Ra-Den speculations, [SPOILER ALERT]

[Deleted]

Ok, I was just browsing the quotes of Ra-Den and he apparently says:
Wait! I am... I am not your enemy. You are powerful, more powerful than he was, even... perhaps you are right... Perhaps there is still hope. But there is a yawning chasm of darkness beneath you mortals, vast, endless, and all consuming... I do not believe that you can correct this doomed course... But you have earned the right to try. Farewell.

more powerful than HE was....
Does anyone know who he speaks of?
He also speaks of a yawning chasm of darkness beneath you mortals, could he be speaking of N'Zoth?

[Deleted]

He speaks of Lei Shen, who beaten him im Mogu'shan Vault, ripped his heart and absorbed it's power and then became Thunder King. Lei was pretty OP, he soloed Titanic Watcher, and Ra says that we are even stronger.

N'zoth is somewhere beneath Maelstrom/Rift of Aln. I don't think he belongs to Pandaria. I think that it may be the remnants of Y'shaarj.

[checking facts]

he soloed Titanic Watcher, and Ra says that we are even stronger.

ra-den may be a real titan, not a titanic watcher. the dungeon journal calls him a "titan keeper" (you could say "keeper" is his "class", like an "orc warrior").

the in-game Book "Agents of Order" has this passage: "The mogu called their titan master 'The Storm.' He was their keeper."

[Florena]

"He" refers to Lei Shen. The yawning chasm of darkness I think refers to the old gods in general, of which there is at least one more (N'zoth) and possibly more than him.

[apepi]

I am thinking the titans died so that is the reason he got depressed. And the chasm of darkness might be the Twisting Nether?

[Deleted]

I am thinking the titans died so that is the reason he got depressed. And the chasm of darkness might be the Twisting Nether?

That isn't really beneath us..

[Deleted]

ra-den may be a real titan, not a titanic watcher. the dungeon journal calls him a "titan keeper" (you could say "keeper" is his "class", like an "orc warrior").

the in-game Book "Agents of Order" has this passage: "The mogu called their titan master 'The Storm.' He was their keeper."

This has been discussed to death already 2 months ago. Just accept that he is just a watcher like those we saw in Ulduar.

[checking facts]

This has been discussed to death already 2 months ago. Just accept that he is just a watcher like those we saw in Ulduar.

than why does the new in-game book call him a titan?

[Deleted]

than why does the new in-game book call him a titan?

Because even a lesser titan (as in, not part of the Pantheon) nearly killed an Old God (C'thun). And now a slightly more powerful Mogu (titan creation) walks past and solos one of their masters? We know that Thorim could destroy Northrend in one attack if he wished to, and we also dont know how Lei Shen beat Ra-den - it wasnt a fair fight, most likely.

We havent seen a true titan in game yet, and when it happens it'll be a major event like an expansion pre patch, etc.

[Zethras]

I'm still trying to think of how Lei Shen could have beaten Ra-den.

My theory is that Lei shen was losing the fight, and at the critical moment, he utilized his fear and caused it to effect Ra-den, allowing him to gain the upper hand.

[checking facts]

I'm still trying to think of how Lei Shen could have beaten Ra-den.

My theory is that Lei shen was losing the fight, and at the critical moment, he utilized his fear and caused it to effect Ra-den, allowing him to gain the upper hand.

or maybe he threw dirt on the titan's eyes and than kicked his thundering granite balls.

[TheAmazingFeedz]

Because even a lesser titan (as in, not part of the Pantheon) nearly killed an Old God (C'thun). And now a slightly more powerful Mogu (titan creation) walks past and solos one of their masters? We know that Thorim could destroy Northrend in one attack if he wished to, and we also dont know how Lei Shen beat Ra-den - it wasnt a fair fight, most likely.

We havent seen a true titan in game yet, and when it happens it'll be a major event like an expansion pre patch, etc.

The thing is, there is no mention of a Lesser Titan battling C'Thun, so no one knows if the Titan was apart of the Pantheon or not. C'Thun was a lesser Old God anyways(The youngest and weakest one). I am still going to stay with the idea that an Old God can outmatch a Titan.

[Deleted]

The thing is, there is no mention of a Lesser Titan battling C'Thun, so no one knows if the Titan was apart of the Pantheon or not. C'Thun was a lesser Old God anyways(The youngest and weakest one). I am still going to stay with the idea that an Old God can outmatch a Titan.

We know who are and who were (Sargeras) the member of the Pantheon, since the moment where Sargeras changed his mind and their history in relation to Azeroth started. The titan (singular) was always titled as "no-named", he could be a strong commander or just the titanic water boy, but not a member of the Pantheon.

[Pickwickman]

More powerful than he was, even. This, with our current knowledge, clearly means Lei Shen, since he quite literally ripped Ra-Dens heart out of his body so that he could gain more power.

The "yawning" could be taken in two main ways, literal which would make one assume that it's Y'sjaarjh (fuck that name) because his deathbreaths made the Sha or figurative, which could mean many things. (Alliance vs. Horde / Old Gods / Burning Legion)

Don't forget, Ra-Den is a Keeper, he is like Algalon. Where Algalon's job was to check if the planet needed a complete reset, Ra-den's purpose is still unclear. It could be that he is the one that had to keep the Mantid at bay, seeing they were followers of the Old Gods.

Doomed course bit is pretty unclear at the moment, it could mean a couple of things. As things are currently the easiest one would be having the Sha active might fuck us over in short-term (think Garrosh). It could also just be the conclusion that we know the Titans had, that the Old Gods were so enrooted into Azeroth that killing them would destroy the world as we know it. (long-term)

That we might be "able to do it" could possibly mean that in the next patches we might see something to battle the aforementioned things I highlighted. It would be amazing in my opinion if that preludes a Burning Legion-esque expansion where we have fucked up Azeroth so much by spreading corruption unknowingly or unwillingly that we have to find a way to communicate with the Pantheon to ask for their blessing / help to restore Azeroth to what it once was or better yet to have the Pantheon finally come to the conclusion that our planet is deemed unfit for their creation and needs to be re-originated. This could make the Burning Legion get even more Azeroth-savvy and try to squat two hated enemies (Azeroth & Pantheon) at the same time.

Blizzard has done a brilliant job with their lore for this expansion. It's the broadest and most epic of all expansions so far.

WHY CAN I NOT HOLD ALL THIS LORE?!

[meroko]

he definitely refers to Y'shaarj. The questing experience and dailies for Klaxxi reveal that he is beneath Pandaria, even though dead. I suspect he will be the one to potentially cause Garrosh to perform his "heinous act" and become the true end boss of MoP.

[Lethora]

And the chasm of darkness might be the Twisting Nether?

You clearly have no idea about what Twisting Nether is, don't you?

[krunksmash]

HE = lei shan. As for the darkness its most likely a reference to the 7th Sha, we know the old gods can't safely be " Killed" but you can destroy there physical body thereby preventing them from influencing the planet; Also, we know Y'shaarj was the old god that reigned over the lands of pandaria and all parts that now lie below the sea we also know that his body was shattered by a titan so it is hinted that the Sha are the remnants of the old gods physical body. the body is believed to have been shattered into 7 parts we have seen 6, the 7th is likely more powerful then the other 6 combined. this said I feel Ra'din was the titan that shattered Y'shaarj and that the darkness is the 7th sha that he is warning us of.

[Kazlofski]

Are we really stronger than Lei Shen? I know we will beat him but I am talking specifically about what Ra-Den says.... He says we are even more powerful than Lei Shen... Well Lei Shen solo'd him while we need 10/25 people to beat already injured and heartless Ra-Den, seems to me like Lei Shen is stronger :P (Despite the fact we beat him before Ra-Den...)

[Pickwickman]

Are we really stronger than Lei Shen? I know we will beat him but I am talking specifically about what Ra-Den says.... He says we are even more powerful than Lei Shen... Well Lei Shen solo'd him while we need 10/25 people to beat already injured and heartless Ra-Den, seems to me like Lei Shen is stronger :P (Despite the fact we beat him before Ra-Den...)

I don't know if Lei Shen is at his full power when we fight him. He died of old age and got resurrected by the trolls so maybe he isn't at full capacity yet. And as you say, Ra-den is still pretty beat up.