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  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonefury* View Post
    Some people claim it sometimes procs once, and sometimes 4 times during a 6 minute dummy period.
    Isn't that an inherent feature of RPPM system though? With no ICD and a very low chance to proc on every attack, there is always a possibility of several procs chaining in a row, or of a very long dry spell. You could get some rather bad luck with it (like I did on Council, Magaera and Durumu), it might be average and as expected (Primordius and Twin Consorts), or you could hit the jackpot and get it chain-proccing all the way (Horridon, Iron Qon).

    If there was any sort of a fix applied to this trinket, I haven't seen anything mentioned about it, and I certainly did not notice any change in its behaviour over the course of this week.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Requital View Post

    Stat Priority! Hit>Exp>Agi>Mastery>Haste to approximately 4-5K >Crit
    Mihir do Hit>Exp>Agi>Haste to approximately 7k>Mastery>Crit>Haste



    ..So my question is, who is the best? 5k haste seems to be low no?

    I don't know how i must do, please help

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Spamolol View Post
    Mihir do Hit>Exp>Agi>Haste to approximately 7k>Mastery>Crit>Haste



    ..So my question is, who is the best? 5k haste seems to be low no?

    I don't know how i must do, please help
    I'm kinda wondering the same. I've used simcraft (I think correctly), and it shows crit > haste > mastery. Although I've armoried a couple better geared/more progressed monks and one of them went crit > mastery > haste and the other went mastery > crit > haste. Both of which were at 4k haste or lower. it seems very unlikely to me that they wouldn't become energy starved at such low haste levels. Am I missing out on something here where I could be benefiting more from crit/mastery while being below the 5k haste I'm sitting at right now?

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spamolol View Post
    Mihir do Hit>Exp>Agi>Haste to approximately 7k>Mastery>Crit>Haste



    ..So my question is, who is the best? 5k haste seems to be low no?

    I don't know how i must do, please help
    Yes for me 5k haste is too low, personally i like 7k haste>mastery>crit>haste

  5. #125
    High Overlord Gulvan's Avatar
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    I cant remember where but there is a spreadsheet of % haste vs dps gained and the more haste we get the more dps we get, but the higher the haste until like 10k is only marginally better. I am going to run around 6.1k maybe even get to 6.5k haste, rest agil/crit today during heroics and see how that does.
    Host of Monkcraft Podcast and Co-Host of Groupquest

  6. #126
    The Lightbringer Requital's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gulvan View Post
    I cant remember where but there is a spreadsheet of % haste vs dps gained and the more haste we get the more dps we get, but the higher the haste until like 10k is only marginally better. I am going to run around 6.1k maybe even get to 6.5k haste, rest agil/crit today during heroics and see how that does.

    Here is the spreadsheet Rotund Windwalker Silliness 5.2

    Here are my thoughts on the subject, Last night I decided I wanted to get a real feeling of the Mastery vs Haste vs Crit argument, I beat on test dummies for hours using the same exact setup multiple times just to try to get some sort of feelings for the DPS levels. Pure Haste, Mastery or Crit there is very little difference between the three of DPS they do have a difference but just not a huge difference.

    Last night when we killed Lei Shin I went with the current build I'm using right now on my Armory that gave me a #1 US parse. Now my gear isn't that far behind the curve with 2pc or 4pc I could have been higher most definitely but I'm just not sold on 6K+ haste at this point.

    Going to keep doing some testing I just don't think at this time that Mastery vs Haste is that far off and I think you could even spec fully into crit and still perform fine.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-13 at 05:41 AM ----------

    Updated with all current gear and reforges.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
    Can you imagine if someone insulted you in a thread, you reported it, and I told you "sorry, wrong thread to be butthurt"?

  7. #127
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spamolol View Post
    Mihir do Hit>Exp>Agi>Haste to approximately 7k>Mastery>Crit>Haste



    ..So my question is, who is the best? 5k haste seems to be low no?

    I don't know how i must do, please help
    The main reason is that even if crit sims slightly higher on a patchwerk fight, the nature of the new mastery/TEB appeals to me a lot as you can fully apply those stats exactly at the moment you want them. This is especially true on a bunch of encounters in ToT that have periodic aoe-ing, like tortos, megaera hc, and lei shen.

    On those encounters you can build up TEB stacks during the singletarget phases and then unleash them all on the aoe phases. Playing this way puts monks at the top of the damage meter. On other encounters there's a strong buff/debuff that temporarily increases your damage done by a lot, like Jin'rokh (water) and Ji-Kun (feed). These also benefit greatly from mastery stacking.

    As I expect to be benched for the encounters monks arent great at (in favor of melee classes with raidcooldowns), I chose to optimize for these encounters, where monks can excel.
    Last edited by Mihir; 2013-03-15 at 04:38 AM.

  8. #128
    Moderator Alysmera's Avatar
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    To grow on that, Mihir, many encounters also have the bosses receiving multipliers that cause them to take additional damage - cracked shell on Horribledon, pools on Jinrokh, Primordius's buff thing, nutrient on Jinrokh, just to name a few. Actually, with 3.2% mastery, nutrient buff, and 10 stacks of mastery, I actually shot up the chart in a pretty silly fashion.

    Overall, though, I am noticing that with more gear I am doing exponentially better, personally. Hitting 7K haste and replacing my Relic has helped immensely; I actually felt like I contributed something to our raid rather than just being a mouthbreather.

  9. #129
    I will make a question here since its somewhat related to this topic.

    Regarding trinkets, in normal mode with Ilvl 490-500~ What should i use? Im using normal Bottle and Relic but im always worried when to replace this one
    Should i buy the valor one? will it last ? What about Renetaki's and Juju ? WHere do they stand in comparison to the ones i use?

    And what about the Sha- touched weapon? When should it be replaced? (using RF one) Is it okay until HC weapons ?

    Edit: just checked the main thread and saw Hakhu's trinket list it gives a nice idea of the trinkets, BUT my weapon question still stands if someone could answer me i would be very grateful.
    Last edited by Garmond; 2013-03-15 at 12:35 PM.

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by Garmond View Post
    I will make a question here since its somewhat related to this topic.

    Regarding trinkets, in normal mode with Ilvl 490-500~ What should i use? Im using normal Bottle and Relic but im always worried when to replace this one
    Should i buy the valor one? will it last ? What about Renetaki's and Juju ? WHere do they stand in comparison to the ones i use?

    And what about the Sha- touched weapon? When should it be replaced? (using RF one) Is it okay until HC weapons ?

    Edit: just checked the main thread and saw Hakhu's trinket list it gives a nice idea of the trinkets, BUT my weapon question still stands if someone could answer me i would be very grateful.
    The Valor trinket is vastly superior to Relic, and if you can time your TeB to use with that, it's awesome.

    If you have a LFR Sha-Touched weapon, even a new LFR weapon is better due to us scaling massively with weapon DPS rather than agility.

  11. #131
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garmond View Post
    I will make a question here since its somewhat related to this topic.

    Regarding trinkets, in normal mode with Ilvl 490-500~ What should i use? Im using normal Bottle and Relic but im always worried when to replace this one
    Should i buy the valor one? will it last ? What about Renetaki's and Juju ? WHere do they stand in comparison to the ones i use?

    And what about the Sha- touched weapon? When should it be replaced? (using RF one) Is it okay until HC weapons ?

    Edit: just checked the main thread and saw Hakhu's trinket list it gives a nice idea of the trinkets, BUT my weapon question still stands if someone could answer me i would be very grateful.
    The 500 agi gem is worth about 4 ilvls in the mainhand, and around 8 in the offhand. After adding those, take the 2 highest ilvl weapons you have and put the one with most weapon dps in your mainhand.
    Last edited by Mihir; 2013-03-15 at 05:00 PM.

  12. #132
    Is this BiS list still the correct one?

  13. #133
    The Lightbringer Requital's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rmy View Post
    Is this BiS list still the correct one?
    BiS lists are harder now because of TF gear so it will make them vary, For instance while those gloves are the best OS piece based on stats and 2 sockets I'm using Grips of Vampiric Cruelty. There are a few changes I want to make to it, As I find a Thunder-forged item I'll add it to the list so people know the option does exist.

    Currently the biggest issue I have with it is I think Hit and Expertise are a little light and I think I can find a few pieces of gear to better balance the need to reforge ito them. I'll give it another update today since I got new gloves last night I added them to the list.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
    Can you imagine if someone insulted you in a thread, you reported it, and I told you "sorry, wrong thread to be butthurt"?

  14. #134
    Awesome. Thanks

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by Requital View Post
    Currently the biggest issue I have with it is I think Hit and Expertise are a little light and I think I can find a few pieces of gear to better balance the need to reforge ito them. I'll give it another update today since I got new gloves last night I added them to the list.
    I personally hate items with Hit / Expertise on them because those are capped stats. If I'm not Hit / Exp capped, I can always reforge into them, but if I have too much, I can't reforge it all away and end up over cap. Anyways, with RoR, the non-Hit / non-Expertise secondaries on gear don't matter, because between reforging and gems, you'll be able to balance your secondaries for RoR.

    Does anyone else notice that some items have more total secondary stats than other items, even after you account for the socket? The Weapon DPS, Stam, and AGI on them are the same. Example:

    522 ilvl Wu-Lai, Bladed Fan of the Consorts:

    Red Socket (Socket Bonus: 60 AGI)
    372 Crit
    425 Haste
    Total secondary stats = 797

    522 ilvl Hand of the Dark Animus:
    Red Socket (Socket Bonus: 60 AGI)
    340 Expertise
    444 Haste
    Total secondary stats: 784

    Why does the first weapon have a higher stat budget than the second weapon, even though they have the same ilvl?

  16. #136
    The Lightbringer Requital's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeverStop View Post
    I personally hate items with Hit / Expertise on them because those are capped stats. If I'm not Hit / Exp capped, I can always reforge into them, but if I have too much, I can't reforge it all away and end up over cap. Anyways, with RoR, the non-Hit / non-Expertise secondaries on gear don't matter, because between reforging and gems, you'll be able to balance your secondaries for RoR.

    Does anyone else notice that some items have more total secondary stats than other items, even after you account for the socket? The Weapon DPS, Stam, and AGI on them are the same. Example:

    522 ilvl Wu-Lai, Bladed Fan of the Consorts:

    Red Socket (Socket Bonus: 60 AGI)
    372 Crit
    425 Haste
    Total secondary stats = 797

    522 ilvl Hand of the Dark Animus:
    Red Socket (Socket Bonus: 60 AGI)
    340 Expertise
    444 Haste
    Total secondary stats: 784

    Why does the first weapon have a higher stat budget than the second weapon, even though they have the same ilvl?
    I don't know why some items the same ilevel have different budgets I have to assume it's based on something internal blizzard uses to calculate individual values of stats. That being said I do agree that having too much expertise/hit is a bad thing but what I meant by that is if you can find gear that is very close to the Cap without reforging then you are in the right spot.

    Being able to say ok with no reforging I'm sitting @ 2600 expertise and I only need 2550 I can probably play with those stats and balance them out. However if you are at 2100 expertise and have to reforge out of crit/hit/mastery to get to 2550 that imo is a bad thing. What I really wish is there was a Mastery/Expertise gem as well of Hit/Mastery that would allow even more freedom.

    The new setup I just made is 2396 Expertise and 3213 Hit that is gemmed and enchanted with no reforge yet. While the Hit is a little on the high side there isn't much we can do blue sockets all have agi bonus so it's not really worth it to forego the Agi bonus.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
    Can you imagine if someone insulted you in a thread, you reported it, and I told you "sorry, wrong thread to be butthurt"?

  17. #137
    The greater the difference between 2 secondary stats on an item, the less total the item recieves. It's just a rule Blizzard has when budgeting items for some reason.

  18. #138
    Requial, both those gems exist :
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=76671 Keen Vermillion Onyx
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=76643 Sensei's Wild Jade

    So you can have that freedom

  19. #139
    The Lightbringer Requital's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miuh View Post
    Requial, both those gems exist :
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=76671 Keen Vermillion Onyx
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=76643 Sensei's Wild Jade

    So you can have that freedom
    Strange no one on my server I have found has that Keen gem, The Sensei's I'm already using. Anyway I redid all the reforging and it's pretty damn tricky with that Rune to get the optimal gains. Like for me I like playing around 5k haste but to maximize the rune I'm going to have to get use to playing with around 6500-7000 so that will take some time to adjust to my play style.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
    Can you imagine if someone insulted you in a thread, you reported it, and I told you "sorry, wrong thread to be butthurt"?

  20. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by Quotey View Post
    The greater the difference between 2 secondary stats on an item, the less total the item recieves. It's just a rule Blizzard has when budgeting items for some reason.
    I may be wrong about this, but I think it is the concept they use that lends to this. Instead of stating that an ilvl 522 item will have x amount of secondary stat rating and distributing that among the secondary ratings they wish, they state that an ilvl 522 item has X amount of points. Each secondary rating point costs points, and subsequent rating points costs increasingly more points. So going from 234 mastery to 235 mastery will cost more than 110 haste to 111 haste.

    That is why you see the disparity between items of the same ilvl. This is also very apparent if you compare an item with only one secondary rating to an item of the same ilvl that has two.

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