or even tripling) up on certain skills when it doesn't need to. 2 "charge" type moves on the great sword, and then there's also the Bull Rush skill as well?

    I'm sure all of that utility is great for PvP, especially having 3 charges, it's probably great, but when it comes at the expense of a lot of what I would consider fundamental skills, you're basically stuck doing nothing but charging around or using 1000 blades, and it got old very quickly.

    But I am going to try Ranger all weekend - and will report in on Monday. Thanks very much for your time everyone, it is greatly appreciated. As I say, I love this game, the world, the questing, the exploration and especially the jumping puzzles!! Just need to find the right class to enjoy it and it is getting a bit frustrating, as I feel like I've put a lot of time into the game and not really gotten anywhere with it (as I keep replaying the same zones over and over!).

  8. #8
    Bloodsail Admiral Rhywolver's Avatar
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    You can still go to the mists and try all weapons and skills of each class at level 80, so you don't need to level each character until you get the better skills.

    Personally, I like to level up all weapons to find out which ones I like most. Warrior with Sword/Axe is what I'm playing most of the time, with the Rifle in the second slot if big things come at me. Ranger and Thief aren't bad either, although I have to say that I don't like those attacks that throw you back (or in case of the mesmer, even let you switch positions with an illusion).
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  9. #9
    Scarab Lord Karizee's Avatar
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    Yes, definitely go into the Mists (the crossed sword icon) to try your toon at max level with all skills and traits unlocked. Check out the different weapon combinations. Try it out on the target golems, there are roaming and knockback golems in addition to the stationary ones so you can test everything.

    I play Ele and find staff to be meh but have my hands full with scepter/dagger and dagger/dagger. I use all 4 attunements, specced into full Aracana so that even my dodges are abilities depending on the attunement I'm in.

    Ele damage does feel weak if you are not utilizing your combos correctly. With all the fields and finishers at your disposal, you are your own combo machine. Stack that shit up!

    http://www.mastodonte.fr/outils/tool-combo#en



    I just started a baby Mesmer so I haven't got too far into it yet, but you should be using your clones before your target dies, check out the shatter builds.
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  10. #10
    First thing is before you try to find a class to enjoy is that you have to get out of the idea that there are 60+ skills to use such as you are used to from other games. I believe that is holding you back from enjoying the game. If you cannot get over that then no class will satisfy you.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Doozerjun View Post
    First thing is before you try to find a class to enjoy is that you have to get out of the idea that there are 60+ skills to use such as you are used to from other games. I believe that is holding you back from enjoying the game. If you cannot get over that then no class will satisfy you.
    Unfortunately, you sound like I did when I played gw2. I preordered the game, got really excited about it, and just could not enjoy the classes. It just seemed repetitive. And the no mount thing was an absolute deal breaker. I get the quick travel, but I f'ing died a thousand times just trying to get from one heart to the next. It totally killed the experience. I quit after getting every class to about 20, 40 with my thief. Maybe you, like me, can't get over the hump with this one. I think some of the media hype is to blame. It's like some people wanted gw2 to be the wow killer so bad, and I stuck around way to long because of it. The game wasn't for me.

  12. #12
    kind of confused, why did you quote me?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Karizee View Post
    Yes, definitely go into the Mists (the crossed sword icon) to try your toon at max level with all skills and traits unlocked. Check out the different weapon combinations. Try it out on the target golems, there are roaming and knockback golems in addition to the stationary ones so you can test everything.

    I play Ele and find staff to be meh but have my hands full with scepter/dagger and dagger/dagger. I use all 4 attunements, specced into full Aracana so that even my dodges are abilities depending on the attunement I'm in.

    Ele damage does feel weak if you are not utilizing your combos correctly. With all the fields and finishers at your disposal, you are your own combo machine. Stack that shit up!

    http://www.mastodonte.fr/outils/tool-combo#en



    I just started a baby Mesmer so I haven't got too far into it yet, but you should be using your clones before your target dies, check out the shatter builds.
    I have tried Dagger/Dagger and Staff on the Elementalist, and found Staff to be better for levelling - the Dagger/Dagger was fun, but most of the moves were really short ranged, which ended up getting me killed a lot more.

    Regarding the Mesmer, I am aware that you need to shatter them, but usually it takes so long to get 3 illusions up (because the weapon skill to create one has a long-ish CD for example) that the mob is dead before I get 2 illusions. So it seems pointless using a 30 sec CD move to shatter 1 illusion for pretty poor damage. What I mean is that they should not disappear so readily (like a 10 sec timeout or whatever), so that you can keep them rolling and shatter when you get 3 or whatever. It just seemed really awkward that they would disappear immediately as soon as I dropped combat, even if I pulled another mob in like 1 second.

  14. #14
    You shatter for damage toward the end of the mob's life. If you want another effect (confusion, interrupt) then you have to time you shatters to use that at an appropriate time. You just can't spam the skills and expect to excel at the class (goes for any of the classes really).

    for dagger/dagger elementalist, you have to play it like you would a melee class such as a thief

    also your playstyle makes more sense as you tailor your traits and utility skills toward that playstyle. I echo the other posters suggestions and go into the heart of the mists and play various builds versus the npcs there.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Doozerjun View Post
    kind of confused, why did you quote me?
    I was quoting more the last line you used " if you can't get used to that, maybe the game isn't for you." Sorry for the confusion. I should have quoted that one line.

  16. #16
    You must not play gw2 like you play wow. That's the best advice I can give you. Reading your "issues" with classes it seems not to be the class itself but the game design that bothers you. I also play wow and generally speaking I use 6 main rotational skills and about 10 very situational CD's, and that's on most of my characters, Sure I have way more buttons than that to press but It's rarely needed. And all that 16 buttons makes me a very good tank or top dps.

    That said let's hop to gw2.
    Most classes you will have 15 skills to use. Exception to engineer and Elementalist with a few more.
    The combat is way more action than most MMO's out there so there isn't any rotation to be followed.
    Traits (even more as you level) play a great part on the build you use.
    Weapon swaps - Match 2 weapons that go with each other so you have better "combos". Use it well.
    Since the combat is more action and there is no rotation, the skill in this game is reaction times (Predicting moves and countering them with your skills) rather than "Follow rotation and organized positioning".
    For people who dislike being squishier I really advise playing with guardian, they have some good passive buffs (Including block).
    Keep in mind that we are all squishy in this game, your survival is up to you, your selection of gear/skill and reaction times. You can't run to an enemy and stand still pressing 10 buttons in rotation. All enemies will "tell you" when he's doing a big attack or special attack, be it by sound or animation. So pay attention to the enemy so you can react accordingly.
    Melee is "high risk, high reward" kinda deals (Specially in PvP settings and to some lesser extent PvE as well). If you want to play one be sure to know what you are doing (or else youre just meat). Mix CC's (to imob), Have a burst skill always ready, and stay moving at all times. I love playing Axe/axe on my Warrior slashing/criting everyone around. (But always keep a ranged weapon on your inv if not in the weapon swap)

    Yet, in PvE, due to there being no tank, I feel like I should be playing a melee class, otherwise I die so quickly, and I really dislike being squishy.
    Usually it's the other way around. With no tanks people tend to be ranged to stay away. Regardless you should be playing what you feel like, every class can be "tough" with the right Traits/Weapons/Utility (Some even unkill-able). It's all about synergy/dodge/selection and right use of traits/weapon choices/utility skills (Something you need to dwelve deeper into trait system to really understand). For instance I play a ranger with shortbow/axe+warhorn. I bet you I probably have more toughness (armor) than most of the warriors out there, I run a bleed/condition build that is rather tanky. Due to low vitality (hp) stats I'm more "open" to Condition Damages (that surpasses armor/toughness) so I run with my Pet bear which active skill purges a condition from me and allies, as well as my heal skill that also purges conditions from me. Even on my traits I swap according to fights (dungeons and stuff).

    Anyhow:
    The combat depth is there, you are just looking at the wrong way.
    Hope it helped, if you have more questions just ask.

    Edit:
    As for you mesmer problems. Again with traits can be remedied.
    There is a trait that allows you to leave a clone whenever you dodge, I think that alone will make your "clones" uptime quite bigger. There are also lower cooldowns on specific weapons distributed all over the Mesmer traits which should help with Skills that summons illusions. Also use the shatters wisely: If the mob is half way down and you do not have the "Mind Wrack" for damage, you could just use "Cry of frustration" to confuse the enemy and let him kill himself pretty much.

    Mesmers are one of the hardest classes to "start" and it really starts to shine after level 40 or so. But it's a class where it's best used when you know alot of "everything" else in the game. Due to it's high dependency on reaction of others skills and such.
    Last edited by Zilong; 2013-02-08 at 06:53 PM.

  17. #17
    Pit Lord philefluxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meledelion View Post
    Till what level did you play each class?
    Im not bashing the game here, but this is a irrelevant question when you can join PvP and see exactly what the class has to offer at max level. Furthermore because weapon abilities are gained within minutes you have a pretty good idea how a class is going to play within the first 5 levels if you are lucky enough to find enough weapons to check out the combos.

    My issue with this game is simply put the classes are boring because I have nothing to look forward to when leveling. Doesnt matter how far I've leveled, based on the game mechanics I can make this decision on any class relatively fast compared to other games. So the "what level did you play to" defense doesnt count in this game the same way it does in others.
    Last edited by philefluxx; 2013-02-08 at 07:08 PM.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by philefluxx View Post
    Im not bashing the game here, but this is a irrelevant question when you can join PvP and see exactly what the class has to offer at max level. Furthermore because weapon abilities are gained within minutes you have a pretty good idea how a class is going to play within the first 5 levels if you are lucky enough to find enough weapons to check out the combos.

    My issue with this game is simply put the classes are boring because I have nothing to look forward to when leveling. Doesnt matter how far I've leveled, based on the game mechanics I can make this decision on any class relatively fast compared to other games. So the "what level did you play to" defense doesnt count in this game the same way it does in others.
    Until you realize that a) not everybody goes into PvP to see what the class has to offer and b) utilities, elites, and traits (ie, things that require levels to unlock) can have a drastic change on your play style

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  19. #19
    My issue with this game is simply put the classes are boring because I have nothing to look forward to when leveling.
    In fairness, players get secondary skills over time as they travel/level in the game. Traits too, of course.

    Technically, "new" options are being doled out over the course of character progression.

    You just get your weapon skills fast really. Which can be boring, I admit. But the other stuff does come over time.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by philefluxx View Post
    Im not bashing the game here, but this is a irrelevant question when you can join PvP and see exactly what the class has to offer at max level. Furthermore because weapon abilities are gained within minutes you have a pretty good idea how a class is going to play within the first 5 levels if you are lucky enough to find enough weapons to check out the combos.

    My issue with this game is simply put the classes are boring because I have nothing to look forward to when leveling. Doesnt matter how far I've leveled, based on the game mechanics I can make this decision on any class relatively fast compared to other games. So the "what level did you play to" defense doesnt count in this game the same way it does in others.
    While I agree with you that unlocking the weapons (all weapons) can be done in fairly low level (about 5 levels or so) and it does show how it will be mainly played out for the rest of the game I will disagree with your pint on saying that it doesn't count in defense.

    For one new players will take quite a bit more time to understand how a class will be played out even by just unlocking the skills even more because of the combat design. Traits do have a pretty big impact into gameplay, also you only unlock weapon swap at 7 which also brings a whole new "depth" of combo (which even for not new players is something you won't master at level 7) then you have utilities at max potential at 20 and elite at 30. Not to mention the tier of Traits that are separated by levels: Tier 2 of Traits can only be used at level 40, and Tier 3 level 60. And as for playing new classes it will take way more than 10 levels (I would say at level 30 you start getting the grasp of it, only to master at later levels) of how to make synergy out of all these components (Weapons Choices/Weapon Swap/Utility/Heal/Elite/Traits). Suffice to say that for one to unlock/test (pve wise mind you) various "builds" the person would need quite an extensive amount of Skill Points to unlock everything.

    Sure, you can get instant level 80 on sPvP. But it would be wrong to assume even with all the tools provided there that you could actually learn what a Class can do for you there, tops you can test animations and play with boring AI (or static).

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