View Poll Results: Do you think Turkey should one day join the EU?

Voters
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  • EU citizen: Yes

    104 18.84%
  • EU citizen: Conflicted by this

    71 12.86%
  • EU citizen: No

    228 41.30%
  • US citizen: Yes

    43 7.79%
  • US citizen: Conflicted by this

    12 2.17%
  • US citizen: No

    18 3.26%
  • Turkey citizen: Yes

    6 1.09%
  • Turkey citizen: Conflicted by this

    6 1.09%
  • Turkey citizen: No

    13 2.36%
  • Rest of world citizen: Yes

    14 2.54%
  • Rest of world citizen: Conflicted by this

    4 0.72%
  • Rest of world citizen: No

    33 5.98%
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  1. #221
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    I hope this hate towards Turkish People is just vocal minority of Europe because if it's not I need to delay my vocation for Belgium(those beers...) and other European countries.
    Come to Croatia, we kind of love Turkey and Turkish culture right now (a bit because of the TV series Suleiman which is hugely popular here). And that's all despite the fact the Ottoman Empire was trying to conquer Croatia for like 300 years.

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Valort View Post
    And yet, oh so starving.
    With an average salary per capita lower than any other EU member, with a steep growth of poverty every year, and a literacy rate under 88%, Turkey really does have a lot to offer to the EU. /end sarcasm

    Loads of industries and resources... If you're willing to break your back and go bankrupt clearing the rubble out of the way.
    Simply comparable to buying an old American muscle car. It eats away all your oil, pollutes your air, makes a lot of noise, and require a lot of maintenance... But hey, look at the bright side: Leather seats!
    Mate, just google things before you write em.
    Literacy is in the 90-97% bracket, about poverty and salaries, you see, they're a raising country, we aren't. GDP growth in turkey 8.49%. Spain is at 0.7% growth, just to give you an example.

  3. #223
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    Killing and Exiling the aristocracy? Burning the libraries? Destroying the churches? Taking 1/5th of people as slaves?

    You can't be serious. The ottomans turned the Balkans from a normal part of europe that was entering renaissance in to an backward place stuck on the middle ages like most of the middle east.
    Do you not notice the part "13th century"? Besides, the whole point of the post you quoted was to say that the current Turkish generations aren't to blame for that yet here you are going on about the exact same thing. It doesn't matter what the Ottoman Empire did. It's like going on a crusade against the Germans for what Hitler did and of course that can't be done because Germany is a developed country, but, of course, we all hate Turkey so let's just spew shit and insult people for no reason.

    Chill out.

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Do you not notice the part "13th century"? Besides, the whole point of the post you quoted was to say that the current Turkish generations aren't to blame for that yet here you are going on about the exact same thing.
    I dont blame the current turks for that. I blame them for denying the genocides and belittling these atrocities. I hate the way that even those calling for openmindedness on this forum try to skew the historical facts.

  5. #225
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Lolno.

    1) Cyprus
    2) Turkey isn't a European country.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  6. #226
    Stood in the Fire Sforza's Avatar
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    As an Italian citizen (ethnic one) i utterly oppose the Turkish entry.
    They struggle to separate the state from islamic extremists and they have nothing in common with Europe.

  7. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Come to Croatia, we kind of love Turkey and Turkish culture right now (a bit because of the TV series Suleiman which is hugely popular here). And that's all despite the fact the Ottoman Empire was trying to conquer Croatia for like 300 years.
    If you got good beer, Why not?

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by Campechano View Post
    As an Italian citizen (ethnic one) i utterly oppose the Turkish entry.
    They struggle to separate the state from islamic extremists and they have nothing in common with Europe.
    Turkey is a very moderate Islamic country. They are as Muslim as italy is Catholic.

  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    Turkey is a very moderate Islamic country. They are as Muslim as italy is Catholic.
    It's still too much.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFGBMQGehY0

    And where are all the feminists and child rights advocates when you need them? Dropping your kid on the street?
    Last edited by Cybran; 2013-02-24 at 11:23 PM.

  10. #230
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    Turkey is a very moderate Islamic country. They are as Muslim as italy is Catholic.
    1) Cyprus. Their occupation of it has ruined the northern half of the island, and while they still prop up their pupped government I am going to oppose any and all overtures from Turkey.
    2) They are not. Turkey is highly Islamic, a faith which is not comparable to Catholicism, and has to heavily enforce the secularism that Ataturk introduced into the government. Furthermore, as they are not culturally European I don't see any reason why they should be permitted. Israel is a preferable candidate to Turkey, point of fact.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    It's still too much.
    What do you mean? Young guys drink like us, girls wear slutty clothes like us... Life is normal.
    As a matter of fact, I really think its a possible way for Islam and modern society to live together.

  12. #232
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    What do you mean? Young guys drink like us, girls wear slutty clothes like us... Life is normal.
    As a matter of fact, I really think its a possible way for Islam and modern society to live together.
    I don't. Islam is stuck in the Middle Ages, lacking many of the social developments that have tempered Christianity. It is to be expected, given that Islam, like many Eastern Orthodox countries, lacks the notion of the Church and State being seperate entities.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    1) Cyprus. Their occupation of it has ruined the northern half of the island
    I am in Famagusta at this very moment and it doesn't seem ruined. It seems it's not recognized.

    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    2) They are not. Turkey is highly Islamic, a faith which is not comparable to Catholicism, and has to heavily enforce the secularism that Ataturk introduced into the government. Furthermore, as they are not culturally European I don't see any reason why they should be permitted. Israel is a preferable candidate to Turkey, point of fact.
    Have you ever been in Turkey?

  14. #234
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    I am in Famagusta at this very moment and it doesn't seem ruined. It seems it's not recognized.
    Famagusta and Kyrenia are dumps, don't even start. Northern Cyprus is, factually speaking, a poverty stricken puppet state propped up by the Turkish Government.

    Have you ever been in Turkey?
    Indeed I have.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    1) Cyprus. Their occupation of it has ruined the northern half of the island, and while they still prop up their pupped government I am going to oppose any and all overtures from Turkey.
    2) They are not. Turkey is highly Islamic, a faith which is not comparable to Catholicism, and has to heavily enforce the secularism that Ataturk introduced into the government. Furthermore, as they are not culturally European I don't see any reason why they should be permitted. Israel is a preferable candidate to Turkey, point of fact.
    Cyprus is an issue as Northern Ireland was. They got that sorted they can get this one sorted too with a bit of diplomacy.
    They aren't at all highly Islamic, don't know why would you say something like that? Go there try for yourself.
    No Israel would be a terrible choice at its current state. No resources, small country, demanding, why bother?

  16. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Famagusta and Kyrenia are dumps, don't even start. Northern Cyprus is, factually speaking, a poverty stricken puppet state propped up by the Turkish Government.
    Dumps? I could agree some environmental problems in Famagusta Docks but it's far away from being a dump. You are pretty misinformed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Indeed I have.
    Which city?
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2013-02-24 at 11:35 PM.

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    What do you mean? Young guys drink like us, girls wear slutty clothes like us... Life is normal.
    As a matter of fact, I really think its a possible way for Islam and modern society to live together.
    We will have to disagree on that. Did you look at the video I linnked? all 3 women in it wear head covers and the kid was thrown on the street because it likely has no father and her parents want to get rid of it. Turkey is a solid 50-100 years behind europe, but trying to force it's way in with intimidation.

    They have a plan to pour 10 Billion dollars in to Bosnia and use the country as a foothold for european expansion. They fund extremist muslim schools and centers. They have around 16 million Kurds that suffer in the poorest parts of the country while the money they need gets spend on neo ottomanism.

    I am firmly against them joining.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Which city?
    I have been to Izmir and a few resort towns on the west coast (lol). The shower water was salty and some streets in Izmir smelt like carcass (prolly meat market nearby who knows).

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    I don't. Islam is stuck in the Middle Ages, lacking many of the social developments that have tempered Christianity. It is to be expected, given that Islam, like many Eastern Orthodox countries, lacks the notion of the Church and State being seperate entities.
    Yeah... ok....
    What I meant is a moderate form of Islam like the one that's now in turkey works perfectly fine. No need to start blaming ISLAM as if it was a singular entity or a country.

  19. #239
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    Cyprus is an issue as Northern Ireland was. They got that sorted they can get this one sorted too with a bit of diplomacy.
    They aren't at all highly Islamic, don't know why would you say something like that? Go there try for yourself.
    No Israel would be a terrible choice at its current state. No resources, small country, demanding, why bother?
    I've been there. Furthermore, the demographics and human rights issues don't lie.

    Israel would be an excellent choice for a number of reasons. For starters, it is a developed democratic republic with a stable economy. Second, it is highly Europeanised. Third, entry into the EU might help to allay their fears about invasion from Syria and Israel and make them less aggressive towards the Palestinians.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-24 at 03:37 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Dumps? I could agree some environmental problems in Famagusta Docks but it's far away from being a dump. You are pretty misinformed.
    Not really.

    Which city?
    I visited most of the major Hellenistic and Byzantine centers owing to it being primarily historical in nature; Constantinople, Nicaea, Trebizond, Ephesus, etc.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-24 at 03:38 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    Yeah... ok....
    What I meant is a moderate form of Islam like the one that's now in turkey works perfectly fine. No need to start blaming ISLAM as if it was a singular entity or a country.
    The 'form of Islam' that 'works' in Turkey is one that is put down by a highly oppressive secular overlay introduced after the Empire was thrown out after the Graeco-Turkish War.

    Islam is a culturo-religious phenomenon that is culpable for a ream of social and political issues.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  20. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    We will have to disagree on that. Did you look at the video I linnked? all 3 women in it wear head covers and the kid was thrown on the street because it likely has no father and her parents want to get rid of it. Turkey is a solid 50-100 years behind europe, but trying to force it's way in with intimidation.

    They have a plan to pour 10 Billion dollars in to Bosnia and use the country as a foothold for european expansion. They fund extremist muslim schools and centers. They have around 16 million Kurds that suffer in the poorest parts of the country while the money they need gets spend on neo ottomanism.

    I am firmly against them joining.



    I have been to Izmir and a few resort towns on the west coast (lol). The shower water was salty and some streets in Izmir smelt like carcass (prolly meat market nearby who knows).
    If turkey is 50-100 years back with a GDP growth 8 times Spain, a moderate society, a strong middle class, and a government that actually look after its own country, I'd gladly go back 50-100 years myself, instead of being locked in this grim present in this bland europe that has no sustainable economic future.
    Last edited by Djalil; 2013-02-24 at 11:42 PM.

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