[PVP]Why is it play frost or gtfo?

[FruitBat69]

Frost is fun and I'm aware for a lot of mages it is standard to play this spec each season. But why can we never play as fire or arcane? I don't play my mage in MOP since I dislike the way I am forced to play frost, hate having a pet and I'm not a huge fan of the level 90 talents (they feel like a restriction than a bonus) but that's another topic for another thread.

Other classes have more than 1 viable specs so why cant we have fire or arcane useful?

For those saying I'm talking nonsense here is 3v3 representation of specs. As you can see above 2.2k fire and arcane combined together have a 1.2% representation. Both of those together is less than HALF that of prot warriors.

[kyraka]

What?

Frost is the 5th most present spec there with 7.5%. And is more than double than disc + holy priests together, or ALL 3 locks specs together or ALL 3 rogues specs together.

I hate when I see mages complaining about PVP balances.

[FruitBat69]

What?

Frost is the 5th most present spec there with 7.5%. And is more than double than disc + holy priests together, or ALL 3 locks specs together or ALL 3 rogues specs together.

I hate when I see mages complaining about PVP balances.

1. I play a warlock.

2. Just because frost is always very powerful I don't see why the other 2 specs have to be terrible.

[Craif]

1. I play a warlock.

2. Just because frost is always very powerful I don't see why the other 2 specs have to be terrible.

I think he was confused when you said fire + frost was little represented, obviously you mean fire + arcane.

[FruitBat69]

I think he was confused when you said fire + frost was little represented, obviously you mean fire + arcane.

Apologies then for the typo, corrected now.

[Eihwaz]

Its not like at specs of a char should be equal pvp wise.

Atm there's two specs that are playable both in arena and BGs, you should be gratefull, some class are just plain sh** in pvp. (ps : I play a mage)

Also, taking into account numbers from only 2.2k+ is wrong. There's not even 5% of the population who can reach this, are you gonna buff or nerf a spec only according to less than 5% of the wow population ? That would be dumb.

[ManglolSA]

I used to play fire, got a lot of pressure from friends to go frost for arena etc. But I've decided I'm going back to fire after 5 months of just frost. Even though I really love frost right now, I've always enjoyed playing fire.

[Ryft]

Fire is actually OK once you learn it. The playstyle is enormous fun also.

Try it in 5.2 - the Scorch talent change effectively gives Fire PvP Mages a free new talent (PoM/IF/BS).

Arcane is a tricky beast in that its the biggest, glassiest cannon in the game, and seemingly innocuous changes can result in dominance....the 1st season of WotLK being a prime xample (S5 I think it was?).

Anyway, I think come 5.2 we will have 2/3 useable specs and thats pretty good.

[FruitBat69]

Fire is actually OK once you learn it. The playstyle is enormous fun also.

Try it in 5.2 - the Scorch talent change effectively gives Fire PvP Mages a free new talent (PoM/IF/BS).

Arcane is a tricky beast in that its the biggest, glassiest cannon in the game, and seemingly innocuous changes can result in dominance....the 1st season of WotLK being a prime xample (S5 I think it was?).

Anyway, I think come 5.2 we will have 2/3 useable specs and thats pretty good.

2/3 yes I'd say is something I'd be very grateful for in my class. I just find it slightly off putting its always frost though and none of the other specs get the same attension in pvp. I can't recall a season where fire or arcane was a better pvp choice than frost. Admittedly it used to be the inverted opposite in pve where frost was always crap and the other 2 specs dominated but MOP changed that or at least tried.

[booj]

Depending on your playstyle, fire is pretty much viable. They are even QQing on the official forums that Fire is scary in PVP because basically we can pretty much one shot people if we align all CC properly. I am playing Fire right now in RBGs and Arenas (though not at a high level) and I can say it's viable, at least for me. I can understand why it wouldn't for others that are used to frost.

In terms of arcane I can't say much because I haven't tried it and I haven't seen many people trying it either. I know though about some high rated players that made work and they are really melting everything in arcane. So you could argue that arcane is viable as well if you have the skills.

[Akraen]

I would like across-the-board PvP revamps to make control less important as a general rule. Then you can see a lot more variety in specs and more creativity in play.

[oplawlz]

The reason you seldom see fire in pvp is that frost is overpowered. All of your concerns can be addressed by a small nerf to frost.

[draconith1]

The problem is both fire and arcane have limited survivability, and far less control then frost. This is nothing new, frost has always been designed to allow you to survive longer and keep people locked down. Not that you cant do those things as fire (I dont know much about arcane pvp.) it's just far easier to do as frost. Think of it like this, your a healer on a 3's team, would you feel more comfortable with a frost mage who can easily peel off you from virtually anywhere in the arena and can survive until your able to get a heal off, or a fire mage, who's roots require them to be basically next to you in frost nova range?

[FruitBat69]

The problem is both fire and arcane have limited survivability, and far less control then frost. This is nothing new, frost has always been designed to allow you to survive longer and keep people locked down. Not that you cant do those things as fire (I dont know much about arcane pvp.) it's just far easier to do as frost. Think of it like this, your a healer on a 3's team, would you feel more comfortable with a frost mage who can easily peel off you from virtually anywhere in the arena and can survive until your able to get a heal off, or a fire mage, who's roots require them to be basically next to you in frost nova range?

Not only that but arcane/fire's damage is SO easy to predict and to render useless.

[nimryas]

I've seen some very nice pvp fire mages that got shinin' when MoP hit. Fire is a viable pvp spec nowadays, I agree on the fact that arcane is not (fuck 6 charges). The reason why frost is so popular is probably because it still has the insane burst/control that it has had since ever? And also the fact that most pvp'ers feel uncomfortable changing from a very controlling spec that is frost, to a really dynamic and different spec that is fire. Cannot really compare the two.

I personally tried out fire pvp in some random bg's and I must say its pretty fun. As long as you're backed up by a decent healer you can have some pretty fun moments. And i'm pretty sure you are able to setup some nice combo's on your own/with teammates to get a good combustion of and just destroy the player (check out hansol pvp video's).

Arcane is simply not viable because the freaking rampup time to 6 charges is too damn long! You would only have your mage bomb of choice, which would be NT in bg's I guess and barrage with maybe 2 stacks if you're lucky in arena's :')

[Dragon9870]

What?

Frost is the 5th most present spec there with 7.5%. And is more than double than disc + holy priests together, or ALL 3 locks specs together or ALL 3 rogues specs together.

I hate when I see mages complaining about PVP balances.

I hate when I see people constantly jumping on the "hate Mages" bandwagon just because we're good in 1v1.


OT: Fire's actually pretty good; Arcane however, like previous expansions, is not. You need to get a REALLY bad enemy team to succeed as Arcane, because once they know where you are, you're fucked.

[Redmage]

Look I play a Mage, and really, given that we have always been viable and better represented than some other classes put together... I don't feel we can complain.

[Orangetai420]

I hate when I see people constantly jumping on the "hate Mages" bandwagon just because we're good in 1v1.


OT: Fire's actually pretty good; Arcane however, like previous expansions, is not. You need to get a REALLY bad enemy team to succeed as Arcane, because once they know where you are, you're fucked.

We're good in more than just 1v1....

Say what you will about Mage QoL but Frost is extremely strong in every bracket. Fire can be strong in RBGs, we are better off than most classes.

[pkm]

Fire is viable. It's just that Frost is better. But fire is definitely a viable pvp spec in the right hands. If you watch some hansol videos you can see how if he aligns things correctly he can decimate almost anyone. Though the bulk of fire damage is from deep freeze. Dispel that and you can completely nullify fire burst.