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  1. #21
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alixie View Post
    I didnt realize this was an RP forum. And if certain story writers didnt have boners for a certain green monster, maybe some other characters could get some of the limelight for once.
    so wheres that lore then? Oh, you come empty handed? No surprise nobody likes gnomes. /eyeroll.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 02:06 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    Wow, somebody has selective memory about things.
    Not really. I'm taking account of the situation as it happened sunshine, I even included that a dick Garrosh was being to.

  2. #22
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    Except you're just wrong about most of what composes the crux of your argument.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by darkwarrior42 View Post
    And Varian *did* start the war. There was a tentative peace, and then he attacked the Undercity. Make whatever arguments you want, the Undercity is held by those who lived there originally, and is a member of the Horde; in attacking the Undercity, he attacked one of the capital cities of the Horde. I'd be hard pressed to think of a larger declaration of war.
    I don't know the novels well. Can you tell me when that happened? Or are you talking about the post-Wrathgate raid of the Undercity? Because that one was certainly justified. The Undercity wasn't even under Horde control back then.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Bzzzzz, WRONG, it was a rogue group that caused the wrath gate, and your Varian who accused the horde of it happening.
    'oh but Sylvanas was making the plague in the first place', yes, as a weapon to defend against the alliance. And with captain chin over there, can you blame them for it?

    Sorry, Thrall and his horde was prepared to fight alongside the alliance, and to an extent so was the alliance, but Varian made the swings that made it impossible.
    You're way off on the intent of the plague. It has nothing to do with being a defensive weapon against the alliance. The purpose of it is to ultimately create more forsaken.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Oh yes because him repenting really stopped the fire spreading didn't it?

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 01:54 AM ----------



    Go back to gnomeregan and come back when you have some decent lore.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 01:55 AM ----------



    THANK you, yet another example.

    Yeah, Garrosh is the leading force of this war, but shock as it might be for people to believe, he did not instigate this conflict. Varian did so at a time when the horde was lead by someone trying to talk peace with the alliance.
    And just to add to it, Thrall chose Garosh because he tought that's what the horde needed back then. He had to step away, Varian was this douche Warmonger that would never step aside for a peace, so he went ahead and brought someone that could potentialy defend them the same way Varian would attack ..... this simply led to even more trouble. If Varian wouldn't have been such a douche and would settle for peace, Garosh would have never been in charge of the horde

  6. #26
    if ye think about it the orcs are really an occupying extra terrestrial force. They shouldnt even be on this planet if they aint happy they can feck orf!

    In the words of my ancestors "GERROF MOI LAND YE VARMITS!"

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Bzzzzz, WRONG, it was a rogue group that caused the wrath gate, and your Varian who accused the horde of it happening.
    'oh but Sylvanas was making the plague in the first place', yes, as a weapon to defend against the alliance. And with captain chin over there, can you blame them for it?
    Look, Trassk, I don't think Thrall is to blame for the Wrathgate. I just try to point out that if you are reaching as far as you are with your Garrosh blame project, almost anyone can be construed as the war cause. Even your beloved Thrall. Nonetheless, the fact that a considerable amount of Horde troops betrayed both Alliance and the rest of the Horde is what severely weakened the Wrath peace and made Varian very distrustful. Thus he had more reason for being an idiot than Garrosh, who as I said just wanted to act tough. Because that's what his daddy would have wanted.

    Also, where does the "your Varian" remark come from? I don't like Varian at all. I just think your reasoning in this thread is very weak, whereas your reason for it is all too obvious (and a bit childish).

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elggur View Post
    And just to add to it, Thrall chose Garosh because he tought that's what the horde needed back then. He had to step away, Varian was this douche Warmonger that would never step aside for a peace, so he went ahead and brought someone that could potentialy defend them the same way Varian would attack ..... this simply led to even more trouble. If Varian wouldn't have been such a douche and would settle for peace, Garosh would have never been in charge of the horde
    Another fair point. Thrall knew the alliance were out for his horde, and given the desperate nature of the situation choose someone he thought would keep the horde fighting, against a foe who was not able to negotiate peace with him.
    People accuse Thrall of making that mistake, but don't want to hold Varian responsible for being the instigator of that decision.

  9. #29
    It was his Horde that caused the Wrathgate incident. Had he been a better leader, maybe he could have prevented that.
    LOL. Even sylvanas didn't see wrathgate coming, you think Thrall could have?

    If you are taking indirect effects as root causes, Thrall is the cause for the war by allowing Orcs to run gladiator rings. So Thrall needs to be doubly kicked out of the Horde.
    Might as well go all the way back. It's all the Titans fault, they let one of their own go bad, they failed to properly keep the old gods in check. Their actions have accumulated in the current situation.

    As the old joke with a grain of truth goes, "Cause of WWI? Boundary conditions of the universe and the universal wave function.".

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by iscalio View Post
    Look, Trassk, I don't think Thrall is to blame for the Wrathgate. I just try to point out that if you are reaching as far as you are with your Garrosh blame project, almost anyone can be construed as the war cause. Even your beloved Thrall. Nonetheless, the fact that a considerable amount of Horde troops betrayed both Alliance and the rest of the Horde is what severely weakened the Wrath peace and made Varian very distrustful. Thus he had more reason for being an idiot than Garrosh, who as I said just wanted to act tough. Because that's what his daddy would have wanted.

    Also, where does the "your Varian" remark come from? I don't like Varian at all. I just think your reasoning in this thread is very weak, whereas your reason for it is all too obvious (and a bit childish).
    You think its weak because you don't want to listen to the facts of the story. Thats all I'm using here, nothings fabricated. infact I'm using more solid facts in the story here then on the latest Thrall bashing thread.

  11. #31
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    With the exception that you're ignoring large portions of the lore to fit your narrative lol.

    You're a Thrall fan, we got that several hundred thousand times over by now.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    Except you're just wrong about most of what composes the crux of your argument.
    I can honestly say while laughing out loud I know i'm not, and know your the one reaching, since i'm using actual events in the story as they happened.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Elggur View Post
    And just to add to it, Thrall chose Garosh because he tought that's what the horde needed back then. He had to step away, Varian was this douche Warmonger that would never step aside for a peace, so he went ahead and brought someone that could potentialy defend them the same way Varian would attack ..... this simply led to even more trouble. If Varian wouldn't have been such a douche and would settle for peace, Garosh would have never been in charge of the horde
    you mean like the peace we did have between wrath and cata? the one garrosh ended up breaking?

  14. #34
    Cutting off trade as a response to the Wrathgate was not a bad call but, the fact that it wasn't his people who had to deal with the Orcs invasion force was really short sighted. High King lore can diaf. That aside...
    And Varian *did* start the war. There was a tentative peace, and then he attacked the Undercity.
    The Horde cheap-shotting the Alliance in Icecrown, resulting in a huge loss of Alliance troops and fresh numbers for the Scourge, which the Argent Crusade had to come in and clear out was the first attack (and typical of the storyline we see in WoW). Undercity wasn't an invasion force either. It was a small group sent in to clear out Putress and his Apothecary betrayers, Sylvanas wasn't in control or in power. Jaina kept Varian from doing a stupid move and attacking Thrall in Undercity. Varian made clear mistakes, so has Thrall. Both are learning from them. The only thing is Thrall's mistake has become Varian and the rest of the Alliance's problem.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    With the exception that you're ignoring large portions of the lore to fit your narrative lol.

    You're a Thrall fan, we got that several hundred thousand times over by now.
    Heres a suggestion. if you have an argument to this subject, how about throwing something in there instead of throwing around false narrative?

  16. #36
    With the amount of work and effort the devs have done to make Varian likeable, I don't think they'll agree to just make him disappear.

    Varian is here to stay for better or worse. You'll have to deal with it.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by maldias View Post
    you mean like the peace we did have between wrath and cata? the one garrosh ended up breaking?
    You don't seem to get the point do you?

    Why do you think Garrosh went to war and caused this to happen? Did he see the sweetness and love the alliance had to it and thought 'I want to attack them?'. NO, he Saw Varian wanting to attack the horde at every turn, and decided he had enough of Varians BS.

    Varian started this.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Heres a suggestion. if you have an argument to this subject, how about throwing something in there instead of throwing around false narrative?
    Because I know how you are.

    People should learn that arguing with somebody who refuses to ever consider that their green Jesus is wrong is futile.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    so wheres that lore then? Oh, you come empty handed? No surprise nobody likes gnomes. /eyeroll.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 02:06 AM ----------



    Not really. I'm taking account of the situation as it happened sunshine, I even included that a dick Garrosh was being to.
    Im not debating anything. The whole point of this topic is to whine about another thread and you dont like people disliking Thrall or orcs in general. As for the other point, a lot of players know that certain races are hogging all of the story and spotlight, either because the writers dont care, cant think of anything, or fanboys of their own stupid character and would rather center the game about how awesome thrall is.

    If you tried out the Worgen starting zone, youd realize their story is there to boost how awesome Sylvannas and the forsaken are, but then it stops abruptly when you get to Darkshore. Its almost like Worgen dont exist in lore when you ding level 11. Any sort of conclusion, you have to play horde because like I said, the Worgen exist to give the zombies and their stupid over used leader a better story.

    Gnomes dont have lore. Why? I dont know. Check the above reasons why the writers are slacking on their own universe. I use one as an avatar because she's cute, but thats it.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    Because I know how you are.

    People should learn that arguing with somebody who refuses to ever consider that their green Jesus is wrong is futile.
    you don't have anything to add to this thread or subject, so your just trolling.

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