Fury or arms for arena?

**m1mastershake30** · 2013-02-20, 05:25 AM

Hi. My 2v2 is me as resto druid and my friend as fury war. Our 3v3 is me as mage, the fury war, and disc priest. I've been wanting him to try out arms for a while but would be too long or waste of conquest points to try atm. So we'll have that chance in 5.2 to be able to get him a weapon. So I was wondering, what are the advantages of arms and fury, and which would be better?

**Adudu** · 2013-02-20, 08:00 AM

Arms gets significantly more colossus smashes off which gives more burst which is happy fun times in arena.

**Daani** · 2013-02-22, 01:37 PM

Arms Is Always Better and will stay ahead with Sudden Death procs that fury can't benefit from and the damage increase in the 6 sec CS window Arms Will always be ahead of fury.

**Flawless101** · 2013-02-22, 01:44 PM

Arms. Any one capable of dispelling enrages will put you up a creek without a paddle. It's probably not as bad as it used to be thinking more on it, but Sudden Death is massive.

**Daani** · 2013-02-22, 02:10 PM

Sudden Death Is Huge lIke said Fury Warrior Without Enrage is worthless no raging blow no dps.GG

**Riecheck** · 2013-02-22, 03:31 PM

It's not only the Sudden Death procs but also the Mortal Strike healing reduction. If you use the Overpower glyph to increase it by 20% damage after cleave then it will stack very well with C.Smash.

Fury Pros vs Cons
Pros
x2 Weapon enchants
Extra healing through Bloodthirst
Bladestorm hits twice as much
I also feel like you can get more hits in the CS window than you could with arms. (Flurry + Bloodsurge procs)
Deal more damage as Enraged (Proc'd by CS, Bloodthirst, Berzerker Rage)

Cons
No Mortal Strike to reduce healing on target
Enraged can be dispell, spell stolen, tranquillized, CC'd until the short 6sec buff wears off. (If zerker rage is used)
Not as many C.Smashs due to not having Sudden Death
No sweeping strikes to increase spread damage
No Taste for Blood for heavy Heroic Strike fillers (changes in 5.2)

I know theres a lot more, these are just some I could think of right off. Hope this helps with your decision a bit more.

**Roguezor** · 2013-02-22, 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by Riecheck

It's not only the Sudden Death procs but also the Mortal Strike healing reduction. If you use the Overpower glyph to increase it by 20% damage after cleave then it will stack very well with C.Smash.

Fury Pros vs Cons
Pros
x2 Weapon enchants
Extra healing through Bloodthirst
Bladestorm hits twice as much
I also feel like you can get more hits in the CS window than you could with arms. (Flurry + Bloodsurge procs)
Deal more damage as Enraged (Proc'd by CS, Bloodthirst, Berzerker Rage)

Cons
No Mortal Strike to reduce healing on target
Enraged can be dispell, spell stolen, tranquillized, CC'd until the short 6sec buff wears off. (If zerker rage is used)
Not as many C.Smashs due to not having Sudden Death
No sweeping strikes to increase spread damage
No Taste for Blood for heavy Heroic Strike fillers (changes in 5.2)

I know theres a lot more, these are just some I could think of right off. Hope this helps with your decision a bit more.

For your con list i would like to remind you of Mortal Founds from Wild Strike which reduces healing just like Mortal Strike

Other than that it's good.... But yeh, I'm a warrior that never really liked arms. So i'm playing fury in both pve and pvp (mostly pve tho).
And i have to say; TG as fury with Heroic starshatter (dubble uppgraded) in main hand OWNS!! Since the pvp power from 2 handers is unique you don't really need/want 2x pvp weaps, and since pve weapons is a lot higher ilvls (atleast if HC/uppgraded)... yeh, do the math ;D

**pkm** · 2013-02-22, 03:47 PM

Like everyone said your warrior going fury is just gimping your team. I guess the only reason to go fury it's really fun to play.

**Riecheck** · 2013-02-22, 04:20 PM

Roguezor - Thanks for the input I guess I forgot about that.

I mentioned in another post but if your Fury you can use a single 2hander and a single 1hander to gain both PvP powers from each weapon since each is unqiue to 1 or 2 handers but you lose the SMF/TG bonuses so only do it with PvP weps for the power. Trust me the PvP Power makes up ten-fold for the missing SMF/TG bonus lose.

Going with a PvE wep as your offhander is a great idea though, PvE weps generally have higher dps.

**Daani** · 2013-02-22, 05:26 PM

Well I don't See how any pro or fury will out do Arms if enrage can be removed fury is pointless, not enraged no Raging blow procs which is a chunk of the dps lost.

**Riecheck** · 2013-02-22, 05:35 PM

Well, I'm fairly certain that once you get an enrage buff you gain raging blow. If enrage is removed you still have the charge of a raging blow regardless. There would not be as much dps lost except the situation where enrage is removed before the RB's charge can be used with it.

**Daani** · 2013-02-22, 05:37 PM

yes but even if you get your raging blow off the rest of the 5 seconds you will lose damage for not being enraged its a overall dps loss and the difference between a kill and a heal at times.

**pkm** · 2013-02-23, 12:08 AM

Furys dps is not raging blow it's enrage. When going for dps a fury warriors main priority is to have as much uptime on enrage as possible. However arms doesn't have to worry about this since they have sudden death procs.

**Kankipappa** · 2013-02-23, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by pkm

Furys dps is not raging blow it's enrage. When going for dps a fury warriors main priority is to have as much uptime on enrage as possible. However arms doesn't have to worry about this since they have sudden death procs.

Doesn't matter in reality though. Colossus refreshes so rarely as Arms on PvP, purely due to low uptime if you're against casters and god-cc teams. Maybe it's better on BG if you need to target switch and colossus just by luck pops up again. It's like you would need to hit shockwave anyway to do any damage inside colossus so 20 seconds on both actually aligns quite well. If you're a player that won't "plan ahead" then maybe Arms will come out as superior for sure..

**pkm** · 2013-02-23, 12:31 AM

Same thing will effect fury. No uptime on target = no blood thirst = no enrage procs.

Only thing you will have to rely on then is zerker rage.

**thisnamesucks** · 2013-02-23, 12:40 AM

Originally Posted by Riecheck

Fury Pros vs Cons
Pros
x2 Weapon enchants
Extra healing through Bloodthirst
Bladestorm hits twice as much
I also feel like you can get more hits in the CS window than you could with arms. (Flurry + Bloodsurge procs)
Deal more damage as Enraged (Proc'd by CS, Bloodthirst, Berzerker Rage)

Cons
No Mortal Strike to reduce healing on target
Enraged can be dispell, spell stolen, tranquillized, CC'd until the short 6sec buff wears off. (If zerker rage is used)
Not as many C.Smashs due to not having Sudden Death
No sweeping strikes to increase spread damage
No Taste for Blood for heavy Heroic Strike fillers (changes in 5.2)

List has some stuff wrong. Enrage cannot be spell stolen or dispelled only de-enraged, Sweeping strikes is useless, fury has an MS effect. More cons: Deep wounds is going to hit like a truck for arms increasing dps off target or spread dmg through tclap, the "cs window" is damn near 100% for arms, and just plain not as much damage in short uptime windows that arms has.

Correct me if im wrong but fury is much more rage and enrage dependent than arms which is a big crutch in pvp.

**m1mastershake30** · 2013-02-23, 06:09 AM

Thx for the advice ^_^

**Redmage** · 2013-02-23, 06:17 AM

The reason fury isn't as good is because its damage isn't controllable and can be shut down too easily (enrage dispel). Arms can line up their burst for the right moment, fury can't. And in pvp when you don't have 100% uptime on your target you need to know you can do damage when the time comes.

So even though in PvE fury wipes the floor with arms in dps its more about HOW they do damage in pvp.

**Daani** · 2013-02-23, 01:13 PM

I wouldn't go as far as fury wipes the floor with arms at top end gear fury does performe better but not that much. Pvp there is not really enough sustained damage or controlled damage with fury to make it viable.

**Equivocator** · 2013-02-23, 04:02 PM

I play arena as Fury and much of what has been said is relatively true, although I will contest the enrage dispelling issue. Mainly because everyone talks about it that because it CAN be removed it always will be. There aren't many classes that can remove it (only druids, hunters and rogues). On my rogue shiv is a 10 sec CD and the amount of times I've wanted to remove the enrage effect but removed the berserker rage effect instead is annoying, plus, using paralytic poison (which the majority of rogues do) my shiv is used as a peel (root effect) and not for removing enraged effects. As for druid and hunters well i haven't played them for long enough to pass comment, but, applying pressure and CC's will dictate whether or not they can or will prioritise actually removing the enrage effect or not. Coming up against a hunter and druid combo will sure hurt your ability to play, but then, how is that any different to being a lock coming up against 2 rogues?

People also talk about the low chance of being enraged which I find strange. If I were grouped with a mage I'd have just shy of 52% chance to become enraged with Bloodthirst alone (which is roughly one every 2). If i proc enrage from my first thats 6 seconds up. If i fail on the second I have a 1.5 sec overlap and therefore have 3 secs not enraged. That amounts to 66% up time (assuming always on target) that does not include chance to proc from colossus (although there could be overlaps again) nor the chance to proc from berserker every 30 secs nor the abilities which increase your crit chance (Windsong because you duel wield and have a second enchant) nor does it include recklessness (which the CD is being reduced in 5.2) nor does it include Skull banner. Seriously, i spend the vast majority of my time (on target) as enraged and given that, any classes attempting to remove enrage all the time would seriously be wasting GCDs attempting to do so and therefore reduce their own DPS/HPS.

Thirdly, thanks to all the arms rotational nerfs, Fury for 5.2 has lost nothing and gained everything. Increased haste value, increased deep wounds damage, reduced recklessness CD times, free wild strikes on bloodsurge procs (this massive, we can fit more abilities into a C-smash than arms AND ensure mortal wounds debuff is up) bladestorm being immune to disarms (should be fury choice of talent imo). Because of the scale of changes to arms and the positive effect to Fury DPS the Devs had planned to reduce RB damage and Bloodthirst damage but have decided to hit execute instead. That's perfect for PvP fury, we don't want 200k execute hits in pvp, we only want enough to hit the button once and land a kill.

5.2 is going to bring the gap between arms and fury even closer and i can say that for 100% certaintity (based on current changes). As for which will be better? Who knows, will be fun trying.

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