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  1. #21
    It's 25 of the worlds strongest heroes equip with powerful weapons and armor they took from killing previous powerful enemies, hardly a " couple random guys with swords and stuff".

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Hyve View Post
    yet in Dragon Soul we saw nothing on the same level.
    didnt u ever get hit by "the final cataclysm" then?

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Thehealbus View Post
    It's 25 of the worlds strongest heroes equip with powerful weapons and armor they took from killing previous powerful enemies, hardly a " couple random guys with swords and stuff".
    They are still swords, and its not like our casters are more powerful either. Doesnt even 1hit one tiger in jadeforrest...

  4. #24
    Fluffy Kitten Rivin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Players would not need to drive those vehicles, they could be just supporting npcs. Also this setting would make boss fights more epic.
    Blizzard did a raid in a massive, open area filled with NPCs battling each other, with the players at the center of the fight. People didn't like that one either. (Hint: It was Dragon Soul.)

    Besides, we're meant to be the focus of the fights. We're the heroes. Having NPC assistance is okay, but you're talking about having them do all the heavy lifting (story-wise, if not in fight mechanics). And really, Blizzard does NPC assistance rather often. Maeiv and Akama in Black Temple, the Red Dragonflight in Eye of Eternity, Tirion in ICC, the Titanic Watchers in Ulduar, Kalecgos in Sunwell, the Aspects in Dragon Soul, the Klaxxi in Heart of Fear (even if they were all dead by the time we arrived)...

  5. #25
    Immortal mistuhbull's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Well yeah. But still same thing applies to wide variety of bosses, specially all dragons. For an example, why ragnaros just couldnt slam his hammer into all of us and be done with it?
    you ever stand under the hammer during the interphases? That's exactly what Raggy tried to do. We're just so small it's hard to hit us...kinda like ants
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Magpai View Post
    Because if they weren't weak enough to be killed, it would be impossible to defeat them. How fun is a raid boss that's designed to be unkillable?
    I agree. C'thun when he 1st came out was SO MUCH FUN!!!! *sarcasm*

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    They are still swords, and its not like our casters are more powerful either. Doesnt even 1hit one tiger in jadeforrest...
    Game mechanics don't equate to Lore. Simple as that.

    For the same reason that we can go back and solo Ragnaros in MC, or solo the Lich King, when storyline-wise no single human/orc/whatever should be able to do that, Deathwing has to be able to be defeated.

    What would the you have preferred the fight to be like? What would you want him to do to show his power, during a fight in which we all could still somehow win? If he just annihilates the whole group, then there's no point in us fighting him.

    How would you change the fight, so that you would be satisfied that he was powerful?

  8. #28
    Dreadlord Noah37's Avatar
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    I'm confused by the point of this threat, so are you saying we should not be able to kill any bosses ever and that instead everyone should just quit playing? Man, you should go into Game Design because you have a winner on your hands.

  9. #29
    Banned Viridiancity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivin View Post
    He was, but he needed to concentrate. He couldn't just wish the world gone and it would disappear in a puff of smoke. He spent the entire Madness fight trying to cast Cataclysm, but we kept breaking his concentration.

    Prior to getting shot with the Demon Soul, he probably didn't even consider us threats.
    Exactly. He gave zero fucks that we were fighting off his siege until we got Ultraxion down and Green Jesus shot him with the Dragon Soul, then he's like, "OH shit, I better get outta here", then we did it again, and he fell (interesting note, Thrall shot him the second time while we were on Deathwing's back. Nice.). Then, he began casting the Cataclysm again, but we hacked off his limbs. I mean, f a kick in the shin can stop a mage from casting a Frostbolt, imagine what losing an entire limb does.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Well yeah. But still same thing applies to wide variety of bosses, specially all dragons. For an example, why ragnaros just couldnt slam his hammer into all of us and be done with it?
    If you want a game that's impossible to beat go play Pac-Man.

  11. #31
    Stood in the Fire frigoffrick's Avatar
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    Forgot this isn't a game, oops.

  12. #32
    Epic! Duncanîdaho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivin View Post
    Blizzard did a raid in a massive, open area filled with NPCs battling each other, with the players at the center of the fight. People didn't like that one either. (Hint: It was Dragon Soul.)

    Besides, we're meant to be the focus of the fights. We're the heroes. Having NPC assistance is okay, but you're talking about having them do all the heavy lifting (story-wise, if not in fight mechanics). And really, Blizzard does NPC assistance rather often. Maeiv and Akama in Black Temple, the Red Dragonflight in Eye of Eternity, Tirion in ICC, the Titanic Watchers in Ulduar, Kalecgos in Sunwell, the Aspects in Dragon Soul, the Klaxxi in Heart of Fear (even if they were all dead by the time we arrived)...
    How do you know those mantid impaled at the entrance are Klaxxi? I assumed they were the mantid that we saved from fear with that special mask in the valley of four winds. They all say how shocked they are upon coming to their senses and that they must speak to the queen. I just figured they ended up getting their audience with her and now serve as a message. The Klaxxi seemed pretty smart, I doubt they charged in before us, considering they asked us to help in the first place. I've just never scene mention that's it's klaxxi specifically before.

    But yeah OP we always need help I don't really get what your saying. To add to Rivens list.... Ragnaros the second time around we needed three people to help us. Calen against Sinestra. The list is huge. Pretty much every major boss in the later raid tiers.
    The generalist looks outward; he looks for living principles, knowing full well that such principles change, that they develop. It is to the characteristics of change itself that the mentat-generalist must look. There can be no permanent catalogue of such change, no handbook or manual. You must look at it with as few preconceptions as possible, asking yourself, "Now what is this thing doing?" -Children of Dune

  13. #33
    Fluffy Kitten Fhi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivin View Post
    He was shot through the chest by a powerful magic artifact empowered by five dragon Aspects and wielded by the most powerful shaman in the world. He was then utterly annihilated by said artifact after the group of adventurers ripped off his armor and weakened him further. This is a case where you can't just ignore the story of how he was defeated.
    Deathwing's death is so far the only one I can think of that makes sense. Most other bosses suffer from that, "why didn't they just X and be done with it?". Gameplay doesn't play well with lore.

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  14. #34
    Herald of the Titans Bathory's Avatar
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    Because if Rag/Deathwing/etc hit the OP with a 1shot blow, we'd be hear the whining about how "hard" it is.
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  15. #35
    Warchief gutnbrg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Well yeah. But still same thing applies to wide variety of bosses, specially all dragons. For an example, why ragnaros just couldnt slam his hammer into all of us and be done with it?
    Dont know if you ever fought ragnaros or not, but he tries to smash us with his hammer over and over throughout the fight. We just use our skills to avoid it...

  16. #36
    The Patient kallekaka's Avatar
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    because its a game...

  17. #37
    It's a game, it's meant to be defeated in one way or another, I do agree there could be more to it and some more possible powerful npc's assisting us in the leaders/final bosses per tier like we saw with DS, you might not realize it but a lot of lore came with his death and how it happened before we just showed up But, again it's a game and it has its own set of logic.
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  18. #38
    Epic! Duncanîdaho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fhi View Post
    Deathwing's death is so far the only one I can think of that makes sense. Most other bosses suffer from that, "why didn't they just X and be done with it?". Gameplay doesn't play well with lore.
    I thought the Lich King was pretty well done too in regards to showing his power. The whole "Hey, you passed my tests, great! Now your mine bitch." blew my mind the first time it happened.
    The generalist looks outward; he looks for living principles, knowing full well that such principles change, that they develop. It is to the characteristics of change itself that the mentat-generalist must look. There can be no permanent catalogue of such change, no handbook or manual. You must look at it with as few preconceptions as possible, asking yourself, "Now what is this thing doing?" -Children of Dune

  19. #39
    Stood in the Fire frigoffrick's Avatar
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    As much as I am against this thread... think about Rag one shotting Domo... why doesn't he do that to the rest of us?

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivin View Post
    He was shot through the chest by a powerful magic artifact empowered by five dragon Aspects and wielded by the most powerful shaman in the world. He was then utterly annihilated by said artifact after the group of adventurers ripped off his armor and weakened him further. This is a case where you can't just ignore the story of how he was defeated.
    And then the unstable molten leftovers were blasted a third time after having his grip forcibly undone on the islands surrounding the Maelstrom and his head beaten into submission.
    Sometimes I think I should have rolled a Priest....


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