Modern Feminism - What's the deal?

[Austilias]

Why feminism needs to happen: Why is it okay for a girl to have a male role model, but not for a boy to have a female role model? Why is it an insult for a man to be feminine? Why is a strong, determined male a good thing, but when a female is strong and determined, she's called a bitch.
If you think men and women are ~perfectly equal~, you are so obviously ignorant, it's quite sad.

Take off the martyr's placard, and you get Egalitarianism;

belief in the equality of all people, especially in political, social, or economic life.

All the fun of equality with none of the bias!

[Dasffion]

Not rarely. Stop being so closed minded. Men & Women are perfectly equal in the world (generally), because nature never intended for either of the sexes to be the same, otherwise, we'd all be the same.

Men have a role in the world, women have a role in the world. Feminism has caused more issues for women then it has cured. It has created generations of young women who rebel, and will end up getting no-where because of it...

Who is close minded? You do realize without those young women who rebelled the Woman's place in the world would still be barefoot and pregnant in the Kitchen right? I'm not supporting what the women in the OP did and some feminists get crazy but if you think the world is and always has been equal you're incredibly close minded.

[Gamdwelf]

Who is close minded? You do realize without those young women who rebelled the Woman's place in the world would still be barefoot and pregnant in the Kitchen right? I'm not supporting what the women in the OP did and some feminists get crazy but if you think the world is and always has been equal you're incredibly close minded.

this was true of 1900 not 2013

[Grimbold21]

Maybe they want a female pope...?

[Hyve]

Not sure where you got that from. Statistics show that on average women get paid less for doing the same job. Not just being at the same company, that's nonsense, for doing the same job.

I'm not going to refute statistics if you can provide any, but in my own personal experience (of well over 60 women) they've all been paid less because they do less work, and they do different jobs, yet they always complained about less pay.

60 women is hardly a good test pool to go off, I know, but I'm only going off what I know is fact. Many of the women I've hired, worked with or known complain about their work loads and their pay, yet their male counterparts on average work longer hours and are more productive, hence the higher pay.

That doesn't mean this the case all over the world, and that in some places women are paid less, I know it happens, but it isn't as systemic as some people might think...

[marthsk]

Because women still get paid less than men, for doing the same job.
Because women still get blamed for getting raped, rather than the rapist.
Because women still get judged for their appearance and beauty, rather than their minds.
Because women can only be one body type, according to the media.
Because men think feminism doesn't need to be around anymore, that's why feminism still needs to be around. It's just women being 'oh it's so 1900's.'
No, women are still oppressed, and if you think that they are not, you're the reason why women are fighting for equality.

(and the video 'feminists' are extremists.)

1- That one has no justifiable excuse. Blame stupid old-school management of all levels.
2- Yet there are women feigning rape to get men in the slammer.
3- Just because you're admired for beauty doesn't mean you can't be admired for your brains. If anything, brains is a concealed weapon in this case. Non-issue. And if beauty is such a problem for women, they could, you know, stop showcasing it and refuse to participate in any activity related to that.
4- Like the media are reliable. Blame idiots altogether for this, not men.
5- Baseless conjecture. Feminism as it was intended to be has a reason to exist. Feminazism has no reason to exist as it is misguidance in its most grotesque form.
6- They're not nearly as oppressed as 70 years ago, or even further. You failing to realize that is the reason why you label all men as scum.

Also, equality between sexes will never be achieved as men are women are different both physically and mentally. Men are often more rational whereas women are more creative. Of course, a rule can't be a rule without exceptions, but you'd have to agree that those differences, and many more, are factual.

Plus, you're making no mention of these women wanting all the benefits, but deflecting all the responsibilities.

What I believe is that we can eventually come to terms with equivalence, rather than equality, because of those differences.

[Deleted]

Actually, I don't know why I bothered posting on this thread. Because most here, won't get it. They won't separate the extremists from the people actually trying to change. They won't get that feminism is not about making women better than men, it's about having women equal to men.
But of course, extremists like in the video, have tainted people's mindsets.

Why feminism needs to happen: Why is it okay for a girl to have a male role model, but not for a boy to have a female role model? Why is it an insult for a man to be feminine? Why is a strong, determined male a good thing, but when a female is strong and determined, she's called a bitch.
If you think men and women are ~perfectly equal~, you are so obviously ignorant, it's quite sad.

None of which are issues and you've clearly misunderstood them.

A positive influence can be a role model, regardless of sex.
It's not an insult for a man to be feminine.
Determined women aren't bitches. One could easily argue that determined men are bastards. Alas, not mutually exclusive to women.

[Deleted]

Actually, I don't know why I bothered posting on this thread. Because most here, won't get it. They won't separate the extremists from the people actually trying to change. They won't get that feminism is not about making women better than men, it's about having women equal to men.
But of course, extremists like in the video, have tainted people's mindsets.

Why feminism needs to happen: Why is it okay for a girl to have a male role model, but not for a boy to have a female role model? Why is it an insult for a man to be feminine? Why is a strong, determined male a good thing, but when a female is strong and determined, she's called a bitch.
If you think men and women are ~perfectly equal~, you are so obviously ignorant, it's quite sad.

Why call it feminism? Why not call it equality? Lets fight for equality instead?
Your argument "most here wont get it" is a cheap way out to avoid real arguments and real discussion.

Equality needs to happen. Not feminism...

[Lykke]

Then why is it called feminism instead of realism or something? It is fine for a boy to have a female role model. Ain't nothing wrong with being feminine but you may get confused for gay if you are just like a manly woman will probably be thought to be lesbian. Strong females aren't called bitches, bitches are called bitches because they are bitches.

Not sure, ask the people who started it?
And not really. If a boy puts up a poster of say, Hilary Clinton in his room, for his role model, it's going to be 'a little weird'. But a girl putting up a poster of Barrack Obama? Totally fine, no weirdness at all.

But you just confirmed my point... Being called gay (sadly) is still an insult. Even being confused for being gay, for some people, is an insult. A masculine girl isn't necessarily a lesbian, should could just be a tomboy. But any slight feminism in men, OH NO BAD.

What defines a bitch then? Tell me a strong female, who at some point hasn't been called a bitch for fighting for what she believes in.

[Deleted]

Who is close minded? You do realize without those young women who rebelled the Woman's place in the world would still be barefoot and pregnant in the Kitchen right? I'm not supporting what the women in the OP did and some feminists get crazy but if you think the world is and always has been equal you're incredibly close minded.

Yes but times change... Feminism was once extremely important, but there is very little need for it in today's society because there is pretty much gender equality in civilized countries.

I'm just trying to figure out how oppressed they must feel to go to these lengths... And what they must believe needs to change to make them stop.

[Dasffion]

this was true of 1900 not 2013

This was true in the 70s. Women are on more of an equal footing now but to say that they're exactly equal is pretty short sighted.

[Very Tired]

Seems a lot of feminism can be drawn to the confusion over men and women being the same, men and women being different, and men and women being equal.

[Grimbold21]

Why call it feminism? Why not call it equality? Lets fight for equality instead?
Your argument "most here wont get it" is a cheap way out to avoid real arguments and real discussion.

Equality needs to happen. Not feminism...

Cause it's not equality when you're fighting for the rights of only one group.

[Endus]

Why feminism needs to happen: Why is it okay for a girl to have a male role model, but not for a boy to have a female role model? Why is it an insult for a man to be feminine? Why is a strong, determined male a good thing, but when a female is strong and determined, she's called a bitch.
If you think men and women are ~perfectly equal~, you are so obviously ignorant, it's quite sad.

Most of what you're describing is that culture encourages certain gender roles. Not that said roles are inherently "bad". Each has baggage; the strong, determined male is also supposed to "man up" and repress emotional influences. Nor is it an insult for a man to be "feminine" any more than it is for a woman to be "masculine"; the insult is in breaking the typical gender role, nothing more, and such issues exist pretty much everywhere and independent of what those roles mean.

Yes, culture creates gender roles. It's like asking why girls = pink, and boys = blue. There's no real reason.

[Hyve]

Who is close minded? You do realize without those young women who rebelled the Woman's place in the world would still be barefoot and pregnant in the Kitchen right? I'm not supporting what the women in the OP did and some feminists get crazy but if you think the world is and always has been equal you're incredibly close minded.

Maybe the use of the word equal wasn't quite right, but I ask you, what is the problem with Men & Women having their roles in society and in the world? I'm not forcing women to remain in the kitchen, and be nothing more then housewives, but men and women are built (both mentally and physically) different, and a lot of the feminist movement is based on trying to bring equality where nature has made differentiation.

I'm not saying (again) that women should be locked into kitchens, but I was just talking with our CEO the other week, about how rare it was in his day, to have women being the victim of abuse. Of course it happened, but where more women are now in a male dominated environment, combined with their desire to rebel and pressure from nations to force more women in the work place, there is a backlash and that is causing issues.

I've used this example many times, as it is what is close to my heart, business. Last year a European Commission started to work on a law that would FORCE large companies, or companies that have earn a certain amount, or fit into a certain set of criteria, to have 50% of their board comprised of women. This is totally not acceptable to me, not because they're women, but because if a women in my company was good enough to be on the board, she already would be.

I would needed to have fired several hard working men, with families from the company to ensure the board doesn't get to large, and this would've been just as sexist, as I had to do it because they're men.

Women are not in a good position. As I've said, women do generally have less rights, but they have to earn them and that comes from growing up, sitting down at the table and talking. Running around with your tits out, trying to act like men, and being aggressive to the other sex, is not getting women anywhere, in a world still heavily dominated by Men in the top positions.

[Deleted]

Because women still get paid less than men, for doing the same job.
Because women still get blamed for getting raped, rather than the rapist.
Because women still get judged for their appearance and beauty, rather than their minds.
Because women can only be one body type, according to the media.
Because men think feminism doesn't need to be around anymore, that's why feminism still needs to be around. It's just women being 'oh it's so 1900's.'
No, women are still oppressed, and if you think that they are not, you're the reason why women are fighting for equality.

(and the video 'feminists' are extremists.)

Is this a troll post or what? ALL those statements are the exact same way with men.

Where are all the fat and ugly guys in commercials and media? Exactly... same place as fat and ugly women. Nowhere.
If a fat woman gets media attention she is a brave and awesome girl but a fat and ugly man who gets media attention is
an old disgusting pig and probably a pedophile.

The sexism towards men are actually as big of a problem as the one towards women. It is just more socially accepted.

[Gamdwelf]

Not sure, ask the people who started it?
And not really. If a boy puts up a poster of say, Hilary Clinton in his room, for his role model, it's going to be 'a little weird'. But a girl putting up a poster of Barrack Obama? Totally fine, no weirdness at all.

But you just confirmed my point... Being called gay (sadly) is still an insult. Even being confused for being gay, for some people, is an insult. A masculine girl isn't necessarily a lesbian, should could just be a tomboy. But any slight feminism in men, OH NO BAD.

What defines a bitch then? Tell me a strong female, who at some point hasn't been called a bitch for fighting for what she believes in.

Being called gay is insulting because its being identified as something you are not. Not because gay is somehow insulting to be, if you call a gay person gay they are like yes I am gay. People no matter what don't like to be identified as what they are not.

Maybe at a young age girls can be tomboy's but usually its not necessarily a good thing.

If you think all strong women are bitches that sounds like a personal problem.

[Lykke]

You do all realize Feminism is equality.
It is not women are better than men.

It's called feminism, because it's fighting for women's rights. Men have the rights, women just want the same ones.

And of course, there are always extremists. And they should be treated as all extremists are, ignored.

[Callimonk]

Feminism will be a "thing" until BOTH genders are treated as equal.

- Men should not be afraid to be "stay at home dads" for fear of social stigma.

- Men should not fear custody battles (though, numbers show that fathers who have fought custody battles still win as often as women - most seem to feel that it's not "worth it" because the woman would win anyway)

- Men should not be discriminated for being "metro" etc - just like women should not be discriminated for - as an example - playing video games.

Long story short: Feminism goes both ways, but there seems to be a delusion that it does not. It's there to try to break the social stigmas that both genders face. There are definitely wackos - but like with everything, there's always "that guy" (or gal) in a crowd that people remember but that doesn't actually represent the group as a whole.

[Gamdwelf]

Feminism will be a "thing" until BOTH genders are treated as equal.

- Men should not be afraid to be "stay at home dads" for fear of social stigma.

- Men should not fear custody battles (though, numbers show that fathers who have fought custody battles still win as often as women - most seem to feel that it's not "worth it" because the woman would win anyway)

- Men should not be discriminated for being "metro" etc - just like women should not be discriminated for - as an example - playing video games.

Long story short: Feminism goes both ways, but there seems to be a delusion that it does not. It's there to try to break the social stigmas that both genders face. There are definitely wackos - but like with everything, there's always "that guy" (or gal) in a crowd that people remember but that doesn't actually represent the group as a whole.

Then don't call it feminism.