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  1. #1

    [Arcane] - Building up to six stacks.

    At any point while building up to six stacks (and hoping for 2x missile procs before AP/AT) so you ever want to use a proc if you have two BEFORE six? Or do you always want to sit @ max stacks until 6?

    Just trying to figure out where I can improve on dps.

  2. #2
    If I have two AM procs before I hit four stacks I'll usually use one of them because it isn't terribly unlikely that I'll get another either as or soon after I hit six.

  3. #3
    You shouldnt use them, just save them and wait. Its better to have a small chance of losing a proc than to use a proc on the way to 6, then have to fish for it before popping CDs.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by munchkin View Post
    At any point while building up to six stacks (and hoping for 2x missile procs before AP/AT) so you ever want to use a proc if you have two BEFORE six? Or do you always want to sit @ max stacks until 6?

    Just trying to figure out where I can improve on dps.
    That depends on your mana pool. If you are below 80% (somehow?) you'll want to drop at least one set of missiles. Ideally tho you want to go right into Arcane Power + Alter Time with 2 missile procs active already to max your burst output.

    However, given that Arcane is getting turned upside down and inside out in a matter of weeks I wouldn't really concern yourself with it too much since we'll have to sim out / learn a new priority with 5.2 anyway.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chareoss View Post
    I for one, do not agree with the choices they have made simply to keep people playing longer. The whole reason the drop rates are so low and loot is based on RNG is to keep us raiding longer and our subscriptions ticking.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Moohorn View Post
    That depends on your mana pool. If you are below 80% (somehow?) you'll want to drop at least one set of missiles. Ideally tho you want to go right into Arcane Power + Alter Time with 2 missile procs active already to max your burst output.

    However, given that Arcane is getting turned upside down and inside out in a matter of weeks I wouldn't really concern yourself with it too much since we'll have to sim out / learn a new priority with 5.2 anyway.
    How the fuck would you burn through 20% mana going from 0 to 6 AB stacks? Are we even playing the same game?

  6. #6
    Like imnick I usually une one because you'll get another one and you usually have to wait for your trinkets to proc.
    Made by mountandpetlover, big thanks !

  7. #7
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
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    If you're building into the Alter Time burst phase, don't spend Missiles as it might screw you over when you reach 6 charges. At any other time it's a good idea to use 1 Missiles proc if you have 2 when you hit 4 Charges.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by ogFrenikk View Post
    How the fuck would you burn through 20% mana going from 0 to 6 AB stacks? Are we even playing the same game?
    Phase transition or movement I'd guess...it was never mentioned the stacks were being build at the beginning of a fight.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ogFrenikk View Post
    How the fuck would you burn through 20% mana going from 0 to 6 AB stacks? Are we even playing the same game?
    I'm going to resist the urge to troll you and be a dick, even tho that's what your response merits.

    If, for example you weren't able to stand in your RoP, at all, for example. Note I said in parenthesis "(somehow?)"


    Quote Originally Posted by Chareoss View Post
    I for one, do not agree with the choices they have made simply to keep people playing longer. The whole reason the drop rates are so low and loot is based on RNG is to keep us raiding longer and our subscriptions ticking.

  10. #10
    thanks for the replies guys - awesome community

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Eihwaz View Post
    Like imnick I usually une one because you'll get another one and you usually have to wait for your trinkets to proc.
    In my experience its always better to save so you know you have it ready when you hit 6.

    In the worst case scenario this is what happens:

    My method (saving missiles)

    Spam AB to 6
    Reach 6 with 2 missiles
    All trinkets are up
    Pop CD macro

    Your Method(using a missile on the way to 6 if you get 2)

    Get to 3 stacks with 2 missiles
    Missiles once
    Reach 6 stacks
    All trinkets are running
    AB>scorch>Ab waiting for missiles
    Trinkets are running out

    Yeah it doesnt happen all the time where you take ages to get a 2nd, but it can happen, and you will get more burst out by using AT as soon as all procs are up to maximise Arcane Power with the procs.

  12. #12
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
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    That's why as I said above, when you're going for the Alter Time burst phase, you have to save the procs. In other cases it's acceptable to use excess Missiles earlier.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    That's why as I said above, when you're going for the Alter Time burst phase, you have to save the procs. In other cases it's acceptable to use excess Missiles earlier.
    And I didnt say that you were wrong

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by ogFrenikk View Post
    In my experience its always better to save so you know you have it ready when you hit 6.

    In the worst case scenario this is what happens:

    My method (saving missiles)

    Spam AB to 6
    Reach 6 with 2 missiles
    All trinkets are up
    Pop CD macro

    Your Method(using a missile on the way to 6 if you get 2)

    Get to 3 stacks with 2 missiles
    Missiles once
    Reach 6 stacks
    All trinkets are running
    AB>scorch>Ab waiting for missiles
    Trinkets are running out

    Yeah it doesnt happen all the time where you take ages to get a 2nd, but it can happen, and you will get more burst out by using AT as soon as all procs are up to maximise Arcane Power with the procs.
    This isnt the worst case. Worst case saving the missiles is : Trinkets do not procs, so you continue your usual rotation with 2 missiles, in the meantine your wasting possible AM procs due to the trinkets no proccing and you not using AM procs.

    In the end, I think the difference in pretty minimal, and you burst can be fucked up with both method. But the safer way is indeed saving procs, I just don't because not having 2 procs never happened to me.
    Made by mountandpetlover, big thanks !

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Eihwaz View Post
    This isnt the worst case. Worst case saving the missiles is : Trinkets do not procs, so you continue your usual rotation with 2 missiles, in the meantine your wasting possible AM procs due to the trinkets no proccing and you not using AM procs.

    In the end, I think the difference in pretty minimal, and you burst can be fucked up with both method. But the safer way is indeed saving procs, I just don't because not having 2 procs never happened to me.
    Its super rare my trinkets + lightweave haven't proced on my way to 6 stacks, 99% of the time I'm ready to pop CDs upon hitting 6. But yeah you're right, the difference is minimal

  16. #16
    Don't use any missiles coz u risk loosing ur trinkets' uptime during ur arcane power/alter time burn in case u dont get the 3rd proc. For the record, I had sessions with no AM procs for almost half a minute. And also, I had sessions with essense of terror not proccing for a good minute after the pull (and no, I didn't re-equip it or whatever - so it was definitely not on cooldown)

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by ogFrenikk View Post
    Its super rare my trinkets + lightweave haven't proced on my way to 6 stacks, 99% of the time I'm ready to pop CDs upon hitting 6. But yeah you're right, the difference is minimal
    They usually pop but sometimes my 2nd trinket doesnt proc right away.

    And if your trinket proc DURING alter time, the buff disappear when AT finished. So your proc is wasted, it happened to me sometimes so now i'm never poping AT if one trinket ICD is finished and hasnt proc'd yet.

    (I'm really pissed when it still happen, not tracking my trinkets ICD 100% of the time)
    Made by mountandpetlover, big thanks !

  18. #18
    Used to happen to me all the time when I first specced arcane hehe, I made sure to make my ExtraCD nice and large after a few wasted LotC procs

  19. #19
    are you using tell me when ' to know when your trink proc up

  20. #20
    Bloodsail Admiral spaace's Avatar
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    TellMeWhen works really, really good if you take the time to learn it.

    WeakAuras is also just as good.
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