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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Tangra View Post
    Casters are already dominating PvP
    Buffs to rogues, rets, dks and monks while warriors will still be viable. I'm sure casters are dominating...

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-23 at 01:15 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by masteryuri View Post


    Monks are still going to be shit next season- I wonder when will people realize this. Maybe when they will see the monk pvp population stsill be 0.1%? Our "buffs" are now getting reverted every day. Ring of peace is a waste of a talent, paralysis lasts so little is useless, tygereyebrew got instant nerfed ages ago, spinning fire blossoms nerfed, spear hand strike nerfed for NO reasons.
    I can't wait for you to be horribly wrong and see all the monks dominating like crazy

  2. #42
    If any of you only played a monk...
    Spear Hand Strike silence being 4 seconds is a necessity to pressure a healer at all.

    Monks don't have burst, they don't have gap closers, they don't have a mechanic to ensure the opening lands, they don't have powerful openers or meaningful attacks without building up Chi first, our only reliable slow is a hamstring, unlike baked-in, slows tied to attacks like all the other classes and many of our spells have positional requirements.


    What 5.2 brings is:

    Baseline range on Paralysis.. which acts as gap closer (+1) but nerfed duration on positional requirement. (-1)
    Mastery increasing damage of Tiger Brew, which acts as a pseudo-burst cooldown. (+1)
    The option to trade an AoE Stun for an AoE disarm, can't get both. (0)
    A Nerf to Chi Wave, 15 second cooldown, does same damage and healing as live. (-1)
    Nimble Brew (+1).
    SHS Silence nerfed to 2 seconds without removing the positional requirement. (-1)

    So for a class blizzard said needed much work and help, 3 buffs and 3 nerfs? really?


    Yo.. At least they could take away the facing requirement if they want it to be 2 seconds.. like, man, it's hard to silence a healer running away from you spamming loltard instant heals while you're rewarded for your movement finesse and leg work with.. a 2 second silence...

  3. #43
    For the love of god. WW Monk is pretty much the least played class/spec in pvp 5.1. Do you guys think that is a coincidence, or is there a reason behind why so few people decide to even PvP with a WW monk? What about arenas? Why is WW monk the most underrepresented class in high end arena rankings? Coincidence? Can we all agree that monks need something more than what they already have to become more balanced? Thanks.
    OT, on paper, I can understand how people think that monks blanket silence looked OP, but in reality WW monks have been blessed with it since release of MoP, and still sucked. Now, all these glorious buffs we were promised are slowly turning into nerfs. No WW monk with half a brain will dump a 5 sec aoe stun with 45 sec cd for our supposedly new imba talent - ring of peace. If we look at what monks actually are getting next patch, the new cleave ability looks meh. New mastery looks decent, but you have to sacrifice some of the dps (stacking mastery instead of crit for example) in between charging up 10 stacks. To summarize, how the 5.2 changes actually affect the ww monk is:
    *Less ranged DPS because of spinning blossom nerf
    *A cleave ability that will be used rarely
    *Worse survivability because of healing nerfs
    *Less melee DPS in between tiger eye brews, more DPS (for 10 secs) during tiger eye brew
    *A cc-breaker on 2 min cd
    *A cc that cant be dispelled, that more often will be used as a gap closer rather than controller due to duration nerf and unreliable positioning requirements.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Veliane View Post
    If any of you only played a monk...
    Spear Hand Strike silence being 4 seconds is a necessity to pressure a healer at all.

    Monks don't have burst, they don't have gap closers, they don't have a mechanic to ensure the opening lands, they don't have powerful openers or meaningful attacks without building up Chi first, our only reliable slow is a hamstring, unlike baked-in, slows tied to attacks like all the other classes and many of our spells have positional requirements.


    What 5.2 brings is:

    Baseline range on Paralysis.. which acts as gap closer (+1) but nerfed duration on positional requirement. (-1)
    Mastery increasing damage of Tiger Brew, which acts as a pseudo-burst cooldown. (+1)
    The option to trade an AoE Stun for an AoE disarm, can't get both. (0)
    A Nerf to Chi Wave, 15 second cooldown, does same damage and healing as live. (-1)
    Nimble Brew (+1).
    SHS Silence nerfed to 2 seconds without removing the positional requirement. (-1)

    So for a class blizzard said needed much work and help, 3 buffs and 3 nerfs? really?


    Yo.. At least they could take away the facing requirement if they want it to be 2 seconds.. like, man, it's hard to silence a healer running away from you spamming loltard instant heals while you're rewarded for your movement finesse and leg work with.. a 2 second silence...
    Stop duelling healers and start playing 3v3 where you dont have to kill a healer all by yourself and your "problems" will be solved.

  5. #45
    Banned Korgoth's Avatar
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    Revert the gag order nerf or remove all silences!

  6. #46
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veliane View Post
    If any of you only played a monk...
    Spear Hand Strike silence being 4 seconds is a necessity to pressure a healer at all.

    Monks don't have burst, they don't have gap closers, they don't have a mechanic to ensure the opening lands, they don't have powerful openers or meaningful attacks without building up Chi first, our only reliable slow is a hamstring, unlike baked-in, slows tied to attacks like all the other classes and many of our spells have positional requirements.


    What 5.2 brings is:

    Baseline range on Paralysis.. which acts as gap closer (+1) but nerfed duration on positional requirement. (-1)
    Mastery increasing damage of Tiger Brew, which acts as a pseudo-burst cooldown. (+1)
    The option to trade an AoE Stun for an AoE disarm, can't get both. (0)
    A Nerf to Chi Wave, 15 second cooldown, does same damage and healing as live. (-1)
    Nimble Brew (+1).
    SHS Silence nerfed to 2 seconds without removing the positional requirement. (-1)

    So for a class blizzard said needed much work and help, 3 buffs and 3 nerfs? really?


    Yo.. At least they could take away the facing requirement if they want it to be 2 seconds.. like, man, it's hard to silence a healer running away from you spamming loltard instant heals while you're rewarded for your movement finesse and leg work with.. a 2 second silence...
    As a mw I would rather 5.1 for arena then 5.2. I can't of any reason why a dps would want me over another healer coming next patch.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by saltyharbls View Post
    Stop duelling healers and start playing 3v3 where you dont have to kill a healer all by yourself and your "problems" will be solved.
    Last time I heard that was when Rets were asking for an interrupt, we've come a long way since then yeah?

    Your statement would hold ground if there weren't classes who could duel healers AND kill them by themselves my friend.

    OH WHAT, you think that's broken?? I agree with you! but go argue that with Blizzard while you're benched because someone else can do your job better.

  8. #48
    Mechagnome Mr. Casual's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Again, the proliferation of instant cast heals and absorbs in the game practically forces the necessity of blanket silences. If casters were forced to cast again, this wouldn't be an issue.
    boom thats the answer i agree with

    i have played monk since i bought MOP and i think the positional requirements kill monks and are really annoying, there is already enough things to monitor in areans but to also have to make sure when u roll to a healer or dps that you can get behind them to land your silence or paralyze full duration or even at all, its is annoying. Or when you have to aim ur roll and serpent kick precisely to make sure ur close enough to land ur slow or be able to get behind when range are zig zagging/kiteing is super annoying and something that needs to be looked at. Its something that pisses me off especially when every other class has mindless gap closers silences and cc. Either give more classes abilities with positioning requirements/ aim abilities or dont put them in.

    imagine if mages needed to be behind the target to get a deep or warrior charge worked like leap too
    Last edited by Mr. Casual; 2013-02-23 at 04:11 PM.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Veliane View Post
    Monks don't have burst, they don't have gap closers, they don't have a mechanic to ensure the opening lands, they don't have powerful openers or meaningful attacks without building up Chi first, our only reliable slow is a hamstring, unlike baked-in, slows tied to attacks like all the other classes and many of our spells have positional requirements.
    Quote Originally Posted by Veliane View Post
    Monks don't have burst, they don't have gap closers, they don't have a mechanic to ensure the opening lands, they don't have powerful openers or meaningful attacks without building up Chi first
    Quote Originally Posted by Veliane View Post
    Monks don't have burst, they don't have gap closers
    Quote Originally Posted by Veliane View Post
    they don't have gap closers
    Wait, really?

  10. #50
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by masteryuri View Post
    4seconds if YOU ARE FACING YOUR TARGET AND IF YOU ARE IN MELEE RANGE.
    Monks gap closers are fucking ridicolous too, we have no targeted gap closer, we just have to hope our opponent is a retard and can't sidestep.
    Mages cs:
    Ranged- check
    no positioning required - check.
    60%/86% (if glyphed) longer cooldown -check.
    requires you to be in LoS - check

    Lock silence:
    ranged - check
    no positioning required -check
    used by a PET - check
    requires the correct pet to be alive - check
    requires pet to be in LoS - check
    60% longer cooldown - check
    only lasts 3 seconds - check


    Monks are still going to be shit next season- I wonder when will people realize this. Maybe when they will see the monk pvp population stsill be 0.1%? Our "buffs" are now getting reverted every day. Ring of peace is a waste of a talent, paralysis lasts so little is useless, tygereyebrew got instant nerfed ages ago, spinning fire blossoms nerfed, spear hand strike nerfed for NO reasons.
    Alright, this is just bullshit, but lets complete that list. And just saying, the LoS part is a big one as healers don't tend to stand in the middle of the arena.
    And really, for some reason I think you ain't seeing it, but spear hand strike is an interrupt, the blanket is just a bonus.

    Honestly, what would you say if they gave rogues a 4sec blanket on kick, or gave warriors gag order back? Oh yeah right, they can pressure healers on their own, making it completely overpowered. Guess what, PvP is a team thing, not a solo thing. Even if you can't deal a lot of pressure to healers, you can always team up with someone that can.

    Sure the monk population is low, but it's not a reason to allow them go live with completely overpowered skills. And just saying, the monk population (all brackets) has gone up to 2.6% already. While still low, it's slowly increasing and will likely see a decent increase in arena participation once the new season begins.

  11. #51
    Brewmaster willtron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helltrixz View Post
    gtfo, you shouldn't even have it in the first place.
    how did you figure that one out? Or are you just sore that you bursted a monk when they popped ToK?
    Velcro. What a rip off.

  12. #52
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    Alright, this is just bullshit, but lets complete that list. And just saying, the LoS part is a big one as healers don't tend to stand in the middle of the arena.
    And really, for some reason I think you ain't seeing it, but spear hand strike is an interrupt, the blanket is just a bonus.

    Honestly, what would you say if they gave rogues a 4sec blanket on kick, or gave warriors gag order back? Oh yeah right, they can pressure healers on their own, making it completely overpowered. Guess what, PvP is a team thing, not a solo thing. Even if you can't deal a lot of pressure to healers, you can always team up with someone that can.

    Sure the monk population is low, but it's not a reason to allow them go live with completely overpowered skills. And just saying, the monk population (all brackets) has gone up to 2.6% already. While still low, it's slowly increasing and will likely see a decent increase in arena participation once the new season begins.
    So now they actually can kill and pressure people this needs a nerf but when they couldn't it was fine?
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  13. #53
    I could make the case that kick lost its blanket silence the same patch spear hand strike gained it.

    I don't know why a kick with the same cooldown as all interrupts needs a free silence attached. It looks like more a way of differentiating the move and making monks the "best" at kicking, without any actual balance concerns.

    And with monks as poor as they have been in pvp, honestly, it's not like the move has been tested much.

  14. #54
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    So now they actually can kill and pressure people this needs a nerf but when they couldn't it was fine?
    It was never fine, it was just less of a problem since you didn't see monks at higher ratings.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovan View Post
    Wait, really?
    Roll is for escape, 250% speed boost in a straight line, breaks slows.
    If you try to use it for closing a cap you'll get sidestepped and feel special as you can't steer, assuming you don't go 6 yards past your target and get re-slowed.

    Flying Serpent Kick is also more of GTFO than CHARGE! but it does work fine to get in. Yeah sorry that's no gap closer, no class in the history of wow ever had a problem getting in by itself, staying in is the issue.

    Warriors have 100% uptime.
    DKs, Shamans, Rogues and Ferals all have passive snaring and high uptime.
    Retribution has uptime in the form of Movement speed, certain degree of immunity to slows and strong ranged attacks.

    Monks have disable which can be parried and dodged...................
    Last edited by Veliane; 2013-02-23 at 04:28 PM.

  16. #56
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    It was never fine, it was just less of a problem since you didn't see monks at higher ratings.
    So now they actually have a chance to be good you go ahead and nerf it, gg.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    So now they actually have a chance to be good you go ahead and nerf it, gg.
    It should have been nerfed in beta already. When only 0.5% in high ranked arena is monks, you'll rarely ever see a monk so it's not much of a deal, when the class is getting buffed so hard you'll see a decent amount of monks, it's going to be a problem. It's overpowered, you just meet so little monks that people care little about it.

    When you play 100 high rated games and meet 2 monks, you simply don't care about it if they have something overpowered. If you suddenly get to meet 30 monks in 100 games, then you actually start caring about it.
    Be honest, if only 0.5% of the players were pre nerf hunters, you'd likely still see the stampede bug going on. If 0.5% were warriors, they'd still be oneshotting people.
    With increased popularity, unbalanced abilities become more of a problem, it's just like that.

  18. #58
    Bloodsail Admiral Avada Kedavra's Avatar
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    Its getting nerf'd for a reason. You cant compare it to the Spriest silence. Speer strike is on a 15 second CD with a Blanket silence in addition to the interupt. Spriests is on a 45 SECOND CD

    ppl need to stop bitching and comparing spells that ARE TOTALLY DIFFERENT -

    its not a nerf, you still get a silence, its just not as OP now.

  19. #59
    Lmao at all these monks QQ about there silence being nerfed... You guy have more stuns than rogues so just chill out. The I ly casters dominating arena are shadow priest an mages so anyone saying warlocks need to be nerfed more is just being ignorant to the facts.

    Blanket cs was reverted because most healers don't even have to cast to heal so a blanket cs helps in getting them behind and actually having to cast.

    The way things are looking next season it's going to be melee dominant just like the last one hunters monks and rogues oh my. Any melee can just chill out and enjoy your easy glad or duelist titles.

  20. #60
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    It should have been nerfed in beta already. When only 0.5% in high ranked arena is monks, you'll rarely ever see a monk so it's not much of a deal, when the class is getting buffed so hard you'll see a decent amount of monks, it's going to be a problem. It's overpowered, you just meet so little monks that people care little about it.

    When you play 100 high rated games and meet 2 monks, you simply don't care about it if they have something overpowered. If you suddenly get to meet 30 monks in 100 games, then you actually start caring about it.
    Be honest, if only 0.5% of the players were pre nerf hunters, you'd likely still see the stampede bug going on. If 0.5% were warriors, they'd still be oneshotting people.
    With increased popularity, unbalanced abilities become more of a problem, it's just like that.
    Most people I know don't even have a monk atm, they will have to level one for the pop to even get high. Unless people decided to hide their monks in a basement or something...

    Quote Originally Posted by Avada Kedavra View Post
    Its getting nerf'd for a reason. You cant compare it to the Spriest silence. Speer strike is on a 15 second CD with a Blanket silence in addition to the interupt. Spriests is on a 45 SECOND CD

    ppl need to stop bitching and comparing spells that ARE TOTALLY DIFFERENT -

    its not a nerf, you still get a silence, its just not as OP now.
    Yes they are totally different, spriest one is range and is a normal silence, I am comparing it to the mage silence.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

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