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  1. #1

    Jab Nerfed Again :D

    Jab now costs 4.5% (was 4%) of base mana to use.


    This puts it at 13500 mana to generate one chi, and 10500 if you include the Tiger Palm mana return. Shit change, though the T30 talent changes (their scaling/base healing nerfs) didn't make it through by the looks of things.
    old mistweaver probably still better than u

  2. #2
    Dreadlord
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    Now that just sucks. This just proves they cant decide on what to do wiht monks.

  3. #3
    Blademaster Zendist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tatuin View Post
    Now that just sucks. This just proves they cant decide on what to do wiht monks.
    How does it prove that? They tested it, and apparently it didn't cost enough. So they upped the mana-cost.

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  4. #4
    Dreadlord
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    But wiht all the buffs and nerfs we recive all the time. and in the long run 13,5k mana is kinda much for just getting 1 chi

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Zendist View Post
    How does it prove that? They tested it, and apparently it didn't cost enough. So they upped the mana-cost.
    Doubtful, have you played mistweaver on the PTR? It's plain confusing
    old mistweaver probably still better than u

  6. #6
    Blademaster Zendist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tatuin View Post
    But wiht all the buffs and nerfs we recive all the time. and in the long run 13,5k mana is kinda much for just getting 1 chi
    But it's 1 chi for certain, unlike soothing mist, which is RNG.. Does that justify the 'high' mana-cost?

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  7. #7
    Dreadlord
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    what other class need to use that much of a resource to get 1 of their combopoints/chi/holy power?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Zendist View Post
    But it's 1 chi for certain, unlike soothing mist, which is RNG.. Does that justify the 'high' mana-cost?
    1.5% more mana and around 50k of healing isn't a fair trade off
    old mistweaver probably still better than u

  9. #9
    This is just ridiculous, Jab already costs too much mana.

  10. #10
    This is getting ridiculous. Now we're at a 50% increase (9,000 to 13,500) in mana cost from live to 5.2. Just to put it in perspective, it's now more than half the cost of Surging Mist and is only 7,950 mana less than a damn Spinning Crane Kick. In 5.2 it will be literally the dumbest thing you could ever do to Jab for Chi that is going to be spend on anything other than Tiger Palm or Blackout Kick, and you can't use those with Chi gained elsewhere because they'll simply do awful amounts of healing. I don't understand why they would simultaneously make getting Chi harder while taking away our options to use it effectively, at this rate Chi may as well not even be a thing and just have Jab enable usage of TP and BoK. I get that Mistweaver mana is very strong right now, but fundamentally altering how the spec works just to facilitate a nerf is silly.

  11. #11
    What bothers me the most with this buff-nerf-nerf cycle is that:
    - lvl 30 talents were given a CD but healing increased by 100% to 'compensate', and 2 weeks later on PTR (with better gear) they heal for considerably LESS than on live!
    - damage from TP/BOK increased by 200% but healing from special attacks cut by half, and a week later they also reduced healing from auto-attacks by half, and 2 weeks later the damage increase is ending-up being reduced and overall I suspect that's going to be another nerf!

    - We can read pages of explanations from Blizz on why they nerfed disc priests, what they based the changes on, and even telling them how they should now heal! But mistweavers ... not a line, not a word, like the future of monks was to PVP as a WW and that's it.

  12. #12
    Titan apepi's Avatar
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    Oh blizzard what are you doing? Heres what you should do bliz, Keep all the QoL things on the ptr, increase our fistweaving damage by some but not too much, keep chi wave/others(keep the changes to zen sphere mechanics though!) how it is. Mistweavers aren't that bad in pvp rn as you said these are the reasons you are making all these changes?
    Last edited by apepi; 2013-02-13 at 08:28 PM.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  13. #13
    Elemental Lord Teriz's Avatar
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    This is really confusing. Why make Jab more expensive at this point? Is Jab too powerful? Isn't the goal to have monks fistweave MORE not less?

    On PTR, I still don't have a reliable way to immediately restore several teammates. Shaman for example have Healing Rain, Chain Heal, Ascension, and HTT. Druids have Wild Growth, Swiftmend, Tree of Life, and Tranq.

    Revival, Uplift, and SCK suck in comparison. A sigificantly buffed Eminence would be an amazing help.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2013-02-13 at 09:06 PM.

  14. #14
    If I read some of the more recent Blue Posts right, TP will restore 2% Mana soon, so...

  15. #15
    High Overlord Mazor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    This is getting ridiculous. Now we're at a 50% increase (9,000 to 13,500) in mana cost from live to 5.2.

    The quoted part is mostly wrong, the increase to effective mana cost (the only thing that matters) is over 80%.

    Mazor.

  16. #16
    But Jab will now cost 18000 mana.
    old mistweaver probably still better than u

  17. #17
    Titan apepi's Avatar
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    Likewise, I wouldn't worry about the details of monk numbers, especially healing, too much yet. If you want to keep track however, here are recent changes: Mana cost of glyph of Uplift +21%, Mana cost of Jab +33%, Teachings of the Monastery now provides 2% mana to Tiger Palm, Reduced T15 4pc from -5 sec cooldown on Thunder Focus Tea.
    Wtf seriously?An increase of mana on uplift?It already cost so much....And they not wanting us to worry about the 'details? What do they want us to do ?Bury our heads in the sand? Increasing jab then increasing TP mana to alleviate that is fn insane. Are you fn kidding me? It Forces people who decide to use TP with jab whether they want to or not, not counting BcK does not give mana back.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazor View Post
    The quoted part is mostly wrong, the increase to effective mana cost (the only thing that matters) is over 80%.

    Mazor.
    It depends on what you mean by effective mana cost. Just Mana Tea? Mana Tea with Ascension? Mana Tea with just Tiger Palm? Mana Tea with Ascension and Tiger Palm? While I was speaking strictly about the mana cost listed, saying that someone is wrong, spitting out a number, and then not even backing it up is pretty silly, especially given my reputation at this point for the high importance I place on correct math.

    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    Wtf seriously?An increase of mana on uplift?It already cost so much....And they not wanting us to worry about the 'details? What do they want us to do ?Bury our heads in the sand? Increasing jab then increasing TP mana to alleviate that is fn insane. Are you fn kidding me? It Forces people who decide to use TP with jab whether they want to or not, not counting BcK does not give mana back.
    No idea who you quoted there, but is there a source for any of that? Would seem odd if none of it was datamined...
    Last edited by Totaltotemic; 2013-02-13 at 10:10 PM.

  19. #19
    Titan apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    No idea who you quoted there, but is there a source for any of that? Would seem odd if none of it was datamined...
    Ghostcrawler's own words.

    I made a post about it trying to get them to discuss it.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  20. #20
    High Overlord Mazor's Avatar
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    The case which will give you the lowest % difference is no Ascension with an average 3500 return from the chi (very low of course, picked for ease of numbers mostly) on live you have 5500 effective cost, on PTR you have 10000 effective cost, increase is just below 82%. Factoring Ascension (to both of course) means the increase is higher. Same for higher crit chance.

    Only by comparing current Jab->Tiger Palm (no innate mana return on Tiger Palm) to the PTR's version will you get an actual decrease to mana cost (with or without Ascension) then again it's a little bit comparing apples to oranges at that point, using Jab for Tiger Palm frequently isn't something you do for a major effect on live, but it might be in 5.2.
    There is a valid point about changing our current Jab for Chi Burst/Uplift/what have you into Jab for Tiger Palm, the effect of that on one's ability to sustain healing numbers remains to be seen.

    The core point remains, the strict mana cost increase in percentage is quite meaningless in a vacuum, thanks for the correction about different scenarios though.

    Mazor.
    Last edited by Mazor; 2013-02-13 at 10:20 PM.

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