Dungeons & Dragons 4e advice

[Tankitbetter]

Update 2/25
Looks like I'm DM'ing. My monk, who was fighting on a 4-square wide icy bridge that the DM railroaded us to, rolled a nat 1 on his acrobatics check. He fell off the bridge and died. No chance to save myself. My teammates, including a telekinetic psion, couldn't respond. Just a death despite having an obscene acrobatics check. Fuck this.
___
Old post:

I don't know which character to play! My thief unfortunately met his death at the hands of some vampires last week and I'm transitioning in to a controller to help balance out our party.

I've narrowed it down to two choices (links are to pdf character sheets):

Larias, the Eladrin Bladesinger:

Pros

• At-will ranged 10 conditions including possibility of prone, grants CA, slow, or slide 3
• Exceptional nova - Bladesong -> Fey step which grants MBA -> MBA with Standard -> Action Point MBA -> next turn use daily -> MBA as minor action.
• Much tankier between built in more AC and HP with a +3 AC for entire encounter once per day

Cons

• No true AoE other than Lightning Ring
• Melee in a group already heavily melee
• Has consistent control but control is "soft" control - no dazes, stuns, etc.

Or Larias the Tiefling Wizard:

Pros

• Extremely accurate vs NAD
• Sleep gives -4 to the first roll, giving 65% chance for them to fail first roll. Instantly trivializes 1 fight per day
• Much more AoE - Beguiling Strands is a 25 square area and pushes 5 squares
• Ranged in a group that is mostly melee

Cons

• Much weaker defenses
• Much less damage
• Absolutely no Nova possibilities
• Attacks are reliant on the DM to play fairly (saving throws, monster making attacks via charms)

That last con in Wizard is my #1 fear. I'm afraid that the DM will cheat. I don't have very much trust for this DM as he has been known in the past to fudge rolls - a lot - and if my enemies make every saving throw and always miss themselves then I am useless. This is a DM that I used to DM for and I know for a fact that he is viewing this as a chance to try to get power over me. Some of the rolls that involved in my Thief dying were very questionable and that night he gloated about it and he has gloated about it several times since.

Anyway, thoughts would be great.

[Gamdwelf]

don't play with that DM is my best advice.

[Sealbinder]

I wish I could help you more on this. I am a huge DnD fan and I have played since early 2nd edition. I just can't give you any advice on 4e. I found it to be borderline unplayable and it destroyed all that I found enjoyable from previous incarnations of DnD. If you want any suggestions for 2nd or 3rd I would be happy to help you out.

[Tankitbetter]

don't play with that DM is my best advice.

Not an option unless I want to DM. The whole point of this campaign, however, is to give me a break from DM'ing. It's my first time playing in ~8 years.

[Deleted]

Moved to VG Discussion.

[Tankitbetter]

D&D isn't a video game...

[Gamdwelf]

Moved to VG Discussion.

Why dungeons and dragons is not a video game?

[Sunseeker]

IMO: you should always play what you want to play. Do these characters actually interest you, or are they just a set of numbers? While 4e is probably the edition that emphasizes combat statistics more than any other, it's still an Role Playing Game. If the character is just a role or a statblock to you, just pick whichever you find to be statistically better. If it's actually a character you're interested in RPing, then that's something you should consider.

I know people love power building, I do it myself. But it really kinda takes the wind out of an RPG if you're only G-ing.

---------- Post added 2013-02-18 at 12:17 PM ----------

Why dungeons and dragons is not a video game?

Maybe he thought he meant the MMO?....ya know, cause none of these races or classes are available in that game.

[Radux]

Moved to Fun Stuff since D&D isn't a video game.

To address the question:

Go with Wizard if you're interested in Optimization. Wizard are the bane of a DM's existence if played correctly (i.e. you better hope you prepared the right spells that morning/extended rest). Incredible controllers. This becomes especially true once you get past Heroic levels. Early leveling usually sucks for Wizard, but isn't as bad if you have a well played + sticky Defender.

[Deleted]

Why dungeons and dragons is not a video game?

It's not? I thought it was. ._.

Hold on, I'll ask a mod to change it then.

Nvm, Radux already did.

[Tankitbetter]

This thread is an OT whore. 3 forums so far.

---------- Post added 2013-02-18 at 07:20 PM ----------

IMO: you should always play what you want to play. Do these characters actually interest you, or are they just a set of numbers? While 4e is probably the edition that emphasizes combat statistics more than any other, it's still an Role Playing Game. If the character is just a role or a statblock to you, just pick whichever you find to be statistically better. If it's actually a character you're interested in RPing, then that's something you should consider.

I know people love power building, I do it myself. But it really kinda takes the wind out of an RPG if you're only G-ing.

I build the character first then the roleplay after. They both intrigue me and I'd like to play both of them.

[schwarzkopf]

Advice to OP, play Pathfinder D&D went off the rails with 4e.

[Tankitbetter]

Moved to Fun Stuff since D&D isn't a video game.

To address the question:

Go with Wizard if you're interested in Optimization. Wizard are the bane of a DM's existence if played correctly (i.e. you better hope you prepared the right spells that morning/extended rest). Incredible controllers. This becomes especially true once you get past Heroic levels. Early leveling usually sucks for Wizard, but isn't as bad if you have a well played + sticky Defender.

The problem is I can only be a good bane if the dm allows it. I'm quite afraid that the DM will cheat.

---------- Post added 2013-02-18 at 07:21 PM ----------

Advice to OP, play Pathfinder D&D went off the rails with 4e.

If you want an edition war, go elsewhere.

[Gamdwelf]

Moved to Fun Stuff since D&D isn't a video game.

To address the question:

Go with Wizard if you're interested in Optimization. Wizard are the bane of a DM's existence if played correctly (i.e. you better hope you prepared the right spells that morning/extended rest). Incredible controllers. This becomes especially true once you get past Heroic levels. Early leveling usually sucks for Wizard, but isn't as bad if you have a well played + sticky Defender.

Yeah I mean if the DM is really out to get him like he thinks, He might want to go for a character that has a better chance of surviving. That or just be really careful early levels until he becomes awesome.

but like a previous poster said play a character that is going to be fun and interesting. I'm currently playing in a modified 2nd ed as a gnome cleric that can't use armor or weapons. Our campaign now has an unofficial name "The Epic of Binwizzle" because that is my character's name.

[Venziir]

It's not? I thought it was. ._.

Hold on, I'll ask a mod to change it then.

Nvm, Radux already did.

Well there are D&D video games, but nah, when talking about D&D in general it's the PNP game.

[Tankitbetter]

Yeah I mean if the DM is really out to get him like he thinks, He might want to go for a character that has a better chance of surviving. That or just be really careful early levels until he becomes awesome.

but like a previous poster said play a character that is going to be fun and interesting. I'm currently playing in a modified 2nd ed as a gnome cleric that can't use armor or weapons. Our campaign now has an unofficial name "The Epic of Binwizzle" because that is my character's name.

Mostly this. The problem with the Wizard is that the power of the character is not in my hands. The DM rolls the saving throws. The DM rolls the attacks that I force him to do.

[Radux]

The problem is I can only be a good bane if the dm allows it. I'm quite afraid that the DM will cheat.

You control the field. That's your job, whether by creating zones of immobilization, pushing enemies, stunning big bad guys, etc. If he's cheating rolls, by saying you're not hitting, you need a new DM. Period.

The idea is to help control the battle field. Either by keeping them away from the Party, helping the Defender's stickiness, help move monsters into position for a Nova from the Striker, etc.

Being smart within the rules is fine. If your DM is obviously breaking rules. You guys need to restructure. Otherwise no one is going to have fun.

Mostly this. The problem with the Wizard is that the power of the character is not in my hands. The DM rolls the saving throws. The DM rolls the attacks that I force him to do.

Whoa whoa whoa... your DM does... all the rolls?

[Gamdwelf]

Mostly this. The problem with the Wizard is that the power of the character is not in my hands. The DM rolls the saving throws. The DM rolls the attacks that I force him to do.

Wait what? Why? you don't get to do your own rolls? That's fucked. tell him no.

[Sunseeker]

The problem is I can only be a good bane if the dm allows it. I'm quite afraid that the DM will cheat.

Then really the first comment was spot on. Don't play with that DM.

I may fudge something here or there when I DM, but it's usually for my players benefit. If you can't beat your players within the rules(and 4e is pretty darn flexible in that regard), don't DM. Shit I mean as DM you're not even supposed to be against your players, your goal is to challenge them and if they fail, so be it. But you're not supposed to TRY to make them fail, especially be cheating.

If you want an edition war, go elsewhere.

Quite.

[Gemini Sunrise]

Wait what? Why? you don't get to do your own rolls? That's fucked. tell him no.

You usually roll the damage (for a Fireball for instance), and the DM rolls the saving throws. I do it like that just because it's easier for me to go through them, as I have the enemies' saving throws handy.