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  1. #201
    Kinda hope they don't fix that. Would be kinda nice for pvp having an extra 25% dmg on TV.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by lazymangaka View Post
    I would gladly give up a major glyph spot to a glyph removing Avenging Wrath's graphic.
    Vs decent players that would do nothing tbh. They would know it was up through addons or just looking at your player frames.
    You're right except for 2 things.

    1. My name is spelt "God" not "Loucious-sama".
    2. I'm not a man, because man is inherently flawed. I am in fact a being so far beyond your comprehension that archaic constraints like flesh, blood, time and consequently, gender, have no meaning to me.

  3. #203
    "We like our recent change to a lower cooldown on Avenging Wrath for Retribution in PvP. We like it so much that we want to make it a baseline change for Retribution and not a set bonus, since many PvE paladins are benefiting from shorter wings today, and our recent DPS testing suggests that Ret needs a DPS buff. However, this does mean changing the existing T14 4pc PvE bonus. "

    Back to the old days then. T14 4p becomes 10% dmg on seals and judgement so its boring as all heck but who cares, we will swap it out in 5.2 anyway so a flat dmg buff works.
    Last edited by Chettor; 2013-02-20 at 07:38 AM.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    There is a name you could use: retcarried cleave.
    I totally will use that name when I come back to WoW during 5.2

  5. #205
    I am Murloc! Alenarien's Avatar
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    GC has yet to fix Ret PvP, naturally. Our issue is much less to do with damage (which seems to be the only thing getting buffed beyond a magic dispelling Hand of Sacrifice with a benefit-negating CD) and more to do with self-healing/gap-closing. DK's can Death Grip, Warriors can Charge, Rogues can Shadow Step/Cloak and Dagger/Hit and Run, Monks can Roll/Flying Serpent Kick, Druids can Feral Charge/Displacer Beast. Paladins have only slows and speed boosts, among other issues such as easily counterable damage; though at this point i'm honestly just thinking they should assign specific teams to each class because at the moment, GC has no idea.
    The first thing I remember about the world — and I pray that it may be the last — is that I was a stranger in it.” - Malcolm Muggeridge, Apologia pro vita sua (1968)

  6. #206
    Paladin (Forums / Skills / Talent Calculator)
    We like our recent change to a lower cooldown on Avenging Wrath for Retribution in PvP. We like it so much that we want to make it a baseline change for Retribution and not a set bonus, since many PvE paladins are benefiting from shorter wings today, and our recent DPS testing suggests that Ret needs a DPS buff. However, this does mean changing the existing T14 4pc PvE bonus.

    So the list of changes reads like this:
    Retribution has a two minute cooldown on Avenging Wrath baseline.
    We are reverting the PvP set bonus change. The Retribution set bonuses remain as they are on live. This line will no longer appear in patch notes.
    We are changing the T14 4pc PvE bonus to +10% damage on Seals and Judgment. We want you to graduate to the T15 set bonus fairly quickly and you won't be losing the shorter Avenging Wrath cooldown.
    Retribution damage was too low, but as I mentioned above, we buffed it through more frequent use of Avenging Wrath.

    So they just changed ret's wings back to 2 minute cd baseline, and gave our 4set bonus back (1 holy power per 8 seconds if attacked). Discuss.

    Also, about the new Seal of Justice they added, it was a good idea and should've stayed in, but trading our slow for it would've been too much. Oh well, I'll miss half shotting Monks in duels without CDs :/
    Last edited by jeffeh1213; 2013-02-20 at 11:50 AM.

  7. #207
    Warchief Velshin's Avatar
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    To be honest at the moment I will be so happy if they just flat buff our sword of light passive to be 15% increase dmg of using two handed weapon so just a flat 5% overall dmg will be good. It will not be so op and at the same time it will fix our sustain dmg.

  8. #208
    the main issue with the paladin as a class and retribution in addition that it wants to be everything, a warrior priest and running like a rogue at the same time. I despice the spec as its generally frustrating to fight against. You guys got 3 cc`s allready, + immunities + freedom. There is a reason the class is in a state as it is, they think youre on the edge of being too powerfull or whichever way one looks at it

  9. #209
    Warchief Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solonor View Post
    the main issue with the paladin as a class and retribution in addition that it wants to be everything, a warrior priest and running like a rogue at the same time. I despice the spec as its generally frustrating to fight against. You guys got 3 cc`s allready, + immunities + freedom. There is a reason the class is in a state as it is, they think youre on the edge of being too powerfull or whichever way one looks at it
    Sorry but I disagree with you really...where do you get the 3 cc from? we only have hammer of justice which is 1 min cd and 30 secs cd if you get it talented + blinding light which is 2 mins cd where is the third cc now? taking rep as ret is out of the question since it has a long cast time and can be easily interrupted by all classes.

    our immunity divine shield is only last for 8 secs and 2 of the most popular classes can remove it which is warrior and priest and it's cd is 5 min. The other immunity is only from physical dmg hand of protection which you will have a debuff forbearance 1 min whenever you use DS or Hop.

    What we have atm is just super burst which is easily any decent pvper will cc you to the death the moment you pop up your cds...other than that outside of our cds our dmg is nothing really so weak...Yes we have good mobility with clemency talent but what is the use of good mobility if your dmg is sooo sooo weak outside cds compare to other classes hm?
    Last edited by Velshin; 2013-02-20 at 02:59 PM.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by Solonor View Post
    the main issue with the paladin as a class and retribution in addition that it wants to be everything, a warrior priest and running like a rogue at the same time. I despice the spec as its generally frustrating to fight against. You guys got 3 cc`s allready, + immunities + freedom. There is a reason the class is in a state as it is, they think youre on the edge of being too powerfull or whichever way one looks at it
    You forgot to mention our stealth : That's the reason why you can't see us in RBGs

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by jeanbono View Post
    You forgot to mention our stealth : That's the reason why you can't see us in RBGs
    +1 for you sir, LOL.

    Solo just looks like he read some class abilities out of the spell book and thought, "hmm wow Rets OP huh". Totally ignored the reality of Ret being bottom tier PVP class. I can't quite fathom any class that would find a Ret "frustrating" to fight against. Maybe warlocks?

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Solonor View Post
    the main issue with the paladin as a class and retribution in addition that it wants to be everything, a warrior priest and running like a rogue at the same time. I despice the spec as its generally frustrating to fight against. You guys got 3 cc`s allready, + immunities + freedom. There is a reason the class is in a state as it is, they think youre on the edge of being too powerfull or whichever way one looks at it
    Thank you for summarizing all of the stereotypes and misconceptions that have left Ret wallowing in mediocrity for the vast majority of this game's existence. There rest of your post is a bit confusing so I can't comment, it's hard to tell if you're agreeing that Ret is close to being too poweerful, or just perceived that way by scrubs.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-20 at 04:57 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Booniehat View Post
    +1 for you sir, LOL.

    Solo just looks like he read some class abilities out of the spell book and thought, "hmm wow Rets OP huh". Totally ignored the reality of Ret being bottom tier PVP class. I can't quite fathom any class that would find a Ret "frustrating" to fight against. Maybe warlocks?
    Didn't you know? Ret is balanced around the opinions of random bg players and their struggle to learn basic PvP tactics... such as "zomg may be I should save a defensive CD for when someone with angel wings, an ashbringer, and a giant glowing guardian is coming at me."
    Last edited by Tangra; 2013-02-20 at 05:01 PM.

  13. #213
    Didn't they just say that all Paladin specs are getting Avenging Wrath on a 2 min cool down, and that Rets 4 set is getting redesigned? That's a pretty big buff to me.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Dukenukemx View Post
    Didn't they just say that all Paladin specs are getting Avenging Wrath on a 2 min cool down, and that Rets 4 set is getting redesigned? That's a pretty big buff to me.
    AW 2min is Retribution only "Retribution has a two minute cooldown on Avenging Wrath baseline. GC."

  15. #215
    Warchief Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dukenukemx View Post
    Didn't they just say that all Paladin specs are getting Avenging Wrath on a 2 min cool down, and that Rets 4 set is getting redesigned? That's a pretty big buff to me.

    It will be 2 mins for ret only as a baseline. What piss me off the most is that now...just NOW blizzard admiting that " Retribution damage was too low, but as I mentioned above, we buffed it through more frequent use of Avenging Wrath." From Blizz blue post

    Really? now they noticed? the retri community players been saying that since MoP Release and beta...I mean I can understand if it's at least 1 week or 2 after release of MoP to give them enough time to see the results of retri dmg overall in pvp and pve heroic raiding but took them over 4 months to start to do some changes? really?....typical Blizzard approach when it comes to retri paladin spec...

  16. #216
    The Patient Prometheous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    It will be 2 mins for ret only as a baseline. What piss me off the most is that now...just NOW blizzard admiting that " Retribution damage was too low, but as I mentioned above, we buffed it through more frequent use of Avenging Wrath." From Blizz blue post

    Really? now they noticed? the retri community players been saying that since MoP Release and beta...I mean I can understand if it's at least 1 week or 2 after release of MoP to give them enough time to see the results of retri dmg overall in pvp and pve heroic raiding but took them over 4 months to start to do some changes? really?....typical Blizzard approach when it comes to retri paladin spec...
    And they "fix" it by giving us the one thing we dont want. I dont believe many rets even care about having one less minute to wait for wings, we want to be useful outside of our wings.

    The easiest solution is to buff sheath of light to give us the old 2h weapon specialization buff and/or to bring censure scaling up with AP and haste or just a 3-5% buff to it's base damage.

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  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by Prometheous View Post
    And they "fix" it by giving us the one thing we dont want. I dont believe many rets even care about having one less minute to wait for wings, we want to be useful outside of our wings.

    The easiest solution is to buff sheath of light to give us the old 2h weapon specialization buff and/or to bring censure scaling up with AP and haste or just a 3-5% buff to it's base damage.
    So true all we what is damage out side of cd our burst ain't even that grate when compared to othere classe , seems the only choice is to go holy in 5.2 if we dont get damage out side of cd sad but true

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    It will be 2 mins for ret only as a baseline. What piss me off the most is that now...just NOW blizzard admiting that " Retribution damage was too low, but as I mentioned above, we buffed it through more frequent use of Avenging Wrath." From Blizz blue post

    Really? now they noticed? the retri community players been saying that since MoP Release and beta...I mean I can understand if it's at least 1 week or 2 after release of MoP to give them enough time to see the results of retri dmg overall in pvp and pve heroic raiding but took them over 4 months to start to do some changes? really?....typical Blizzard approach when it comes to retri paladin spec...
    Since MoP? More like since Cata. The spec is at a complete loss. I've switched to Holy/Prot as I couldn't be bothered dealing with the ups and downs are playing a dps. Ret needs an overhaul and or a revert to wrath model or something. And I just read that DK's are receiving a significant buff. GG

  19. #219
    Warchief Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Sausage View Post
    Since MoP? More like since Cata. The spec is at a complete loss. I've switched to Holy/Prot as I couldn't be bothered dealing with the ups and downs are playing a dps. Ret needs an overhaul and or a revert to wrath model or something. And I just read that DK's are receiving a significant buff. GG
    Haha yeah I know the spec is never good at all...the last time it was decent it was durning TBC and in Wotlk it was so faceroll and OP durning pre Wotlk and first season of wotlk... but what I meant since MOP because in MOP in fact it got worse than it was in Cata.

  20. #220
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    Haha yeah I know the spec is never good at all...the last time it was decent it was durning TBC and in Wotlk it was so faceroll and OP durning pre Wotlk and first season of wotlk... but what I meant since MOP because in MOP in fact it got worse than it was in Cata.
    Rets single target actually isn't bad. Our Aoe is atrocious tho and any fight with 2+ targets we look half retarded on.

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