Mists of Pandaria Asian Chinese style expansion

[Venziir]

Um...yeah, we did. It was called Cataclysm. Just because the Old Gods weren't physically there doesn't mean that the entire expansion wasn't about them. In fact, it was only specifically about one of them: N'Zoth. Deathwing was just his puppet, as seen in the Madness of Deathwing encounter.

I mean, this is basically like complaining that The Burning Crusade had too many demons or that Wrath of the Lich King had too much of the undead.

Well, I'd like to complain about the fact that Cataclysm had too many tentacles.... I hate tentacles.

[FiftyDKPMinus]

So what exactly was interesting and appealing to you? The way you condescend to the entire expansion as Pandaland speaks volumes over your attempts to waterdown how you feel. But really, unappealing? What is more appealing? Illidan? The Lich King? Tired old storylines of misunderstood anti-heroes or big bads trying to destroy the world for whatever pathetic ends they have in mind?

Well, I can only speak for the Alliance side as my horde toon is still in Kalimdor, but the beginning of Jade Forest was nice, and drove my interpretation on how the entire expansion would play out. I originally thought, "Oh look, Garrosh wants to paint this continent red, and we have an admiral thirsting for orc blood, this continent is gonna turn into a Southern Barrens & cause massive havoc and destruction to the Pandaren homeland, (they did say it would be a massive horde v. alliance conflict). But as I went on, they brought out the Pandaren's idea of, "peace & harmony" due to the sha's presence amongst the land, while we come from a land of constant warring, being within our blood. (TLDR I thought we would be the enemies of Pandaria, with our "originally" bloodthirsty leaders (talking about Varian here) and would have to make amends eventually, with the Pandaren ON the homeland taking sides and warring against one another. Brother against brother, families torn apart and such.)

A can't speak for Vanilla & TBC's story-lines, due to I was too fresh at the time for those, but I can site one from Wrath as an example, (I posted my displeasure with this MoP event somewhere in the mists of time (pun not intended). Stoneplow and The Wrathgate.

When first I saw Stoneplow, I knew that wall's gonna fall, and this town would be overrun. Once the wall fell, I though, "oh, will it be just like Andorhal Alliance and we fall back to the brewery & halfhill, playing the guerrilla warfare strategy, that'd be neat!" But then comes good 'ol Chen Stormstout, and our previous master, and the day is saved.

Wrathgate was unexpected for me, and was what started all this in the first place. The Lich King didn't die to Saurfang's cleave, but actually lost his life due to his brashness. I guess you can say, I love darker and more violent stories in that sense than what MoP has brought to the table as well.

[Venziir]

Well, I can only speak for the Alliance side as my horde toon is still in Kalimdor, but the beginning of Jade Forest was nice, and drove my interpretation on how the entire expansion would play out. I originally thought, "Oh look, Garrosh wants to paint this continent red, and we have an admiral thirsting for orc blood, this continent is gonna turn into a Southern Barrens & cause massive havoc and destruction to the Pandaren homeland, (they did say it would be a massive horde v. alliance conflict). But as I went on, they brought out the Pandaren's idea of, "peace & harmony" due to the sha's presence amongst the land, while we come from a land of constant warring, being within our blood. (TLDR I thought we would be the enemies of Pandaria, with our "originally" bloodthirsty leaders (talking about Varian here) and would have to make amends eventually, with the Pandaren ON the homeland taking sides and warring against one another. Brother against brother, families torn apart and such.)

A can't speak for Vanilla & TBC's story-lines, due to I was too fresh at the time for those, but I can site one from Wrath as an example, (I posted my displeasure with this MoP event somewhere in the mists of time (pun not intended). Stoneplow and The Wrathgate.

When first I saw Stoneplow, I knew that wall's gonna fall, and this town would be overrun. Once the wall fell, I though, "oh, will it be just like Andorhal Alliance and we fall back to the brewery & halfhill, playing the guerrilla warfare strategy, that'd be neat!" But then comes good 'ol Chen Stormstout, and our previous master, and the day is saved.

Wrathgate was unexpected for me, and was what started all this in the first place. The Lich King didn't die to Saurfang's cleave, but actually lost his life due to his brashness. I guess you can say, I love darker and more violent stories in that sense than what MoP has brought to the table as well.

5.1 basically turned Krasarang into Southern Barrens v.3. And give it time, MoP isn't over - Garrosh still has plenty of time to rage all over Pandaria.
And about Stoneplow - note that it's the Sentinels and Sunwalkers who work together, both are factions well aware of the fact that we need to fight together now and then. Had it been humans or orcs, they surely wouldn't have to aid Stoneplow, or even if they would have, they would've turned at each other the moment after they'd saved the village.

[skrump]

I personally hate the asian them, then again I am a huge fan of the med-evil Gothic styling used in wotlk.
TBC looked like a bad acid trip of super sparkle gayness which I didn't care for either but it still gave off a darker vibe than Pandaria does.

Cataclysm much like Vanilla didn't really choose a particular styling and as a result the atmosphere of both were very boring though they did offer a consistent change of scenery every so often but nothing felt spectacular so I can't rate the styling of either above or below pandaria.

[AbalDarkwind]

Well, I'd like to complain about the fact that Cataclysm had too many tentacles.... I hate tentacles.

Well, hey! That actually makes my point stronger: Cataclysm was all about the tentacles just like TBC was all about the demons, WotLK was all about the undead, and MoP is all about the pandas!

Of course, those are very sweeping generalizations. Each expansion has been far more diverse than "Demons, undead, tentacles, and pandas". Those are just the least common denominators and can easily be shown to be such as shown by many of us in this very thread.

[Venziir]

I personally hate the asian them, then again I am a huge fan of the med-evil Gothic styling used in wotlk.
TBC looked like a bad acid trip of super sparkle gayness which I didn't care for either but it still gave off a darker vibe than Pandaria does.

Cataclysm much like Vanilla didn't really choose a particular styling and as a result the atmosphere of both were very boring though they did offer a consistent change of scenery every so often but nothing felt spectacular so I can't rate the styling of either above or below pandaria.

Try looking at the sky in Dread Wastes, that's a pretty dark vibe.

[Pendragon]

I like it, but I prefer the western themes a lot more.

[Venziir]

Well, hey! That actually makes my point stronger: Cataclysm was all about the tentacles just like TBC was all about the demons, WotLK was all about the undead, and MoP is all about the pandas!

Of course, those are very sweeping generalizations. Each expansion has been far more diverse than "Demons, undead, tentacles, and pandas". Those are just the least common denominators and can easily be shown to be such as shown by many of us in this very thread.

Creepiest anime ever!

[Snowraven]

I forgat some things, the conclusion to my post:

I don't mind the pandaren or Pandaria. I don't like the fact that all of Pandaria and the pandaren are based of Eastern Asia.

All of Northrend and the death knights weren't all based on norse stuff (scholazar fully, the undead, the engines of creation and the idea of a prison for an Old God, floating arab city, the troll empire there, the taunka native americans etc). BC and blood elves and draenei weren't all based on ... umm... anything actually, I can't think of a real life even continent similar to the whole of BC, same for Cata and Classic. MoP is, it's based of one single part of a continent, eastern Asia, I could even pinpoint the countries, and this is not the worst part, the worst if that some it is a bad stereotype to top on that and it kind of shows clearly.

If MoP was not so limited in what it showed, no meshing of culture and so on, I wouldn't have a problem with it. As it stands, I do. And the whole deal is that if I don't like asian themes, I can't go somewhere else in this expansion, all the continet is asian themed. And about 1 race. Oh yes, there's a war amongst the others... yea, foreign invaders of China, colonial empires, fits the bill perfectly. There's dwarves in Mulgore mining something (well there were, think they died come Cata), it doesn't make the zone and the people there less native american.

[Venziir]

I forgat some things, the conclusion to my post:

I don't mind the pandaren or Pandaria. I don't like the fact that all of Pandaria and the pandaren are based of Eastern Asia.

All of Northrend and the death knights weren't all based on norse stuff (scholazar fully, the undead, the engines of creation and the idea of a prison for an Old God, floating arab city, the troll empire there, the taunka native americans etc). BC and blood elves and draenei weren't all based on ... umm... anything actually, I can't think of a real life even continent similar to the whole of BC, same for Cata and Classic. MoP is, it's based of one single part of a continent, eastern Asia, I could even pinpoint the countries, and this is not the worst part, the worst if that some it is a bad stereotype to top on that and it kind of shows clearly.

If MoP was not so limited in what it showed, no meshing of culture and so on, I wouldn't have a problem with it. As it stands, I do. And the whole deal is that if I don't like asian themes, I can't go somewhere else in this expansion, all the continet is asian themed. And about 1 race. Oh yes, there's a war amongst the others... yea, foreign invaders of China, colonial empires, fits the bill perfectly. There's dwarves in Mulgore mining something (well there were, think they died come Cata), it doesn't make the zone and the people there less native american.

An indian guy on a bad acid trip perhaps?

[AbalDarkwind]

All of Northrend and the death knights weren't all based on norse stuff (scholazar fully, the undead, the engines of creation and the idea of a prison for an Old God, floating arab city, the troll empire there, the taunka native americans etc). BC and blood elves and draenei weren't all based on ... umm... anything actually, I can't think of a real life even continent similar to the whole of BC, same for Cata and Classic. MoP is, it's based of one single part of a continent, eastern Asia, I could even pinpoint the countries, and this is not the worst part, the worst if that some it is a bad stereotype to top on that and it kind of shows clearly.

I would like to challenge you to pinpoint which culture in Southeast Asia that the Mantid and their zone, the Dread Wastes, are based off of. As for bad stereotyping, that's been in the game for quite some time. They're called Trolls. Even the Tauren and Worgen are fairly stereotypical of Native Americans and the Victorian-era British, respectively.

If MoP was not so limited in what it showed, no meshing of culture and so on, I wouldn't have a problem with it. As it stands, I do. And the whole deal is that if I don't like asian themes, I can't go somewhere else in this expansion, all the continet is asian themed. And about 1 race. Oh yes, there's a war amongst the others... yea, foreign invaders of China, colonial empires, fits the bill perfectly. There's dwarves in Mulgore mining something (well there were, think they died come Cata), it doesn't make the zone and the people there less native american.

I understand where you're coming from. However, there has to be some cohesion to an isolated continent which is why Pandaria is so Southeast Asian-inspired. Much as the real life cultures of that region were isolated for thousands of years in the real world and had a culture free from outside influence.

[Venziir]

I would like to challenge you to pinpoint which culture in Southeast Asia that the Mantid and their zone, the Dread Wastes, are based off of. As for bad stereotyping, that's been in the game for quite some time. They're called Trolls. Even the Tauren and Worgen are fairly stereotypical of Native Americans and the Victorian-era British, respectively.



I think this is a clearer point then what some of the other posters have made. However, there has to be some cohesion to an isolated continent which is why Pandaria is so Southeast Asian-inspired. Much as the real life cultures of that region were isolated for thousands of years in the real world and had a culture free from outside influence.

Hmmmm... Well Dread Wastes is basically just Townlong with horrible lighting... So, my guess would be Siberian steppes, with a dash of Mongolia and perhaps a hint of north India? It's not that I disagree with you or anything - I just liked the challenge :3

[killidan]

Warcraft 3 mentioned Northrend, Kalimdor and Night Elves. Kalimdor and Northrend are continents. Northrend was an expansion, and Night Elves more or less dominated Kalimdor in Warcraft 3. ... What was your point again?

Oh and for the 50th time, Pandaria was mentioned in Warcraft 3 TFT, thus it wasn't unheard of.

---------- Post added 2013-02-23 at 09:47 PM ----------



He's ignoring both logic and facts. He's quite good at it though, I'll give him that.

I am discussing WoW players' backlash to MOP, not WC3 or another game. You seem confused. I did not deny the minimal role pandas may have played in WC3, I responded explaining why it was a bad idea for Blizz to let pandas dominate as pandas were unheard of to many WoW players. Is that more clear? I am not saying there was no panda in WC3, I am explaining why there was a backlash when they announced MOP.

Even in Warcraft it was only in WC3, iirc, and not a major character. Pandas were not a major race either. To many WoW players, it was unheard of and they revolted when they heard pandas are coming to take over the game.

[AbalDarkwind]

Hmmmm... Well Dread Wastes is basically just Townlong with horrible lighting... So, my guess would be Siberian steppes, with a dash of Mongolia and perhaps a hint of north India? It's not that I disagree with you or anything - I just liked the challenge :3

Fair enough. Still, a mishmash of regions there. What about the Mantid and their culture?

I am discussing WoW players' backlash to MOP, not WC3 or another game. You seem confused. I did not deny the minimal role pandas may have played in WC3, I responded explaining why it was a bad idea for Blizz to let pandas dominate as pandas were unheard of to many WoW players. Is that more clear? I am not saying there was no panda in WC3, I am explaining why there was a backlash when they announced MOP.

Interesting. Then can you explain why Blizzard stated that the Pandaren were the most requested playable race by a large margin?

[Venziir]

Fair enough. Still, a mishmash of regions there. What about the Mantid and their culture?

Amber-tripping, cultist bug version of the Mongol hordes? I have no clue really haha

[killidan]

This is by far one of the most ignorant posts I've ever read. What does the game you play have to do with your maturity level? I'd think your actual maturity level would be more of a factor in this. I've had college professors who played WoW, is a guy with a Ph. D. in psychology automatically immature at that point? I have a friend in his last year of law school who still plays Pokemon in his free time, but he must be immature too if he's that far into law school AND plays pokemon.

You may want to check the post I was responding to before you attempt to bash next time.

[Justignoreme]

An indian guy on a bad acid trip perhaps?

Spaceships, blue-skinned immortals, clash between forces of Light and Demons of Darkness: its uncannily similar to parts of the Mahabharata.

To many WoW players, it was unheard of and they revolted when they heard pandas are coming to take over the game.

Is that why subs skyrocketed when MoP was launched?

[Geminiwolf]

I love it, I think it's the best style they've used so far with the Nord style being my 2nd favorite. I love Chinese culture so this style is perfect for me.

[killidan]

Lots of thinly veiled racism here. As par usual.

MoP is fantasy asian themed. Get over it. Its just as viable and colourful as any other form of fantasy, and its a nice change of pace for the time being. Its temporary.

Now, not all of Pandaria is Chinese themed.

Townlong Steppes is clearly based partially on Mongolia, and the Yaungol have a Mongolian vibe to them. Dread Wastes is much more similar to Sithilus, which isn't Asian themed at all.

How many people complained Uldum is basically a cut-and-paste Eygpt? How many people complained that Twilight Highlands is basically Scottland?

How many people found Twilight Highlands to be similar to Scotland?

[Venziir]

I am discussing WoW players' backlash to MOP, not WC3 or another game. You seem confused. I did not deny the minimal role pandas may have played in WC3, I responded explaining why it was a bad idea for Blizz to let pandas dominate as pandas were unheard of to many WoW players. Is that more clear? I am not saying there was no panda in WC3, I am explaining why there was a backlash when they announced MOP.

Even in Warcraft it was only in WC3, iirc, and not a major character. Pandas were not a major race either. To many WoW players, it was unheard of and they revolted when they heard pandas are coming to take over the game.

Uhm no, I'm not confusing anything. Chen was mentioned in WoW, he mentioned Pandaria BEFORE WoW was released, thus making it awfully relevant. Thrall had a vision of Pandaria in his Cataclysm novelle, something that Blizzard made sure to advertise for in the WoW browser. And Chen was honestly just as major a character as Vol'jin or Rokhan was in TFT.

And honestly, many WoW players never read the novels, the quests or even played the previous games. Their opinions are utterly worthless when it comes to the story and lore progression of the game. Their opinion is as relevant as a vegetarians opinion of the taste of bacon.

---------- Post added 2013-02-23 at 10:55 PM ----------

Spaceships, blue-skinned immortals, clash between forces of Light and Demons of Darkness: its uncannily similar to parts of the Mahabharata.

Is that why subs skyrocketed when MoP was launched?

......... Mother of God! You are RIGHT! I've never ever thought about that before.... Of course, blue godly humanoids fighting evil demons often with many arms... Draenei, Demons and Shivarra... Hah, I always knew that the Draenei were inspired by indians and hindu, but... Heh I never ever saw *that* connection. Brilliant

---------- Post added 2013-02-23 at 10:56 PM ----------

How many people found Twilight Highlands to be similar to Scotland?

A highland area filled with dwarves who are basically miniature scottish people? Yeah surely no one saw that connection.