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  1. #221
    Out of curiosity, why do people defend Blizzard's horrible systems, even after Blizzard acknowledges they messed up?

    People should not be forced into something they don't want to do, which amounts to a huge time sink, to do what they want to do. Such as PvP to get the appropriate ilvl to progress in PvE. Why would anyone want those who don't want to/know how to PvP spamming bgs? They won't particularly learn about PvP, they simply won't enjoy themselves and will subsequently make winning the bg harder for those with them.

    Likewise, why should players have to grind months for the next tier of raid finder?

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Naidia View Post
    When time is a factor, it just turns into a silly idea. Hitting exalted to get that super-high ilvl item like a ring or something is something you should grind for, certain reps give certain items. The real choice is deciding on which rep you would [i]want]/i] to do, as it's always has been. If these items were purchased with gold, there would be little to no complaints, but the fact that we waste VP on them, they just blow it way out of proportion. Be smart, choose what to use your VP on.
    The valor really was the crux of it I think. If it was just gold I wouldn't care. If it was just gold and I could spend my valor on something as decent without feeling compelled to have to run dailies for the gear. Actually that would have provided people with ALOT to do. You have valor for gear and dailies so you can go ahead and do whatever the fuck you like as opposed to do dailies. It's basically double gating, which I guess continues in 5.2. Somebody got it in their head at Blizzard that double gating was this amazing idea when it's really just earning the privelege to spend the points you earn.

    Having said that I don't see why they can't fart around and change the existing rep gear model. Don't really see why choice can't be offered for each rep level. It's a real old and stale design and it could use some dressing up. You can make the ilvl of each piece scale with the reps. So if you buy a piece at honored let's say itll be 490 lets say and itl be a piece you need. Then you can pick another piece at revered at 515 and then at exalted same thing.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-01 at 09:44 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryve View Post
    Out of curiosity, why do people defend Blizzard's horrible systems, even after Blizzard acknowledges they messed up?

    People should not be forced into something they don't want to do, which amounts to a huge time sink, to do what they want to do. Such as PvP to get the appropriate ilvl to progress in PvE. Why would anyone want those who don't want to/know how to PvP spamming bgs? They won't particularly learn about PvP, they simply won't enjoy themselves and will subsequently make winning the bg harder for those with them.

    Likewise, why should players have to grind months for the next tier of raid finder?
    You wonder some times. Luckiest company in the universe.

  3. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonard McCoy View Post
    Rep tabards are an excellent way to go if you accept the idea that going slow is stupid. Actually I'm all for multiple ways of rep. Including tabards. I don't see why tabards have to preclude other ways of getting rep. If you like going slow and doing shitty dailies do them. I wouldn't deny you the crappy experience of daily quests, why do you feel it's necessary to deny me tabards?
    If we had rep tabards in MoP. We would have everything exalted and not enough VP to spend on things, thus taking the same amount of time to get the rewards offered. 1k valor cap per week, about 15k worth of valor needed to buy everything. Still would take around the same time of getting those rewards.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryve View Post
    Out of curiosity, why do people defend Blizzard's horrible systems, even after Blizzard acknowledges they messed up?
    No one is defending anything, it's a forum we're having a discussion and sharing our opinions on the matter at hand.

    Likewise, why should players have to grind months for the next tier of raid finder?
    If that's the case, again, simply solving the rep problem does not solve a thing, because you still need to grind months to get enough VP to buy anything to inch your ilvl up. Make those epics buyable with gold, then we'll be back to complaining that gear is too easy to get like Wrath and Cata.
    Last edited by Clockwork Pinkie; 2013-03-01 at 09:48 PM.


  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Leonard McCoy View Post
    Rep tabards are an excellent way to go if you accept the idea that going slow is stupid. Actually I'm all for multiple ways of rep. Including tabards. I don't see why tabards have to preclude other ways of getting rep. If you like going slow and doing shitty dailies do them. I wouldn't deny you the crappy experience of daily quests, why do you feel it's necessary to deny me tabards?
    I'll be okay with them adding rep tabards if they put a limit on how much rep you can get from them.
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  5. #225
    Out of curiosity, why do people defend Blizzard's horrible systems, even after Blizzard acknowledges they messed up?

    People should not be forced into something they don't want to do, which amounts to a huge time sink, to do what they want to do. Such as PvP to get the appropriate ilvl to progress in PvE. Why would anyone want those who don't want to/know how to PvP spamming bgs? They won't particularly learn about PvP, they simply won't enjoy themselves and will subsequently make winning the bg harder for those with them.

    Likewise, why should players have to grind months for the next tier of raid finder? Particularly when it's already a poorly set up system where it's entirely possible you could see no loot, or be frequently spammed with the same item week after week. Whether you think less of raid finder players or not, the system is supposed to be there for character/gear progression.

    Edit: Wow, laptop skitzed out when cat jumped on it, seems to have posted once while I was still typing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    I'll be okay with them adding rep tabards if they put a limit on how much rep you can get from them.
    Agreed. No more than 100k rep per faction per week seems fair.
    Last edited by Ryve; 2013-03-01 at 09:48 PM.

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by Naidia View Post
    Well, if you want a chance at bonus loot, you would be required to do something. Otherwise they'd just have it so you have a bonus chance on any boss of your choice that's only useable once a week. In which case I do see something like that happening at the end of this expansion as they go towards a new system for the next expansion.
    Yes but why does that something have to be boring activities like dailies? Why can't we have more options for lesser charms?

  7. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by Naidia View Post
    If we had rep tabards in MoP. We would have everything exalted and not enough VP to spend on things, thus taking the same amount of time to get the rewards offered. 1k valor cap per week, about 15k worth of valor needed to buy everything. Still would take around the same time of getting those rewards.
    Oh I agree valor gains need to be increased to. The absurd cap and the absurd low gains. No argument here.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-01 at 09:49 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    I'll be okay with them adding rep tabards if they put a limit on how much rep you can get from them.
    Why should that matter to you? You can still go slow. It's all optional right. What are you saying you won't touch your beloved dalies if theirs a better alternative? I am BLLLLLLLLLOWNN AWAY BY THAT. You must be kidding. Who would have thought...

    It's like most of you never did dailies before or something and then the developers made all the alternatives shitier and put an enorumsely compelling reward behind the dailies and called it a better design or something.
    Last edited by Leonard McCoy; 2013-03-01 at 09:53 PM.

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by Naidia View Post
    If we had rep tabards in MoP. We would have everything exalted and not enough VP to spend on things, thus taking the same amount of time to get the rewards offered. 1k valor cap per week, about 15k worth of valor needed to buy everything. Still would take around the same time of getting those rewards.
    Time isn't the issue. Its that we have to do daily quests. Which we hate.

  9. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    Yes but why does that something have to be boring activities like dailies? Why can't we have more options for lesser charms?
    It's a new system and they're testing it out, as the expansion goes on I'm sure they'll add more ways (hopefully) to get those charms. Could make dungeon bosses drop them.


  10. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by Baikalsan View Post
    And now to you trolls and fanboys. You were wrong all along, the new system has flaws and Blizzard admits it. You can go ahead and keep your dictionary open and grasp at definitions. But the fact remains that you lost and you can't deal with it.
    Same can be said for heroic 5-man difficulty, questing getting easier, new talent trees, Pandas, etc..... Just because Blizz says they miscalculated the playerbase response does not mean that people who did understand the intent were "wrong".

    Unless you mean that every time Blizz changes something, it is 100% correct, and anyone who believes otherwise is "wrong".

  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendragon View Post
    I'm honestly surprised they haven't brought back rep tabards for the whining babies, who were right all along, yet.
    Had to be said.

  12. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by SamR View Post
    So I guess in your view Cata made it mandatory for you to spend massive amounts of gold on the AH to buy the wrist enchant recipes, right? You do remember where wrist enchants in Cata came from, don't you?
    Your argument against me comes from the worst expansion in the game's lifespan? And, no, it wasn't "mandatory" for you to buy the wrist enchants via the AH. They were random drops coming from anything in dungeons to raids. That means the AH wasn't the ONLY place to get them.

  13. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stede View Post
    Had to be said.
    Right about what?

    Wrath > Epics are too easy to get, make them mean something. qq This was when ilvl first mattered for dungeon finder, not really big complaints as how many people wanted to grind dungeons, and for what reason?

    Cata > I don't like wearing blues, I want epics again, qq. Dungeon finder still ruled, not much QQ because raid finder was introduced at the end of the expansion, and by then, all we had to do was spam the new 5 mans for gear, not requiring any rep, jp, or vp.

    MoP > Epics require work to get, and I still don't like wearing blues. qq This is the first time we've had both LFD and LFR at launch, starting from scratch, there was going to be work required to get to that ilvl, which ever work it was, there would of been complaints.


  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    Your argument against me comes from the worst expansion in the game's lifespan? And, no, it wasn't "mandatory" for you to buy the wrist enchants via the AH. They were random drops coming from anything in dungeons to raids. That means the AH wasn't the ONLY place to get them.
    AH took RNG out of it. Just like rep takes RNG out of gear. I can see a correlation from that aspect. However, enchant recipes can be used to create enchants where you made the money back fairly quickly. So it has no correlation from that aspect.

  15. #235
    No one ever really gave a shit about dailies until Blizz had the bright idea to stick something related to raiding into dailies. Like that makes dailies more relevent or enjoyable.

    For the longest time people had options. You could do dailies to max rep in cata or grind dungeons if you choose? What's wrong with choices? All Ghostcrawler has done since WOTLK is take away your choices. Homogenized classes, boring quests, boring dailies, gating stories behind stupid dailies, and raid lockouts. There's a pattern here that everyone glosses over.

  16. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Naidia View Post
    Right about what?

    Wrath > Epics are too easy to get, make them mean something. qq This was when ilvl first mattered for dungeon finder, not really big complaints as how many people wanted to grind dungeons, and for what reason?

    Cata > I don't like wearing blues, I want epics again, qq. Dungeon finder still ruled, not much QQ because raid finder was introduced at the end of the expansion, and by then, all we had to do was spam the new 5 mans for gear, not requiring any rep, jp, or vp.

    MoP > Epics require work to get, and I still don't like wearing blues. qq This is the first time we've had both LFD and LFR at launch, starting from scratch, there was going to be work required to get to that ilvl, which ever work it was, there would of been complaints.
    Dungeons aren't work for many of us. Especially dungeons that were as rewarding as in cataclysm and in wrath. Funny enough they've simple moved the double dipping into raids now. It's fucking GREAT. I love it. I mean you can't really spam the raids but at least the rep is tied to an activity I want to do and would be doing anyway. Not going out of my fucking way to help tony panda Y deliver buns to his cousin.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-01 at 10:13 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by yjmark View Post
    AH took RNG out of it. Just like rep takes RNG out of gear. I can see a correlation from that aspect. However, enchant recipes can be used to create enchants where you made the money back fairly quickly. So it has no correlation from that aspect.
    No VALOR took the rng out of gear. Without the points you can't buy shit. The current system requires you to earn the privelege to spend the points you spent your time and effort into earning in whatever fashion.

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    Your argument against me comes from the worst expansion in the game's lifespan? And, no, it wasn't "mandatory" for you to buy the wrist enchants via the AH. They were random drops coming from anything in dungeons to raids. That means the AH wasn't the ONLY place to get them.
    Right, super rare random world drops. How Blizzard usually did some high end chants before. So you prefer hundreds of hours of mandatory random mob grinding for super rare chance at drop to getting exalted with a daily rep for your recipe.

    You don't like Cata, ok. You want to talk about vanilla or TBC? I remember helping a guildmate farm one of the Netherstorm instances because a certain enchant was a rare drop from trash mobs in that instance. He farmed that instance for months and I don't think he ever got the enchant in the end. According to you, it was mandatory for him to farm that instance a ridiculous number of times in hopes of getting that recipe drop.

    I'm starting to wonder if you've even played WoW before MoP. It is easier to get all your main enchanting recipes now than it has ever been in any expansion.
    Last edited by SamR; 2013-03-01 at 10:16 PM.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by Leonard McCoy View Post
    No VALOR took the rng out of gear. Without the points you can't buy shit. The current system requires you to earn the privelege to spend the points you spent your time and effort into earning in whatever fashion.
    Without the rep, you can't buy anything from the rep vendors either. So it is really a combo of the rep and valor. However, you can get valor through other means. Rep, only one way to do that.

    That was all I meant.

  19. #239
    Doing dailies basically guaranteed gear and this is why it felt force. If you are unlucky with rng, you IMO had to do dailies to offset this. Also IMO if you aren't doing dailies and you are sitting there with a piece of ilvl gear lower than the ones you can get with dailies you are IMO holding back your raid team. If you care about progressing, IMO you have to do dailies to offset any bad luck you have with gear drops. Are people telling me this "I am fine with my ilvl 476 gear", really? Sounds like you are if you don't want to do dailies. If you are, ok cool, but to others it isn't acceptable. To them not doing dailies holds them back and to those people it felt forced, especially if they have bad luck with rng.

  20. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by yjmark View Post
    Without the rep, you can't buy anything from the rep vendors either. So it is really a combo of the rep and valor. However, you can get valor through other means. Rep, only one way to do that.

    That was all I meant.
    Well currently yea. It took them like 6 months but they finally got it through their thick fucking heads that other things need to reward rep. In any event the greater crime still remains. I shouldn't have to earn rep to earn the privilege to spend the points I spent time earning. I earn the points I should be able to get a reward out of that that isn't tied to some other activity whatever the activity is.

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