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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by Souichirou View Post
    First you have no idea what your talking about since whey protein shakes are NOT artificial nutrients, Whey is the left over parts when making cheese then isolated from that to make the protein supplement. Second you get energy from carbs as your body uses it as a primary source of energy after your glycogen is burned away from physical activity. So if your just eating protein and fiber from veggies your gonna feel like crap with no energy even if its whole foods.
    Whey proteins certainly do have artificial additives. But there is nothing wrong with artificial additives anyways. Carbs are processed as glycogen... just what the fuck? Your body does not store carbs in itself. It stores energy as fat, glycogen, or protein. And you are wrong anyways. Your body can function just fine without any carbs. Lots of people utilize keto diets.

  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by jbhasban View Post
    Whey proteins certainly do have artificial additives. But there is nothing wrong with artificial additives anyways. Carbs are processed as glycogen... just what the fuck? Your body does not store carbs in itself. It stores energy as fat, glycogen, or protein. And you are wrong anyways. Your body can function just fine without any carbs. Lots of people utilize keto diets.
    If you've actually read what I've typed you would have seen I stated that your body uses carbs as a main source AFTER your glycogen is used up since its processed quicker then any other sources. Second yes people can function without carbs BUT it also causes problems if you completely cut it out of a diet. Thirdly a person who does nothing can probably cut out all carbs But an active person who plays sports or does martial arts or any kind of intense activity would not benefit from keto diets.

    Finally eating healthy and meeting daily macros is the simple most effective way to do anything whether trying to lose weight or gain without trying excessive and expensive diets, a keto diet consists of high protein and fat to make up for lack of carbs in the diet the cost would be vastly higher then just to eat right and working hard for results.

    P.S If you've read the post I quoted it was a means to refute their statement of whey protein being a completely artificial nutrient.
    Last edited by Souichirou; 2013-04-05 at 01:15 AM.

  3. #183
    Quote Originally Posted by Souichirou View Post
    If you've actually read what I've typed you would have seen I stated that your body uses carbs as a main source AFTER your glycogen is used up since its processed quicker then any other sources. Second yes people can function without carbs BUT it also causes problems if you completely cut it out of a diet. Thirdly a person who does nothing can probably cut out all carbs But an active person who plays sports or does martial arts or any kind of intense activity would not benefit from keto diets.

    Finally eating healthy and meeting daily macros is the simple most effective way to do anything whether trying to lose weight or gain without trying excessive and expensive diets, a keto diet consists of high protein and fat to make up for lack of carbs in the diet the cost would be vastly higher then just to eat right and working hard for results.

    P.S If you've read the post I quoted it was a means to refute their statement of whey protein being a completely artificial nutrient.
    I know many athletes who function just fine on a keto diet. I personally like carbs too much to give them up but to suggest that athletes do not utilize keto diets is false. As for carbs being utilized after your glycogen stores are processed... eh. Your body utilizes all energy pathways at the same time. Which energy gets used predominately depends on a lot of different factors including your level of fitness, how intense you are working out, and how warm your body is.

    Keto diets are superior to carb diets for people who are insulin resistant btw.

    As for his post... he said "these artificial nutrients" have hidden effects. These could refer to the whey, are you interpret it, or it could refer to the artificial nutrients found in every single whey protein on the market. To try and refute his point by pointing out that whey in itself is not artificial misses his point. His point was that any amount of artificial nutrients is bad whether or not everything in a whey supplement is artificial or not.
    Last edited by jbhasban; 2013-04-05 at 05:58 PM.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by jbhasban View Post
    I know many athletes who function just fine on a keto diet. I personally like carbs too much to give them up but to suggest that athletes do not utilize keto diets is false. As for carbs being utilized after your glycogen stores are processed... eh. Your body utilizes all energy pathways at the same time. Which energy gets used predominately depends on a lot of different factors including your level of fitness, how intense you are working out, and how warm your body is.

    Keto diets are superior to carb diets for people who are insulin resistant btw.

    As for his post... he said "these artificial nutrients" have hidden effects. These could refer to the whey, are you interpret it, or it could refer to the artificial nutrients found in every single whey protein on the market. To try and refute his point by pointing out that whey in itself is not artificial misses his point. His point was that any amount of artificial nutrients is bad whether or not everything in a whey supplement is artificial or not.
    Indeed true that keto diets are superior to carb diets for people with insulin resistant but the majority don't have that. As for whey yes some brands do use artificial additives but there are a lot of brands that are 100% naturally sweetened and if your using whey normally a 5lb tub will last you a month or less at best.

  5. #185
    Bulking requires calorie surplus. Cutting requires calorie deficit.

    You say " My main concern is losing weight", then you go on saying " I wouldn't mind sac x calories to help build muscle".

    Technically, you can't cut and bulk at the same time. You can lean bulk which essentially means that you're maintaining a low body fat retention while you bulk. But in order to cut, you have to use more calories than you take in which forces the body to canabalize your fat stores for energy and building blocks. In order to bulk, you've got to take in a mass amount of calories (like 4k+, give or take) and want all of those calories going towards your muscle building. If you're doing enough cardio to put yourself in the negative while bulking, you're essentially cheating yourself on the building process and, thus, not getting the maximum out of what you're wanting.

    Its better to just do a clean and lean bulk for a bit and then do a quick cut.

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 03:21 PM ----------

    And yes, it's worth it.

  6. #186
    Personally I don't think it's worth it,
    Chocolate milk is just as effective imo, there's a lot of proteins in it and if you mix it yourself you pretty much know what's in it too.
    Cálás EU Earthen Ring
    <Horde of the Night>

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by CalasEU View Post
    Personally I don't think it's worth it,
    Chocolate milk is just as effective imo, there's a lot of proteins in it and if you mix it yourself you pretty much know what's in it too.
    Clearly not as effective since Chocolate milk in general contains about 35-40 grams of sugar or more in a cup and most containers are more then just 235 ml. Also a cup of milk contains about 8 grams of protein and about 100-125 calories(skimmed or 1%), while 1 scoop of Isoflex protein powder mixed with water contains 111 calories and 30 grams of protein so it contains over 3x the protein for about the same calories.

    So its VASTLY greater, milk/chocolate milk also contains massive amounts of sugar for no reason aside from change of taste.
    Last edited by Souichirou; 2013-04-09 at 09:06 PM.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Souichirou View Post
    Clearly not as effective since Chocolate milk in general contains about 35-40 grams of sugar or more in a cup and most containers are more then just 235 ml. Also a cup of milk contains about 8 grams of protein and about 100-125 calories(skimmed or 1%), while 1 scoop of Isoflex protein powder mixed with water contains 111 calories and 30 grams of protein so it contains over 3x the protein for about the same calories.

    So its VASTLY greater, milk/chocolate milk also contains massive amounts of sugar for no reason aside from change of taste.
    *rolls eyes*

    It depends on what your purpose is. If your purpose is taste, chocolate milk is better. If your purpose is protein and nothing but protein, there are better things than whey (I have a cheese that is 98% protein, I have never seen a protein powder that refined).

    Not everyone cares about calories. I personally don't. It is easy enough to eat enough protein each day without protein powders.

    BTW, 111 calories with 30 grams of protein is indeed impressive. That is 9 calories less than is possible. They must have some sort of super low calorie protein. Maybe it like alcohol protein. That's a thing, right?

    BTW, a cup of skim milk is 86 calories if we want to be exact.
    Last edited by jbhasban; 2013-04-09 at 09:23 PM.

  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by jbhasban View Post
    *rolls eyes*

    It depends on what your purpose is. If your purpose is taste, chocolate milk is better. If your purpose is protein and nothing but protein, there are better things than whey (I have a cheese that is 98% protein, I have never seen a protein powder that refined).

    Not everyone cares about calories. I personally don't. It is easy enough to eat enough protein each day without protein powders.

    BTW, 111 calories with 30 grams of protein is indeed impressive. That is 9 calories less than is possible. They must have some sort of super low calorie protein. Maybe it like alcohol protein. That's a thing, right?

    BTW, a cup of skim milk is 86 calories if we want to be exact.
    Whats with all your posts taking things to the extreme? Yea sure, it depends on your purpose, but considering the topic is protein shakes don't you think the intention of the thread is aimed towards some sort of fitness or strength building, in which case, while not useless, chocolate milk isn't exactly a great solution unless one is doing a dirty bulk, which no one mentioned.

    98% protein cheese. I'd like to see that. I call bullshit, but would love to be proven wrong since it sounds so absurd (less than 2% water).

    This has been spin so absurdly out of control. There should really be nothing to discuss. Protein shakes, from whey based products, are undeniably the best source of protein, and in many cases also the cheapest. Science has shown, in regards to muscle protein synthesis that protein with high leucine content are more anabolic, hence 'higher quality' in the regards that it is the best suited source for the intent and purpose. Whey protein is the protein source highest in Leucine, hence the highest quality. Taste wise, you can get some really awesome tasting powders. It is convinient, it is cheap. No I'm not saying that is should replace normal meals, beef, chicken or other meats since you will still need the vitamins and minerals. But if you need a supplement.. Read again.. SUPPLEMENT, then indeed protein shakes are worth it.

  10. #190
    High Overlord BalwickZaik's Avatar
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    It's a supplement.

    i.e. If you don't get enough from food, yes, it's worth it.

    When I'm training, I can't really see myself being able to reach 200g a day without them.

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by Alton01 View Post
    But I always prefer natural food to get energy because these artificial nutrients have many other hidden side effects.
    What in the world is an "artificial nutrient"?

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    What in the world is an "artificial nutrient"?
    I imagine it is whatever constitutes "artificial flavor." I often see proteins advertised as having "natural & artificial flavoring" which would tend to indicate some of the flavoring is done through artificial additives (like splenda).

  13. #193
    So much misinformation here. Please consult a better informed place (personal trainer at your gym, reddit/r/fitness, etc.) for nutrition advise than this WOW forum. :-)

  14. #194
    Field Marshal Wiizper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minusmagier View Post
    So much misinformation here. Please consult a better informed place (personal trainer at your gym, reddit/r/fitness, etc.) for nutrition advise than this WOW forum. :-)
    Stop stereotyping everything.
    You can find idiots on any forums. Just because its a WoW forum doesnt mean people dont know what they're talking about.
    Sure there are people here that know nothing, but there are some that do know.
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  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by Minusmagier View Post
    So much misinformation here. Please consult a better informed place (personal trainer at your gym, reddit/r/fitness, etc.) for nutrition advise than this WOW forum. :-)
    NEVER talk to a PT about nutrition. They are not educated in the field.

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