Best Rogue Raid DPS Spec for 5.2?

[Kael]

In terms of pure patchwerk, combat should be ahead by the end of next tier, or at least outstandingly close. Assassination should still hold it's ground strong on high movement fights since so much of it's damage is non-direct.

I'm mentally seeing assassination ahead if we need to help kill a series of adds at range (unlikely but possible - shuriken toss/mobswap to apply poisons at range), or with lots of target swapping, which is always likely. If nothing changes, I'd expect to see combat ahead in 4p on single target and cleave, and assassination reigning supreme for large target swap or partially ranged fights. Sub looks, to me, like it would be ahead on patchwerk before the 4p bonus hits combat, but... the 4p bonus hits combat.

[Hayturr]

A lot of the Un-sub-friendy fights can be made sub friendly with Cloak and Dagger and Shuriken toss.

[Deleted]

A lot of the Un-sub-friendy fights can be made sub friendly with Cloak and Dagger and Shuriken toss.

"Sub friendly" and "Shuriken Toss" in the same sentence? We are talking highest damage output, right?

[Deleted]

I dont know but i am hoping for assa.

[Feali]

Combat.

And here you see why:


I know it's from a patchwerk fight but still a pretty good image. 20k DPS is huge from Combat to Assa

[whathump]

Combat.

And here you see why:
-snip-

I know it's from a patchwerk fight but still a pretty good image. 20k DPS is huge from Combat to Assa

Well, bottom 10 dps specs with 3/4 changes being all physical. Kind of telling with how much the real PPM nerf hits melee and hunters.

As for top rogue DPS spec being combat by a huge margin, it... well, it doesn't feel too great. I don't like being forced to play a spec I find boring because of an OP 4 piece, and certainly not after getting excited to see the 2 piece in action as Assassination or Subtlety.

[Drexra]

GC - "Recent DPS Tweaks

- Might of the Frozen Wastes includes melee damage by 20%, up from 15%.
- Icy Talons increases attack speed by 30%, up from 25%.
- Threat of Thassarian now increases Frost Strike damage by 50%, up from 40%.
- Assassin's Resolve now increases damage by 30%, up from 20%.
- Shadow Word: Pain damage increased by 25%."

Was that factored into your sims? Just released 30 minutes ago I believe.

[Carp The Fish]

THAT BUFF. No contest on this one anymore, Mut is going to top Combat for the entire tier.
(also it'll probably top Combat on 2-target cleave guaranteed now)

[whathump]

THAT BUFF. No contest on this one anymore, Mut is going to top Combat for the entire tier.
(also it'll probably top Combat on 2-target cleave guaranteed now)

Just pulling out a calculator, that buffs Assassination from 178k to 192k. Not bad. Now if just they'll do something about Sub's sad state...

[Wow]

Just pulling out a calculator, that buffs Assassination from 178k to 192k. Not bad. Now if just they'll do something about Sub's sad state...

They just keep claiming sub is some scaling monster and probably will do nothing to buff it. The spec doesn't scale well enough to keep up with the buffs the other specs keep getting.

Is sub only meant to be played in the last tier of expansions lol.

[whathump]

They just keep claiming sub is some scaling monster and probably will do nothing to buff it. The spec doesn't scale well enough to keep up with the buffs the other specs keep getting.

Is sub only meant to be played in the last tier of expansions lol.

I can't see it even being a scaling monster without SnD affecting real PPM. I don't know where Blizzard gets it being a scaling monster from.

[Wow]

Bad thing on this is if they do make up for sub massive loss on this rppm nerf its just going to make the pvp qq even bigger.

Which leaves the question why did they do this at all? If they buff all the classes that lost from this that will add even more pvp dmg which is the last thing the game needs and buffing all the specs just the right amount for this nerf is a lot of work for what gain exactly?

[Cortic]

Conditions:

Where did you pull those Simcraft numbers from? I'm on the simcraft website and there is nothing posted for 5.2. Been looking for these for weeks now zzzz

[Kael]

Conditions:

Where did you pull those Simcraft numbers from? I'm on the simcraft website and there is nothing posted for 5.2. Been looking for these for weeks now zzzz

Presumably by downloading the client, swapping "Live" to "PTR" and using the default settings you'd use to sim anything DPS-side.

[Ryme]

My hopes for subtlety being raid competitive are now shattered, RPPM nerf and the endless fucking buffs to the other specs make it seem foolish to pursue once more, I'm sad.

I still cannot fathom how the discrepancy between all 3rd party tools and internal ones are persisting to be so large. I really, really want to get some insight into what the devs are seeing in rogues.

[Coldkil]

My hopes for subtlety being raid competitive are now shattered, RPPM nerf and the endless fucking buffs to the other specs make it seem foolish to pursue once more, I'm sad.

I still cannot fathom how the discrepancy between all 3rd party tools and internal ones are persisting to be so large. I really, really want to get some insight into what the devs are seeing in rogues.

To me, one of the worst problems (apart all the things you said) is still that many fight simply don't let you to play sub due to backstab positional requirement. It's not fun nor adds spice to rotation, it's simply making one spec useless.

Both removing the requirement or making the bosses like tortos or megara "all behind" would be the same to me. Just let us use the main ability of the spec.

[Ryme]

Excuse me, I'm in a pessimistic mood. I just don't see them doing "big" things like that when stuff like Vendetta still costs a GCD.

[Coldkil]

Excuse me, I'm in a pessimistic mood. I just don't see them doing "big" things like that when stuff like Vendetta still costs a GCD.

Agree again. My hopes are now for 6.0, i don't think we will see anything new before that date.

EDIT: haha love messing with sigs

[Deleted]

Simcraft has always been borderline non-sense when it comes to rogues, so i wouldn't trust those numbers too much
Not to mention the fact that, 5.2 simcraft is still very much a wip

[Ryme]

So, I'm still looking at improving modelling to compensate for new tier, I'm also too impatient to wait for the new rppm mechanics to be added, but I have subtlety between 6-7% behind assassination and combat. Which is actually even worse than what it is now.


EDIT: Oh, by the way, I don't think the sims posted above were run on the build that includes the envenom buff.