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  1. #81
    Anyone who says Ret Paladin has the best survivability out of all melee is not good at PVP at all, period; you can safely ignore anything they say about Ret Paladins.

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUntsAhts View Post
    Two possible snares that suffer no damage or utility loss? K, you have never played a Paladin. SoJ is a pretty huge dps loss. Assuming the other is BoG or new Hammer 90 talent? Ok, 90 talent is a MASSIVE loss over prism, still. BoG IS A MASSIVE LOSS OVER FIST OF JUSTICE IN ALL PVP SITUATIONS.

    WoG is pretty much useless. You're right in that they can sit there and shoot out heals every like what, 10 seconds for WoG and 16ish for Flash of Light? Too bad with battle fatigue and MS they hit like a wet noodle on yourself, and you won't ever need to heal your allies because the other team sits on your face all game.

    Blizzard is buffing them so much because >1% of Gladiators this season are Ret. They SHOULD be buffing Ele and Enhance.
    I'm pretty sure the guy you quoted was being sarcastic.

  3. #83
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feio View Post
    I'm pretty sure the guy you quoted was being sarcastic.
    Yeah, I have now noticed that lol. Little hard to tell over text, and I have a killer hangover. Still, there are people out there that aren't being sarcastic and actually believe stuff like that. =/

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    Anyone who says Ret Paladin has the best survivability out of all melee is not good at PVP at all, period; you can safely ignore anything they say about Ret Paladins.
    defensive.

  5. #85
    Stood in the Fire
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    in 5.1, 1: Ferals, 2: Warriors 3: Dont know

    in 5.2, 1: Retri, 2: Feral 3: DK, 4: Warrior

    And to you whiny kids playing Retri, your healing is MUCH upped in 5.2

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Mortalomena View Post
    in 5.1, 1: Ferals, 2: Warriors 3: Dont know

    in 5.2, 1: Retri, 2: Feral 3: DK, 4: Warrior

    And to you whiny kids playing Retri, your healing is MUCH upped in 5.2
    in 5.1 its warrior and not feral by insane big margin, except you are good with cyclones and you count sitting in stealthmode, then its about the same.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by Mortalomena View Post
    in 5.1, 1: Ferals, 2: Warriors 3: Dont know

    in 5.2, 1: Retri, 2: Feral 3: DK, 4: Warrior

    And to you whiny kids playing Retri, your healing is MUCH upped in 5.2
    Healing debuff on PTR is not enabled and it is only 15% on live right now. I think it will go to 30% soon. Ret healing is never going to be like in Cata.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    in 5.1 its warrior and not feral by insane big margin, except you are good with cyclones and you count sitting in stealthmode, then its about the same.
    Feral raid boss is mad.

  9. #89
    Stood in the Fire Gaelden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    Anyone who says Ret Paladin has the best survivability out of all melee is not good at PVP at all, period; you can safely ignore anything they say about Ret Paladins.
    Quite true.
    Grab yer mace, and smash their face!

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Korgoth View Post
    Kidney Shot justs last 6s, and has a 20s CD, allowing you with 1 instant ability to CC your kill target 30% of the time; coupled with a 5s Cheapshot to start and you have a more bullshit stun chain then the thankfully getting removed Warbringer-Shockwave.

    Rogues act like combo points and energy is hard to come by, it's not. The PTR is up, go play a rogue, its really fucking easy.
    As much as you try to convince yourself that 5CP + energy is nothing to a rogue and we can just make it rain stuns, fact of the matter is that those 5CP are off of our burst which we'd need to do during that stun, not to mention that so far we've hit like an empty sack. Also 5s CS is glyphed.

    On PTR I can agree with you, but not on live, which the poster you quoted was referring to.
    WBMA - Leave our beards alone

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  11. #91
    5 sec Cheap Shot, 5 sec Kidney Shot, 4 sec Poison stun. Super balanced, 14 seconds of stun.

    And I'm not just whining, btw. This is what happened to me yesterday. Rogues don't need survivability when they can just lock someone out for 10+ seconds.

  12. #92
    Don't worry, next patch rogues will be kicking tons of ass. Not because they are OP, but because they're obviously ultra skilled ninjas.

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Korgoth View Post
    5s cheapshot into 3s kidney DRd into 4s Paralytic into 5s silence into 4s Horror into 5s cheap shot! into Hex. Did that last night to a disc priest playing RPS on the PTR. He didnt get to do shit And only the hex was a cast.
    Did the priest do anything during the Paralytic?

    Dusting off my HARP rogue who hasn't seen high end arena since S4 for this abortion of a patch. If you cried when I raped on my warrior, the rogue raping will be twice as bad.
    Excellent. Post a link to your rogue's armory so we can watch you destroy the ladders!

  14. #94
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Korgoth View Post
    Really. Would someone explain to this guy who obviously doesn't really pvp what is wrong with that statement. I give up.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-26 at 05:33 PM ----------



    Except this was about survivability, not viability or power level. A rogue is less viable in Arena then a warrior on live. A rogue fills a similar role, but their superior CC is outmuscled by warrior damage. As such they are not taken and their rep dwindles, much like Warrior rep did in the previous season.

    6 Weeks into next season warrior rep will be under half what it is today, and rogue rep will surpass it. And 12 weeks into the season I suspect Rogue and Warrior Rep will be back to 4.3 levels, 20% Rogue 4% War.
    I really wouldn't argue with Korgoth guys. While he does bring up some decent points every once in a while, his posts are so biased with hate towards other classes that you'll never leave the discussion feeling like anything was accomplished.

    And, Korgoth, I will bet you money that Rogue rep will never reach 20% in the next season. I'm going to guess that you'll see a more equitable distribution between Rogue and Warrior. I will mail you $50 if by 12 weeks after the next patch goes live if Rogues Arena Rep at 2200 and above is at 20%. The only thing I ask in return, is that if Rogue reputation is less than Warrior Rep at that time, you issue a public apology.

  15. #95
    Legendary! Korgoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaderas View Post
    I really wouldn't argue with Korgoth guys. While he does bring up some decent points every once in a while, his posts are so biased with hate towards other classes that you'll never leave the discussion feeling like anything was accomplished.

    And, Korgoth, I will bet you money that Rogue rep will never reach 20% in the next season. I'm going to guess that you'll see a more equitable distribution between Rogue and Warrior. I will mail you $50 if by 12 weeks after the next patch goes live if Rogues Arena Rep at 2200 and above is at 20%. The only thing I ask in return, is that if Rogue reputation is less than Warrior Rep at that time, you issue a public apology.
    A public apology to who? Delusional rogues, the people who get carried by them, or the BG players who just want to rag on warriors for getting swiftyd? I'm still waiting for my apology from all the rogues who said they weren't going to be overpowered in S11 during the 4.3 PTR... anytime now guys.
    "Gamer" is not a bad word. I identify as a gamer. When calling out those who persecute and harass, the word you're looking for is "asshole." @_DonAdams
    When you see someone in a thread making the same canned responses over and over, click their name, click view forum posts, and see if they are a troll. Then don't feed them.

  16. #96
    Browsing the patch notes again, I say that DK is going to be nigh unkillable this season.

    Conversion is going to be ridiculous healing with 5/5 change. A DK sitting in blood presence and full resil-gemmed will be a nightmare to take down.

    So everyone complained about warriors? Wait until this season starts and get a taste of DKs. Like the saying goes, meet your new boss, just like the old boss.

  17. #97
    Legendary! Korgoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corebit View Post
    Browsing the patch notes again, I say that DK is going to be nigh unkillable this season.

    Conversion is going to be ridiculous healing with 5/5 change. A DK sitting in blood presence and full resil-gemmed will be a nightmare to take down.

    So everyone complained about warriors? Wait until this season starts and get a taste of DKs. Like the saying goes, meet your new boss, just like the old boss.
    Playing RPS and Thugcleave on PTR I didnt find DKs to be that tough. With Thug especially, it felt almost guaranteed that once you get them to blow IBF and trinket, all it takes is a cheapshot bomb to roll em over.
    "Gamer" is not a bad word. I identify as a gamer. When calling out those who persecute and harass, the word you're looking for is "asshole." @_DonAdams
    When you see someone in a thread making the same canned responses over and over, click their name, click view forum posts, and see if they are a troll. Then don't feed them.

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Jawless Jones View Post
    i'd rate monk as the highest survivability, however i would be taking into account all the escapes (FSK, two rolls with 50% movespeed or two rolls with sprint/freedom or three rolls, transcendence)

    if a monk wants to get away from someone there's very little that person can do (unless they're a monk ofc), so i'd rate monk as highest active survivability (as opposed to the passive survivability that warriors have with def stance, second wind, 20% dmg reduc from Die by the Sword)

    edit: the downside to this "Murvive-sobility" (survival through mobility) is that you can easily out range or LoS your healer, thus sort of negating the benefits if you aren't keeping track of your teammates
    Unfortunately, this sort of tactic offers zero protection from hunters and casters, and will probably not even get you away from a well played Rogue, Warrior, or even Feral Cat for long. Thus its viability in rated play is low.
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Lumineus View Post
    Unfortunately, this sort of tactic offers zero protection from hunters and casters, and will probably not even get you away from a well played Rogue, Warrior, or even Feral Cat for long. Thus its viability in rated play is low.
    Yes this is correct. I rated monks higher on survivability at the beginning of this thread, but with the nerf to Ring of Peace and Chi Wave, they are one of the squishier melees and will be easily burst down.

    Right now for survivability this is how I would rate:
    1st tier: DKs, rogues
    2nd tier: Rets, ferals, warrior
    3rd tier: enh shaman, ww monks

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    Anyone who says Ret Paladin has the best survivability out of all melee is not good at PVP at all, period; you can safely ignore anything they say about Ret Paladins.
    pretty much summed up nicely

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