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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    Success is relative. WoW lost a lot of subs after Mist. Am I to assume MOP = not succeeding? Rift did a very good job of survivng GW2. The lag at zone events is kind of high. Rift just launched recently in China and that is a huge market. The game is still growing despite popular belief.
    They also lost,what, 25% of their peak since cata? I'm pretty sure the genre is just fragmenting rather than anyone failing or winning or w/e. It's more complicated than that.
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by hk-51 View Post
    They also lost,what, 25% of their peak since cata? I'm pretty sure the genre is just fragmenting rather than anyone failing or winning or w/e. It's more complicated than that.
    I think you're right on that. It's fragmenting. Also, WoW is now 8+ years old. I would imagine Blizzard never imagined they'd still be astride the MMO world the way they still are after eight years. No matter what you think of their game, no one has managed to unseat them yet after 80% of a decade. A decade is a LONG time in computer gaming, but after 8 years, WoW still has 80% of its peak in subscribers (9.6 million out of 12 million peak as of 12/31/12), according to the last shareholder report. We can only hope that Rift is still doing that well (80% of peak) in six more years.

    Rift is doing very well in its niche, imo, but, it's also diversifying a little, because Trion has figured out that if you only cater to the niche, a niche is all you'll ever be.

    BTW, after Cata was the big loss, Pure. They got a bunch back for MoP launch, and had only lost ~4% of that number by 12/31/12, according to last shareholder report. Not the epic fail some were looking for. Pretty good for a 2004 game.
    Last edited by mavfin; 2013-03-04 at 10:43 PM.

  3. #23
    Just to be clear; I am not intimating Rift is failing/dying or is in dire straits. Merely getting the impression the sales of Storm Legion, regardless of quality, seem to have not been up to Trion's expectations.

    It's just a general feeling I get by the slowed production, layoffs, key devs leaving, class devs being shuffled, et cetera. Sort of a Everquest 2 pre-F2P vibe; small game, good game but appealing to a relative thin slice of the mass market.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    small game, good game but appealing to a relative thin slice of the mass market.
    I certainly hope the dev team wasn't hoping for anything but that. Beside, don't people think that rift has almost 500k or something? That's great imo. They should be happy and just focus on keeping their players happy.
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  5. #25
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    Success is relative. WoW lost a lot of subs after Mist. Am I to assume MOP = not succeeding? Rift did a very good job of survivng GW2. The lag at zone events is kind of high. Rift just launched recently in China and that is a huge market. The game is still growing despite popular belief.
    rift launched at china?thought is at beta phase

  7. #27
    Dreadlord Nykolas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thumpy View Post
    rift launched at china?thought is at beta phase
    I think its about to launch, hence all the chinese promos

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seatin View Post
    I am in the exact same position, I'm loving raiding at the moment, but as soon as I've cleared the hardmodes it's going to be what another 4 month dry spell before a decent 20 man?, they seem to be really lacking and going in the wrong direction with things at the moment.
    Yeah - I'm taking a bit of a break from logging in too much. I love the game, but I'm going to skip a patch or two to have a few things to catch up on. I'm subbed for a year anyways, but the 5.1 patch is lack-lustre and a glorified "hotfix" for us veterans. Severely lacking would the words I would use.

    It's not too late to fix things, but I wonder if Trion realizes that once you lose brand loyalty it is gone forever. They need to pull their fingers out their butts and sort themselves out.
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  9. #29
    I too have been feeling pretty underwhelmed with Storm Legion lately. I mean I'm not through all the content yet, still have Crucia and like half of EE to clear though with my new guild should have that done in the next week or so, but I still find myself almost not wanting to log in. I am not sure if it is burnout or not though, it doesn't feel the same as when I have hit burnout in the past. It could also be that I originally joined to play with friends and they ended up being far too controlling of my actions so I left their guild and went to another server. Been through a few guilds on the new server looking for a good fit and think I may have finally found it, though I thought that about the last guild too. It could also be that my RL is getting busier with a 2 year old and with thoughts of going back to school lately, Rift may have to go anyway. Then there's all the doom and gloom posts. I mean I am really starting to think if this many people are leaving, and big names too, something must be going on internally right? Probably not, probably just business as usual, it is all fairly standard fare for the industry, but the doom and gloom posts are starting to leave that doubt. So I am not sure if it is the game itself or me that is leaving me with this feeling that the game is just not as fun as it was.

    Looking at the features and the things coming out, yeah, they have been a little smaller than in the past but they are still great content patches with plenty to keep me busy, I just end up logging in and not staying busy. They have finally gotten real close on the balancing and still have some content pushing out quickly, though some of it does feel a little recycled. I mean PA3 should not have taken all that much, it was just expanding the system already in place. Same with the event, the groundwork was there already. Hopefully the next patch with Dendrome and a new Sliver will help bring back that feeling, but I fear I am either too far gone or it is too little too late. Again, can't really place my finger on if it is me or the game or some combination thereof.

    All that said, I still think Rift is the best MMO currently on the market and do not have any desire to play any other ones, not even WoW where my guild of over 4 years is still alive and running with a large portion of the original vanilla core raiders and a few more that joined in BC and never left. Of course there are some gone and some new, but it's mostly the same bunch I played with for over 4 years. I just think that Rift and maybe MMOs or just gameing in general is losing me.
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  10. #30
    The Patient eldritchforeshadow's Avatar
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    I am a WOW player only yet, I did play Rift for four months before I quit because it wasn't for me. I do have to say that the mmo is a good one and I hope it starts to get better for you. I like having another super successful mmo out there besides WOW and Rift is definitely successful. So, fans of Rift, whatever happens in the future of your game I hope it turns out for the best and content will just keep getting better. Even though you lost key people who worked on/with Rift, maybe that will turn into a good thing and new people will come in with fresh ideas and keep the game going for several more years. Good luck all.

  11. #31
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    I've stopped playing of late too. The terrible state of mages at launch for competitive PvE specs that required a savant octopus to play (yet somehow at the same time they're mostly 61pt specs with no room for experimentation, RIP Chloro-hybridism), the god awful rep grinds, the lack of variety in dungeons and world events, it's just so meh. I'm also finding the terrible PvP and crappy CC in this game to be a real deal breaker. They should have waited six more months and launched with more end zone invasions, more dungeons, both of the raids and the hard modes ready to go, and have had more time for testing and feedback.

    I'm taking a break and seeing how the next couple patches pan out, especially given the recent departures and rumors of internal issues.

    Sadly there aren't many other MMOs that interest me. WoW getting back into things with double digit boss raid tiers makes me think about that, but honestly I cannot imagine myself enjoying that game in it's current dumbed down state, so I'll just stick to playing on private TBC servers for now I think until something interests me again.
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  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarien View Post
    I've stopped playing of late too. The terrible state of mages at launch for competitive PvE specs that required a savant octopus to play (yet somehow at the same time they're mostly 61pt specs with no room for experimentation, RIP Chloro-hybridism), the god awful rep grinds, the lack of variety in dungeons and world events, it's just so meh. I'm also finding the terrible PvP and crappy CC in this game to be a real deal breaker. They should have waited six more months and launched with more end zone invasions, more dungeons, both of the raids and the hard modes ready to go, and have had more time for testing and feedback.

    I'm taking a break and seeing how the next couple patches pan out, especially given the recent departures and rumors of internal issues.

    Sadly there aren't many other MMOs that interest me. WoW getting back into things with double digit boss raid tiers makes me think about that, but honestly I cannot imagine myself enjoying that game in it's current dumbed down state, so I'll just stick to playing on private TBC servers for now I think until something interests me again.
    Rogues are not in a great state either. I mean yeah, we have our specs that top DPS but there is little variety. Most of the time you are 61MM, very little choice for Ranged ST. Some fights and strats do call for the AoE Tact/MM spec though, so we have that and on Melee friendly fights you have the option of NB or Sin. What about Ranger and Bladedancer? Rogue tanks are in a pretty good spot, but again, no variation on the spec really, to be expected though since we only have the one tank soul. For support, I feel we are in a weird place to say the least. Bard is still good and needed however, do you go 61 Bard and give up some healing or go Bard/Tact Hybrid and have better healing though less DPS and lose what is arguably the best buff. Then you have full Tact, who cannot bring all the bard buffs/debuffs but can provide better healing than either of the previous two. Which support should use can change on a fight by fight basis as you may need to extra healing one fight but the extra DPS the next. I think Tact really kinda messed us up and screwed with the identity of Bard Support Role. I don't mind switching specs, but when I need 3 for DPS(61MM, NB/Sin and Tact/MM) then 3 for support(61Bard, Bard/Tact, 61Tact) where are my tank, PvP and Solo specs supposed to fit in? What I have done is have 61MM, Tact/MM, 61Bard, Tank, Solo, PvP but then if someone that has the other ones when they are needed doesn't show, I am left having to swap mid-raid.

    It's almost as if there is just too much. I understand, that's what some people want, but with all the rep, marks and now PA grinds it's getting to be too much. The fact that so much of it is no longer fun cause I've already done it 100 times makes it worse. I want something new and exciting again. I want to see some Master Mode dungeons, that give good rep. I want to see a new 10-man, that gives rep. I want to see more variety in zone events, that potentially include something to do with Hunt Rifts, that give more rep. A new conquest map would be nice too. I also want to see hybrids brought back. Other than Tact/MM it seems like all of our viable DPS specs are 61pt, with few options in the low tiers for those other 15 points.

    I dunno, this is just some things, there is more too and I just cannot place my finger on it. It seems like guilds are all recruiting though, which can be a good sign but I am starting to see it as a bad sign. All the guilds are suffering from attrition, people leaving due to getting bored. I see it on my friends list too, less people on every week. I used to have 15-20 friends on at a time, now it's like 5, and that's cause I added 2 new people last week. All the guilds I have been in have troubles fielding 20 players night after night. Recruitment is tough because it seems most people are in a guild with the same problems and want to stick it out with their guild, I can't blame them either. Merges are turning out poorly cause everyone is really only 3-6 players short, so a merge leaves a lot of people left to sit. It really shouldn't be this hard to find a guild that is raiding in what is supposed to be the easiest tier. It's not really all that easy and is breaking some guilds. The gear is no longer really worth it either, the latest update to raid gear helped some, but it just feels like gear has the least impact on my DPS than spec and rotation. Rotation should have one of the largest effects but spec should not. There should be a wide variety of viable specs and there just is not. I'm not saying a piece of gear should raise your DPS by 1k or anything like that, but when going from Expert gear set with crystal to Raid set with a crystal we should see a very noticeable difference and it's really just a minor difference beyond the set bonus.

    I don't know if I even have a point anymore, but all this on top of Daglar calling it quits just does not seem to bode well to me personally. Again, I see that this is industry standard and that more than likely it means nothing, but that doubt is there now and I just don't think much can be done about it.

    I'm not usually one to be so negative, especially about Rift, so I will end this by saying once again I still think Rift beats the competition hands down in just about every way possible.
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  13. #33
    Pains me to say, but patching wow again..... quit 2 years ago for Rift, the lackluster 2.2 patch (4hardmodes and crap festival event) is nail in the coffin for my guild, compared to wow 5.2, 14 new bosses..... wow really has stepped up the raiding game since there's more mmo's out there.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lathais View Post
    but all this on top of Daglar calling it quits just does not seem to bode well to me personally.
    When did Daglar quit? I've seen no news of his leaving.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Ofoz View Post
    When did Daglar quit? I've seen no news of his leaving.
    umm, oops, yeah, Hal Hanlin, not Daglar, ignore me.
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  16. #36
    ugh, Zynga endless buy 2 win pointless facebook games right? nothing good comes from there.

  17. #37
    I find it somewhat comforting to know that a lot of the 'RIFT Vets' so to speak, other than myself are having pretty much the exact same issues and feelings towards the state of the game at the moment as I am, I think we've all been kicked pretty hard with the expectations management for Storm Legion, it was bigged up to be this massive expansion adding two new continents only to be left with a fair bit of disappointment.

    To myself at least a lot of the zones feel quite empty and lackluster, quest lines felt extremley rushed and your streamlined in one direction, Storm Legion was initially advertised as having douzens of ways and paths to level, in the end to level 'viably' the only way was really to do the Quest lines, which if didn't even carry you all the way to level 60 without having to do other activities, which sort of 'forced you' to do a bit of everything, as previously mentioned I no-lifed to get to 58 only to complete the 5-7 quests in Ashora and Steppes and was left at 58 and a half to grind another 10 Million odd exp, nowadays those last couple of Levels are mostly done by Grinding Hunt RIFTS.

    There is no real incentive to go back and do zone achievements, The game feels like it's lost its 'character' for example a lot of the Artifact sets in Storm Legion are just totally random, with pretty much every single artifact set in Chocolate RIFT you could relate it to some Quest Line or NPC that you had in some way been involved with and it would give you a quick smile as a lot of the Artifact sets poked fun at stuff, I generally have only seen one maybe two sets in Storm Legion I can relate to, adding on to the fact that Artifacts are so so rare and hard to find in Storm Legion, this has really killed any incentive to hunt Artifacts, one of the things I quite enjoyed.

    The Raids and Dungeons Team from what I've heard has been taken from 6-7 Staff down to 2 (Cyzo and Halvon), possibly 3 (Unsure if Adam is there still, but Doctapus, Krunkatron and Hostage have gone), so I have a real bleak outlook for any content coming any time soon, If there is another 20 man raid, I don't expect it to be any longer than 5 bosses, which looks set to be a real disappointment.

    With the Employment of Dahanese and Overload_UT who let's be brutually honest don't know a thing or get involved with the community and apparently just got employed for their connections in the company and the dismissal of Walshingham and Zann, the community has gone to s***, I love Elrar dearly but he always seems to be to caught up probably filling the roles of both Walsh and Zann. Also they need to get a EU community manager and sort out the EU marketing for RIFT, Chiara Woolford is lovely, but she is having to focus on all four Trion titles and really does not have time for it, after 2 years 99.9% of the UK don't know what RIFT is.

    My predicition is within 2 months RIFT will be on a free to play model, which I'm actually quite looking foward to, Judging from what I've recently seen from TERA it will be nothing but a good thing for the game and helping to re-populate it.
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  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Seatin View Post
    I find it somewhat comforting to know that a lot of the 'RIFT Vets' so to speak, other than myself are having pretty much the exact same issues and feelings towards the state of the game at the moment
    You don't speak for me, i've been playing since Beta 4, have seen them come, seen them go, all these "awesomesauce" MMO's and look where they are now

    If you're unhappy, stop playing, log off, leave it behind. You don't see me posting on any WoW forum, SW: ToR, TERA, AION etc whining about how that game is now "boring" and has lost it's way. I stopped playing them, uninstalled the games and that was that.

    Soon as i find Rift failing to deliver what I consider to be interesting content or going down a path I don't find appealing, i'll quit, simple as that, but you wouldn't find me here or on the Rift forum whining about it

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Slipmat View Post
    You don't speak for me, i've been playing since Beta 4, have seen them come, seen them go, all these "awesomesauce" MMO's and look where they are now

    If you're unhappy, stop playing, log off, leave it behind. You don't see me posting on any WoW forum, SW: ToR, TERA, AION etc whining about how that game is now "boring" and has lost it's way. I stopped playing them, uninstalled the games and that was that.

    Soon as i find Rift failing to deliver what I consider to be interesting content or going down a path I don't find appealing, i'll quit, simple as that, but you wouldn't find me here or on the Rift forum whining about it
    Yea but your a hardcore casual on a never ending quest to find lucky charms Slipmat I also said a lot, not all, I do understand that some people are still enjoy there time, I'm enjoying raiding and being the GM of Heresy at the moment, I just don't have to much incentive to log on and grind other stuff!
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  20. #40
    Warchief theWocky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slipmat View Post
    You don't speak for me, i've been playing since Beta 4, have seen them come, seen them go, all these "awesomesauce" MMO's and look where they are now

    If you're unhappy, stop playing, log off, leave it behind. You don't see me posting on any WoW forum, SW: ToR, TERA, AION etc whining about how that game is now "boring" and has lost it's way. I stopped playing them, uninstalled the games and that was that.

    Soon as i find Rift failing to deliver what I consider to be interesting content or going down a path I don't find appealing, i'll quit, simple as that, but you wouldn't find me here or on the Rift forum whining about it
    I agree with your sentiment to a degree, but unless you speak out - and Trion visit these forums - nothing will ever improve. Nothing gets done if people don't complain.

    Some people genuinely want the game to succeed - I know I do! Seatin was launching a Rift web site as far as I know, so he's obviously disappointed to see his passion for the game pissed on by a game standard that has dropped. Even the PR excitement for the game seems to have dropped. It's just depressing.

    Defending a game in spite of its failings is never a good thing. This is what a fanboy does - and goodness - I've certainly been called that in my passionate defense of the game, but developers need to be screamed at if they screw up - and they are screwing up. Content is lack-lustre as far as delivery of content goes.

    Honestly, this patch 2.2 is nothing but a glorified hotfix.
    Last edited by theWocky; 2013-03-06 at 04:51 PM.
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