1. #2241
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Use whatever fight mechanics dictate as the best choice. The DPS difference is negligible.
    Being a scrub who too often forgets to switch my pet's target (more than once a raidweek is too much), I'm sticking with Sac. Well, being a scrub and also because there are so many fights where you can havoc/shadowburn like a beast, I figure the heavy mastery then crit build works strong with Sac.
    --
    Boub called me a fanboy
    --
    #SaveDrainSoul #TakeMaleficGraspInstead

  2. #2242
    Quote Originally Posted by Obikwan View Post
    Hey guys,

    I have a question. Keep in mind my iLVL is quite low as we have been just getting back from a very long summer break and I am still lacking the Cloak. Using both the new Simcraft 5.40-2 default APL and the one Brusalk posted a couple of pages ago I get the following "counter-intuitive" results:

    Destro Sims higher than all 3 specs using the following parameters:

    I am currently reforged/gemmed for the 9778 Haste BP for Affliction.
    And using the Legendary Meta Gem.

    Talents for each spec are:
    Affliction - Suprem/AD
    Demo - Serv/AD
    Destro - Suprem/KJC

    The results I get are:
    Destro - NT-Wush (2/2) FBindings (2/2) - 141K DPS - Haste > Master >= Crit
    Affliction - NT-Wush (2/2) NBotH (2/2) - 134K DPS - Mastery >= Haste >> Crit
    Demo - NT-Wush (2/2) NBotH (2/2) - 126K DPS - Master = Crit > Haste

    My questions are:
    1. Why does haste come up as the best stat for Destro? Is it my low iLVL gear?
    2. If I want to run an Affliction/Destro setup would re-gemming all slots to Mastery yield better results for Destro (despite the sims) and how much of a loss would it be for affliction? Regemming would result in a net loss of haste at the 2-2.3K ballpark.

    (Also please feel free to add any mistakes you may see in my char )

    My armory is:
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...dicus/advanced


    On a side note which is not really Destro related would a Crit = Mastery > Haste priority be viable for a Demo/Destro setup?
    Destro scales worse than the other specs, but has a higher base damage. As a result with less gear Destro does better. The more gear you get the better Aff/Demo will be though. (Well, Aff now)

    Crit = Mastery > Haste would be a viable co-setup. You lose a bit of damage on fights with a lot of Shadowburn usage, but I wouldn't say it's bad.

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    Quote Originally Posted by icedlight View Post
    First off I wanted to thank Brusalk for the ongoing efforts in representing Destro.

    By leaning towards heavier mastery and maintaining some level of crit while generally dumping haste I have found overall general improvement with Destro. I swapped out my headpiece for a timeless piece recently and put in a normal Meta with again further gain overall.

    Having said all that after killing Ordos a few times (stingy bas^%$ wont give me his loots) I have definitely noted in a fight like this style, the loss of haste is a drop in dps. I don't have all of the exact information handy but on the first 2 kills I was still heavy haste and using the Legendary meta, both kills yielded close to under/over 200k dps, my most recent attempt in my current setup dropped down to about 186k. Of course RnG and potential mess ups on my part can of course be the actual issue but I have seen this be the case even just killing mobs on the Isle where that haste proc on a single target + improved haste seems to remain more potent for pure single target.

    Ultimately most fights in SoO are not going to be a single target style which is why I am seeing this build as a general improvement.

    I am definitely seeing Destro as being ...clunky on certain fights and was starting to work on Demo, I really only have a couple of spare pieces of gear that I can swap into for demo but I am assuming my best bet is to reforge all crit to haste and swap into my helm with the legendary meta?

    Thanks in advance
    The thing about heavy Mastery is that your damage will vary greatly based off of your ability to use your embers at the optimal time. With less Embers and a bigger discrepancy between buffed and unbuffed Chaos Bolts it requires a lot more player skill to play with heavy Mastery and Crit to good effect.

    Haste on the other hand lets each Ember be worth less, so spending Embers an sub-optimal times will hurt less than if you were stacking Mastery.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrHappy View Post
    is UVLS still good after 40% nerf or did that put other trinkets ahead now
    ?

    It was comparable before a 40% nerf. Now it's complete crap.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richardi View Post
    Trying to figure out the optimal opener for destro with 2-set T16 atm(without 2-set from t15. With bindings+wusho i need to generate up to 2 full embers and cast 2xCB's during first 10second. For now i have got it to something like : Pot+DS, pre-cast immo, 2xconf, 3xinci and then 2xCB's. the thing is though that if none of them crits...it's gonna be 1-2 emberbit short from the 2nd CB. Also the timer for that is tight so you would need to save DG for last 20% hp or cast it with DS+pot or after the 10s has gone. Idea's anyone?

    *Edit: with legendary meta it should be possible but without it will still insanely tight to get that 2nd CB before Wusho proc ends
    I've just decided to resign myself to having terrible opening damage and catching up with everyone as the fight continues on.

    I haven't really found a good way to work with a 10 sec Int proc that soon into the fight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by t3kneek View Post
    I was wondering if we've come to a decision as to what a solid opener is for destro?

    I saw a couple posts back about pre pot, dark soul, immolate, conflag, incin x 1, then try to fit in two chaos bolts before wush falls off?

    What is everyone doing for dark shamans? I imagine manno fury is king on this fight for opener as well as slime spawns. Is it safe to say that havoc glyph is amazing for this fight/others?

    Also didn't know what method everyone was using to keep immolate up on both bosses. Thanks for any information.

    I'm using KjC on H Dark Shamans just because the amount of movement is borderline redonkulous and the slims die quick enough without me trying to do any damage to them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Count Zero View Post
    Being a scrub who too often forgets to switch my pet's target (more than once a raidweek is too much), I'm sticking with Sac. Well, being a scrub and also because there are so many fights where you can havoc/shadowburn like a beast, I figure the heavy mastery then crit build works strong with Sac.
    I love Sac + Soul Link. I can't wait to hit 1 mil HP in full heroic gear like I think I might.

  3. #2243
    Quote Originally Posted by Richardi View Post
    Trying to figure out the optimal opener for destro with 2-set T16 atm(without 2-set from t15. With bindings+wusho i need to generate up to 2 full embers and cast 2xCB's during first 10second. For now i have got it to something like : Pot+DS, pre-cast immo, 2xconf, 3xinci and then 2xCB's. the thing is though that if none of them crits...it's gonna be 1-2 emberbit short from the 2nd CB. Also the timer for that is tight so you would need to save DG for last 20% hp or cast it with DS+pot or after the 10s has gone. Idea's anyone?

    *Edit: with legendary meta it should be possible but without it will still insanely tight to get that 2nd CB before Wusho proc ends
    Precast a RoF aswell? Should get you atleast 1 ember with the 5ish ticks you could get out of it.

  4. #2244
    Quote Originally Posted by thuras View Post
    Precast a RoF aswell? Should get you atleast 1 ember with the 5ish ticks you could get out of it.
    How does one precast both an Immo and a RoF?

  5. #2245
    Actually haven´t tried it in-game so hopefully i´m not making a fool of myself. RoF is groundplaced so should be able to cast it before the immo and it should still have a couple of ticks left for the boss. Dependant on movement etc, but should be able to figure out where to place it on a boss to boss basis. It would be pretty annouying for a pretty small gain but might be worth it without 2pt15.

    Edit: I´m stupid, only works on bosses that you move pretty instantly some distance for it not to pull them. Not a general strategy.
    Last edited by thuras; 2013-09-25 at 09:58 PM.

  6. #2246
    Stood in the Fire
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    Bruslak, any way i can sim without it valuing haste over everything? http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Sohl/advanced Got a few upgrades last night and i gemed heavy mastery. Not sure if i should do 320 mastery gems over 80-160 int/mastery gems for red sockets since am losing out on a few socket bonuses. Still trying to shed hit.

  7. #2247
    Hi, I'm needing some help with reforging? I was haste heavy from 5.3 and I'm getting conflicting answers from Icy/Robot/raid lead/guild lead. My playstyle definitely prefers haste, but I need to keep my dps up so I'm not sure how much to shed. I'm hitting around 350k at the burst start on boss fights, but leveling out to an awful 150k-165k by the end for overall damage. I am still trying to get used to the KJC and ember regen changes so that is a large part of that.

    I'm also confused about whether I should gem the orange (Int+Mast) in red sockets instead of just straight red (Int). It looks so weird to lose 4k in intel to pick up secondary stats more. And it is now best to ditch the legendary meta for burning primal?

    Would hit>haste to 9772 (is that # correct?)>mastery>crit be correct?

    Hmm it won't let me link my armory without posting more, but I don't want the wrong toon pulled up if you go looking - it's ravynonyx for armory.

    Thank you for any help!

  8. #2248
    Brusalk, you commented about using GoSac and soul link, how does soul link function without a pet? I thought it only worked if you had a pet out?

    Thanks

  9. #2249
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    I love Sac + Soul Link. I can't wait to hit 1 mil HP in full heroic gear like I think I might.
    I'm sitting pretty at ~910k buffed in raid right now doing that. Could easily see breaking 1mil in full heroic gear.
    Not#1974

  10. #2250
    Quote Originally Posted by traumabrew View Post
    Brusalk, you commented about using GoSac and soul link, how does soul link function without a pet? I thought it only worked if you had a pet out?

    Thanks
    Soul Link + GoSac buffed means 20% max health.

  11. #2251
    Quote Originally Posted by t3kneek View Post
    I was wondering if we've come to a decision as to what a solid opener is for destro?

    I saw a couple posts back about pre pot, dark soul, immolate, conflag, incin x 1, then try to fit in two chaos bolts before wush falls off?

    What is everyone doing for dark shamans? I imagine manno fury is king on this fight for opener as well as slime spawns. Is it safe to say that havoc glyph is amazing for this fight/others?

    Also didn't know what method everyone was using to keep immolate up on both bosses. Thanks for any information.
    If this is heroic, i'd heavily suggest kjc.
    If you're shadowburning off the foul spawns, the time between each one is more than 25 seconds so a havoc glyph is not needed

  12. #2252
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Soul Link + GoSac buffed means 20% max health.
    And dont forget the "3% of your damage as healing" part.



    " So much lost time... that you'll never get back!"....

  13. #2253
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrada View Post
    And dont forget the "3% of your damage as healing" part.
    Does that still function? I was under the impression it didn't, though admittedly I haven't specifically checked.

  14. #2254
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Does that still function? I was under the impression it didn't, though admittedly I haven't specifically checked.
    Def does, its my number 2 healing taken next to siphon life

  15. #2255
    So does anyone have an idea of how valuable the new tier bonuses are relative to tier 15? I'm trying to figure out the value of dropping my 2pc t15.

  16. #2256
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Does that still function? I was under the impression it didn't, though admittedly I haven't specifically checked.
    It's only if you have a pet out and Soul Link.

    If you Sac the pet, you still have the Grim Sac HoT, but you lose the health-from-damage mechanic of being linked to a living pet. So we don't get the HoT + the Leech, just the HoT.
    Last edited by Rethul Ur No; 2013-09-26 at 07:15 AM.

  17. #2257
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Snip
    Thanks for taking the time to reply
    In MoP we all got a Legen...........wait for it...........dary!

  18. #2258
    Brusalk does that mean most of the time you gosac nowadays? if they all turn out roughly even i can see the attraction.

    Also managed to get hold of a few items yesterday, heroic bindings etc . Comfortably at 17-18k mastery - although reforgelite has NO idea how to add in the 9% static stats from bindings it seems So manually sorting that out afterwards. Also found that it doesnt like to reforge my legendary cape...first world problems!
    "The plague of your kind will be purged from this world... And on that inevitable day, your wretched, stagnant soul will finally be mine"
    Armory

  19. #2259
    Stood in the Fire
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    Worth it to int/mastery gems for red sockets (right now im straight 320 mastery for everything)? Missing out on a few socket bonuses. I use simcraft but it gives me high values for haste so i dont feel as if i can trust it to set up my weight stats.

  20. #2260
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by t3kneek View Post
    Also didn't know what method everyone was using to keep immolate up on both bosses. Thanks for any information.
    2 ways to do this easily. Both involve keeping one of the shamans as focus and using a macro.

    Method 1: Use a swap target/focus macro. Then simply toggle between your target and focus to apply incinerate. Since they share a health pool, you don't have to switch back until you need to apply immolate to the focus target. Also this works with havoc/sb sniping (off of globs) and with havoc/chaos bolt because of the shared health pool.

    Method 2: Just use an Immolate macro with a [mod:shift, @focus]

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    Quote Originally Posted by xuros View Post
    Worth it to int/mastery gems for red sockets (right now im straight 320 mastery for everything)? Missing out on a few socket bonuses. I use simcraft but it gives me high values for haste so i dont feel as if i can trust it to set up my weight stats.
    Since there are no mastery breakpoints, I don't know why you would want to ignore +INT socket bonuses. Just multiply stat weights by stats for each item to see if it is worth ignoring the socket bonus.

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    Hey Brusalk and Xurus, I see you both are Demo/Destro. Can you tell me which fights you are using Demo and Destro for?
    A living Warlock = a dead everyone else

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