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  1. #401
    We're also having issues on this boss, almost feel like bringing my alt healer monk for just for that op revival raid cleanse.

  2. #402
    Enjoy Durumu if you think Horridon is "difficult"

    Please be more considerate. Please refer to the warning on previous page. -Azshira
    Last edited by Azshira; 2013-03-07 at 11:26 PM.

  3. #403
    Brewmaster Kiry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by land View Post
    We're also having issues on this boss, almost feel like bringing my alt healer monk for just for that op revival raid cleanse.
    Dont blame you, been thinking of bringing in my shadowpriest just for the diseases. Less dps but more utility for the raid to use just to get past this.

    To the poster (Harzaka) above me, we aren't talking about other bosses. I'm sure we'll get there in time. This is about this one. Thanks for helping

    To Zoldor: I dont know how you define as a serious raider. I think that isn't part of this equation. It's the boss mechanics and how to get past them. And yes.....a little frustration venting in the mix.
    Last edited by Kiry; 2013-03-07 at 10:07 PM.
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  4. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiry View Post
    12 bosses on normal. 2nd boss kill = 17% not 25%. We expected at 500 level to be able to clear the 2nd at least.

    If we theorize that the LFR requirement is 480, then the normal requirement is probably 490 - 495. 2nd boss doesn't appear to be 490 content for 10 man. Again, most if not all of the frustration in this thread is from the 10 mans. Which appears to be overtuned either in mob number, mob health or what disease, ability or etc they throw out.
    So getting to boss 3, 25% into the raid, would have been fine to be stuck on? Or would you have felt that you should be beyond that point too? Where is the line for where a boss should be if you are geared enough? I bet you beat this fight easily in the next week after you really look into whats going on in your raid. Making sure DPS is doing its job and not crutching on heals to just dispell it. The fight isn't easy and it shouldn't be, but I don't think its a brick wall that needs to be hotfixed, unless something is working incorrectly, I think folks just gotta look at the strat and put in a few kills and they'll get it. Its literally 3 days away from the launch. You could of had folks with bad addons messing up their timers or timing etc, people adjusting to new class changes and priority and stat changes.

  5. #405
    Maybe this will help some of you guys to get the concept ... we just called it a night. Having killed the lootmonster on the 3rd pull, we were "afraid" about horridon. Mostly because of this thread. We ended up killing him on our 4th pull. (The amazing tip blowing bl on the 3rd door is really what it made for us). Having said that -- this is 10 man 5/16 hc last tier. average ilvl 495.
    Stay focused and it will fall over.

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by Judaest View Post
    There is absolutely no way that this would make sense to any competitive raider.

    Its also veeeery easy to say that when you're already comfortable at the top, but when you're sequestered out of relevance with almost no chance of fighting your way back up in time to be in the top 10 it really kinda sucks. That doesn't mean we're gonna stop fighting, just means a higher turn over rate due to progression and having to try to replace people with less than stellar progression to sell your guild with. Life at the top has its drawbacks, but by and large is much easier
    You're calling yourself a competitive raider but stuck on Horridon?

    Honestly, everyone here needs to relax and take a breath. Remember, Blizzard has already said that they don't retune fights (generally) during the week and will likely address this on Tuesday. What does this mean? Guilds who find the fight difficult will be able to overcome it, and guilds that were able to surpass it will be given an easier boss for their farming.

    What I'm sure the people who have cleared through Horridon are worried and annoyed about is that we are complaining about the second boss. The second of twelve. I know this will probably happen regardless, but I'd love for this to be the last "X is overturned." Council, Tortos, Megaera, and so on all require more of the players in different ways than Horridon does. It's going to get old quickly to see everyone crying when their guild that cleared 16/16 normals cannot progress. How long did it take your guild to clear the other bosses? You're telling me that night one you cleared all of MSV? No. You didn't. You MAYBE got to or through Feng and called it an evening. The first week had you blocked at Elegon. Will took until after Heart of Fear was released. Be realistic and recognize that maybe you need to rethink instead of blindly pushing forward.

    We had 15 Horridon wipes. Our DK says "what if we try this?" Next attempt was a kill. The same story goes for the next several bosses to follow. Instead of simply eating and counting down, stop and ask what can be done differently to push past the block. Execute and see if it helps. Don't come complaining. It's obnoxious.

  7. #407
    Brewmaster Kiry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoldor View Post
    So getting to boss 3, 25% into the raid, would have been fine to be stuck on? Or would you have felt that you should be beyond that point too? Where is the line for where a boss should be if you are geared enough? I bet you beat this fight easily in the next week after you really look into whats going on in your raid. Making sure DPS is doing its job and not crutching on heals to just dispell it. The fight isn't easy and it shouldn't be, but I don't think its a brick wall that needs to be hotfixed, unless something is working incorrectly, I think folks just gotta look at the strat and put in a few kills and they'll get it. Its literally 3 days away from the launch. You could of had folks with bad addons messing up their timers or timing etc, people adjusting to new class changes and priority and stat changes.
    Good question. I will say after two days of working on this boss, and tonight being the third...we're frustrated. Add to the bridge mini-boss. It just isn't fun. Part of our issues is comp, we admit that. We're a 10 man with slim pickings for classes. We were also 6HC....so should we really be having this much trouble? We question that trouble, and question if it's tuned for 10s.
    With this many posters and threads going on about this boss, there is a trend that maybe, just maybe it's a bit overtuned....again for 10s.
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  8. #408
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harzaka View Post
    Enjoy Durumu if you think Horridon is "difficult"
    You have yet to actively add anything of substance throughout this entire discussion.

    Yes, we know you were 16/16H before this tier started. Yes, we know your raid can muscle most of the new content. We got it, there about 150 other posts just like yours. Why do you feel the need to keep regurgitating this?

    Since you are clearly superior to every other raider. How about you break down the fight and give tips or tricks to beating the encounter 'Oh almighty raider.
    --------------------------------------------------

    Back on topic if we can get the idiots to stop posting the same drivel. My guild consistently gets to open the 3rd door but we keep having issues with DPS failing to interrupt the priests. This is probably the only thing holding us back but I'm not sure. We three heal with a monk, dru and holy priest.

    When p2 starts, we get one bloodlord and about 10 seconds later 1 priest. Roughly 10 seconds after that we get 2 more priests along with the other regular waves of adds. Is this normal? I was under the impression that the adds were supposed to be staggered 10 - 30 - 50.

    Also, I was trying to get our raid to burst down the Effulsions as fast as possible. Is it better to burn down the priests first? Or burn the first priest then control the other priests while burning the effulsions?

    Those that are at or about 500 ilvl, what kind of dps (numbers wise) are you seeing. We had 2 above 100k (lock/mage) and the rest were between 60-75k (feral/fury/rogue). I am curious to see where we stand. Both tanks (I am one of the tanks) are doing 68-80k. Seems the bear is doing a tad more than me as a prot pal. Of course I am spending an inordinate amount of time controlling all of the adds. Fun when sand or poison is in my way.

  9. #409
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    It took us a while but we managed to kill him tonight. We popped heroism on the 3rd door, and healed through the debuffs until the mobs are all down. Only dispelled the people having 8+ stacks. On the 4th door make sure to kill the casters, we had a few tries where the casters were forgotten and killed our healers. After that you should be able to kill him, we did it in just over 2 minutes left with the boss on 87% after Jalak died.

  10. #410
    Brewmaster Kiry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scinder View Post
    When p2 starts, we get one bloodlord and about 10 seconds later 1 priest. Roughly 10 seconds after that we get 2 more priests along with the other regular waves of adds. Is this normal? I was under the impression that the adds were supposed to be staggered 10 - 30 - 50.

    Also, I was trying to get our raid to burst down the Effulsions as fast as possible. Is it better to burn down the priests first? Or burn the first priest then control the other priests while burning the effulsions?
    I know while we haven't killed him, we are getting to the last door regularly, just messy.
    We assign interupts. Yes you kill the first priest, then two drop immediately after. Two melee on the priests, ranged split off to the effulsions (if any). I swap to the dino to interupt when he pops.
    Best thing is to have no or minimal poison volleys go off.

    We BL on the frost door, focus fire on the dino add when he drops. there are rumors of too many adds for 10s on that door, this is how most are getting through it.

    good luck!
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  11. #411
    Quote Originally Posted by Tax View Post
    How many hours are we expected to be logged into wow to farm?
    What I mean is that you shouldn't be expecting to progress in T15 if you haven't pushed any heroics in T14 yet. I don't mean farm T14 AND progress on T15 in the same week (unless you have time for that), sorry if that was unclear. But people are in here at 12/16 normal, 15/16 normal, etc. expecting to move on to the next tier because Blizzard made Cataclysm's progression system (and most of Wrath's) absolutely retarded. People should still be progressing in T14 heroics, and maybe killing JinRohk on the side since hes undertuned. My guild was only 6/16H last tier (5/6H MV 1/6H HoF) and we downed Horridon on 10 man (got consistently to last phase on 25 man but didnt have time to kill him). If your guild goes back, kills some bosses in H HoF or H Terrace with the nerfs, and bonus rolls with the absurd amount of charms you get now, you should be geared enough to kill Horridon in a week or two. Definitely within the month you'll have the gear to roll through the next few bosses.
    Stop thinking of the tiers separately. They're not anymore, its continuous progression in a sense now, like BC was (not quite as harsh though).

  12. #412
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoldor View Post
    Well yeah, but no die hard serious raider is all that stuck on Horridon normal mode. According to wowprogress no one in the top 1000 guilds is stuck on boss 2 (most of the on 4 before the weekend). I got tired of going back from here. Of course a competitive raider would grasp that statements context. They also won't be complaining that boss 2 is overtuned.
    I'm only talking 'competitive' on a server level (one step at a time). But what youre saying is that a guild cant consider themselves 'competitive' if they weren't afforded the opportunity to gear themselves to the teeth in T14 and get a jump-start on the new content? Once you've fallen behind you lose the chance for the entire xpac?

    All I'm saying is that it kind of sucks that the second boss of a new tier is the juggernaut for 98% of all 10m guilds under ilvl 500. Its forcing <500 ilvl raiders into lfr to farm gear, (or go back to T14 to farm - which will invariably incite a mutiny) which I believe bliz has said they don't want.

    Side note - I, personally am not a fan of push over content - I like feeling like Ive accomplished something most other people cant (don't we all?). And am not 100% behind the 'over-tuned' argument. I do feel that the 10/30/30 is bugged. No nerfs, with the 10/30/50 spawn rate seems appropriate for the 2nd boss of a new tier.

    Still wish bliz would nut-up and let us know what the deal is - good, bad, or ugly

  13. #413
    Quote Originally Posted by bclumas View Post
    We had 15 Horridon wipes. Our DK says "what if we try this?" Next attempt was a kill. The same story goes for the next several bosses to follow. Instead of simply eating and counting down, stop and ask what can be done differently to push past the block. Execute and see if it helps. Don't come complaining. It's obnoxious.
    Exactly this. Learn the mechanics, analyze your problem and try to figure out a way to fix it. The item level isn't the problem. 496 to 500 isn't a huge jump in dps, however if you have 500 you are probably more use to heroics and learning new fights by adapting to mechanics which is what is actually making the difference.

    If you can't get this guy yet, don't worry. Blizzard said they put LFR (last part) back because they want a large amount of normal mode raiders to see the end before they see it on LFR, so blizzard is expecting these 12 bosses to last a rather large amount of the normal mode guilds 5 weeks. If they intended you to clear it in 2-3 weeks after doing 16/16 normal, they wouldn't have given you 5.

    Also while I agree "lol this is easy my 16/16H guild 1 shot it... trash is harder" comments aren't constructive, neither are the "omg this is overtuned and impossible" comments. If this boss is giving you a problem, explain specifically what is wiping you so you can get advice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judaest View Post
    I'm only talking 'competitive' on a server level (one step at a time). But what youre saying is that a guild cant consider themselves 'competitive' if they weren't afforded the opportunity to gear themselves to the teeth in T14 and get a jump-start on the new content? Once you've fallen behind you lose the chance for the entire xpac?

    All I'm saying is that it kind of sucks that the second boss of a new tier is the juggernaut for 98% of all 10m guilds under ilvl 500. Its forcing <500 ilvl raiders into lfr to farm gear, (or go back to T14 to farm - which will invariably incite a mutiny) which I believe bliz has said they don't want.
    Once you have fallen behind, no you shouldn't be behind the entire xpac. You also should not expect to catch up without putting in a lot more work than the people currently above you do. If you really push hard this tier, you can clear it all on heroic if your raiders have the skill and at that point you are caught up 100%.

    And its not all 10m guilds under 500, some people have posted in that range saying they got it or are really close. Blizzard NEVER said anything about not wanting people who are clearly behind on gear (you yourself said your raid was) doing lfr for gear. They said those decked out from the previous tier shouldn't need to feel obligated to do it. From what you have said, you are not in that category.
    Last edited by Sesshou; 2013-03-07 at 10:28 PM.

  14. #414
    Best thing that helped us is popping hero to get rid of the hardest door the quickest, so we ended up popping hero on the frost mobs. After we got the 3rd door down the first time we downed it. Once you get the 4 doors down it is very easy, just realize the tanks will be taking huge spike damage at the end of it.

    Also, if you are having trouble with the poison have 2 reliable interrupters to be on the 2 new venom priests that jump down full-time. The other dps should be able to get rid of the dinomancer quick enough.

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiry View Post
    10 mans just need a slight reduction or changing of the debuffs. It's pretty punishing for us. The fight in general is fine, just the management of the cleansing for a small scale raid. Not sure.
    The cleansing isn't any better on 25 man if you don't stack the right comp.

  16. #416
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiry View Post
    I know while we haven't killed him, we are getting to the last door regularly, just messy.
    We assign interupts. Yes you kill the first priest, then two drop immediately after. Two melee on the priests, ranged split off to the effulsions (if any). I swap to the dino to interupt when he pops.
    Best thing is to have no or minimal poison volleys go off.

    We BL on the frost door, focus fire on the dino add when he drops. there are rumors of too many adds for 10s on that door, this is how most are getting through it.

    good luck!
    Yeah. We haven't gotten to p3 without dragging at least 7-9 adds with us. Again that doesn't seem normal as p1 we have none and p2 we have 1-3 max.

  17. #417
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aerruss View Post
    Please do not make a 2-line post with your 16/16H (or anything similar with a 500+ ilvl) character saying "Not overtuned; 1-shot him". It's either bragging or trolling and neither is welcome. Thanks.
    My guild never killed anything heroic in Toes and had very bad progress overall in t14. we killed him in 3 tries. So id think its Very undertuned most of our raiders are lfr geared.

  18. #418
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drarion View Post
    My guild never killed anything heroic in Toes and had very bad progress overall in t14. we killed him in 3 tries. So id think its Very undertuned most of our raiders are lfr geared.
    Are you a 10 man or 25 man. 25 man is SIGNIFICANTLY easier than 10 man. I spoke with the 25 man guilds on my server last night and they all said it was really simple.

  19. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by Saiyoran View Post
    What I mean is that you shouldn't be expecting to progress in T15 if you haven't pushed any heroics in T14 yet. I don't mean farm T14 AND progress on T15 in the same week (unless you have time for that), sorry if that was unclear. But people are in here at 12/16 normal, 15/16 normal, etc. expecting to move on to the next tier because Blizzard made Cataclysm's progression system (and most of Wrath's) absolutely retarded. People should still be progressing in T14 heroics, and maybe killing JinRohk on the side since hes undertuned. My guild was only 6/16H last tier (5/6H MV 1/6H HoF) and we downed Horridon on 10 man (got consistently to last phase on 25 man but didnt have time to kill him). If your guild goes back, kills some bosses in H HoF or H Terrace with the nerfs, and bonus rolls with the absurd amount of charms you get now, you should be geared enough to kill Horridon in a week or two. Definitely within the month you'll have the gear to roll through the next few bosses.
    Stop thinking of the tiers separately. They're not anymore, its continuous progression in a sense now, like BC was (not quite as harsh though).
    Excuse me what? Where and how? I dont know what you're talking about, I havent noticed elder charms dropping anywhere and I've been doing the dailies ever since patch-day.

  20. #420
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    We went in, our RL told us that Boss 1 is supposed to be the hardest one.
    15mins later we distributed loot.

    After that we had fun with the trash for .. don't know, half an hour minimum. (Seriously, what sadist designed this crap?! )
    The rest of the 2.25hrs were spent on Horridon.

    - Kick Poison spam priests & down them ASAP
    - Tank dino in the middle, do not pull him close to the raid, do not damage him as long as adds are there
    - Avoid the blue orbs, have the tank move the stack of adds a bit so Orbs get spread out, makes it easier to navigate
    - EVERYONE who can dispel should dispel
    - Nuke troll add, use raid CDs for AE
    - Nuke dino last.

    We are not hardcore, we barely managed to get 6/16HC in 25man.
    Depending on your group comp, this boss has the potential to be a nightmare on 10m, due to debuff schools. Evtl Blizzard will convert them all to magic for 10m?
    I don't think this boss is overtuned. It's the first boss that is ABSURDLY undertuned.

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