1. #3361
    For Iron Juggernaught: you can avoid all bomb damage if you teleport out as you are jumping on them.

    For Naz: Pets don't cause rage.

  2. #3362
    Quote Originally Posted by Melian View Post
    EDIT @Tazgoth:
    IDK, but it looks like that you are very close to a haste breakpoint (for Immolate?) with your current gear downscaled. That way any further point is very weak compared to crit and mastery. Also this is just a wild guess.
    Could be that I'm sitting very close to the 2021 haste BP for Immolate. I would check, but I'm at work right now. Even with that under consideration, for haste to be roughly 1/20th of the value of Crit/Mastery? Find that hard to believe.

  3. #3363
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    How are you gaining 8% mastery but losing only 873 SP? Do you mean you're losing Int which makes you lose 873 SP?

    Also, since I don't have numbers off the top of my head but you probably have a reference (character sheet or something), how much _rating_ is 8% mastery?
    I was switching from using the normal BoA staff from Gary to using a warforged wand and a heroic off hand. So, in essence I was losing INT (also looking at gemming straight mastery vs int/mast gems).

    Thanks

  4. #3364
    Quote Originally Posted by Tazgoth View Post
    Could be that I'm sitting very close to the 2021 haste BP for Immolate. I would check, but I'm at work right now. Even with that under consideration, for haste to be roughly 1/20th of the value of Crit/Mastery? Find that hard to believe.
    It is hard to believe. Back when we were at that gear level, haste was higher in value than crit due largely to RoF ember generation and scaling with haste. Seeing as those have been changed since then such that RoF is not used single target, I'd guess that on single target in CM gear level, they are roughly equal.

    Again though, when you are doing lots of trash packs and RoF can hit more than one target, I strongly suspect haste will pull ahead.

    In short, for challenge modes, I'd Gem Int (which I expect is more than twice as good as mastery at that level), hit cap, and reforge the rest mastery > haste > crit.

  5. #3365
    Quote Originally Posted by Melian View Post
    Garrosh Hellscream
    • You should sac your Felhunter to have the possiblity to kick mind controlled targets
    • Try to get into the first intermission with full embers to AE down a pack as fast as possible. You will be able to keep up AE with Rain of Fire and full embers. Also Shadowfury is a strong AE stun/interrupt in intermission 1.
    • You should be able to prohibit your add running away during an empowered whirl by keeping up Rain of Fire and using Conflagrate on it as soon as it spawns
    • Your AE is very strong in intermission 2. If you pull aggro, remember Soulshatter <<you almost never need this with todays tank aggro, so I feel that some people forget that they even have it >>
    • I run observer, because I don't want to stop casting to interrupt - it doesn't negatively impact my dps, or at least I am typically 25-35m higher on *garrosh* damage than the other locks in my raid.
    • For intermission #1, if you are assigned to the back rooms, you can drop RoF on the packs you run past, giving you full embers by the time you are at the back packs - meaning you can burn everything in p1, and still be fine in intermission #1.
    • We kite these adds via a monk, other than dropping RoF on them for free embers as they run by, I ignore, but I guess our strategy is different here.
    • I (kjc) fnb incin my way to the top, often pulling a few - considering you have infinite embers while fnb'ing that many, I just blood tap as required till the dk's deathgrip - I haven't ever died to the adds, but other squishies have, and they are next on threat if I were to shatter :P
    Last edited by rijn dael; 2014-01-28 at 09:45 PM.

  6. #3366
    The Patient Gorthan's Avatar
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    Blackfuse tonight (25m HC). Any good suggestions? (portals, stun, teleport are all "obvious"). Thanks.

  7. #3367
    Deleted
    Thanks so far! I'll update the tips after todays raid.

    PS.: Just tried the one with mines and teleport on Iron Juggernaut. Realy like that one

    EDIT: updated
    Last edited by mmocf671b58f24; 2014-01-29 at 10:25 PM.

  8. #3368
    I was wondering a couple of things since I believe I am under performing as destro:

    *Note: I am still wearing a Wooshalay's final choice, but i do have a HM PBoI, gotta love 10 man's. I am currently full mastery>haste>crit and whenever I am not needed for dispels I go with Sacrifice

    1) reading the guide is supremacy really that far ahead of sacrifice even in 565+ gear for single target and 2 target cleave?
    2) how many CB's are ppl getting off in their opener during DS? I am pretty much just getting three
    3) has the opener changed at all? I am seeing logs of destro locks starting with a 1 million burst on fights where they cant possibly be starting with full embers.
    I do the following; pot> immo > curse > conflagx2 > DS/racials > Incinx4 > CB for as many embers that you have at that point?

    Thanks!

  9. #3369
    Quote Originally Posted by Greywardenn View Post
    3) has the opener changed at all? I am seeing logs of destro locks starting with a 1 million burst on fights where they cant possibly be starting with full embers.
    I do the following; pot> immo > curse > conflagx2 > DS/racials > Incinx4 > CB for as many embers that you have at that point?
    I personally use 3 Backdraft charges on first CB. This leaves me enough time to refresh Immo with full proc/prepot and get the first two CB's out during the 5 second 4p proc. I don't get a fancy 20% haste racial

    KTT Trinket and GoSac are also a big contributor. A Multi Strike proc on a 3M CB goes a long way.

  10. #3370
    Quote Originally Posted by Greywardenn View Post
    I was wondering a couple of things since I believe I am under performing as destro:

    *Note: I am still wearing a Wooshalay's final choice, but i do have a HM PBoI, gotta love 10 man's. I am currently full mastery>haste>crit and whenever I am not needed for dispels I go with Sacrifice

    1) reading the guide is supremacy really that far ahead of sacrifice even in 565+ gear for single target and 2 target cleave?
    2) how many CB's are ppl getting off in their opener during DS? I am pretty much just getting three
    3) has the opener changed at all? I am seeing logs of destro locks starting with a 1 million burst on fights where they cant possibly be starting with full embers.
    I do the following; pot> immo > curse > conflagx2 > DS/racials > Incinx4 > CB for as many embers that you have at that point?

    Thanks!
    1) Not really. That part of the guide is outdated because I'd gotten so busy that I couldn't spend the time required to make the update as high-quality and correct as I wanted it tobe, and at this point there's not much reason since the prepatch should be coming soon-ish hopefully.

    2) 2-3 unless I have full embers for whatever reason

    3) I'm still using that method (sometimes with doomguard) and I can get up to 1 mil burst. PBoI + KTT/BBoY w/ Skull Banner means like 3-mil Chaos Bolts.

  11. #3371
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    1) Not really. That part of the guide is outdated because I'd gotten so busy that I couldn't spend the time required to make the update as high-quality and correct as I wanted it tobe, and at this point there's not much reason since the prepatch should be coming soon-ish hopefully.

    2) 2-3 unless I have full embers for whatever reason

    3) I'm still using that method (sometimes with doomguard) and I can get up to 1 mil burst. PBoI + KTT/BBoY w/ Skull Banner means like 3-mil Chaos Bolts.
    Ya I figured that missing skull banner and not having double SoO trinkets is really killing my opening. Thanks Brusalk!

  12. #3372
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post

    3) I'm still using that method (sometimes with doomguard) and I can get up to 1 mil burst. PBoI + KTT/BBoY w/ Skull Banner means like 3-mil Chaos Bolts.
    I've actually seen 3.9MM on the direct hit (i.e. not including the sacrifice DOT) when using a hc warforged BBoY. When you consider that bloodlust is often popped on pull, 1MM burst isn't even really the top end of what's possible when stars align.

  13. #3373
    Deleted
    Points 1) and 2) have already been settled, I think.
    Only thing that cought my eye is 3):

    I think the perfect pull differs from what you wrote fractional, Greywardenn.
    Pulltimer 3sec left: Pot -> Incinnerate -> Immolate -> CoE -> use cooldowns -> 2x Conflagrate -> 4x Incinnerate -> CB -> CB -> Immolate -> etc....
    Probably this won't make much impact, mentioned it more for clarification.

    BTW: Glyph of Havoc highly (!) influences the opening burst if you can spread the 2 CBs, hitting like trains. I used to do this on Klaxxi sometimes - though it is nothing but padding of course.

  14. #3374
    Personally I've been toying around a bit with the opener and I seem to favor the following:

    2 sec prepull: pre-pot and cast incinerate, CoE, Cooldowns, immolate, conflag x2, incinerate to 2 embers, 2x CB, refresh imo try to squeeze a 3d CB.

    The basic change here is that I cast my first immolate after I apply CoE and pop CDs. It's not optimal in that I loose something <1sec from not casting immolate during the travel time of the first incinerate, but this way I stagger the time point when my trinkets proc a bit and I feel that I recover it in faster ember gen due to buffed immolate. What I gain (I feel) is smoother ember generation for the opener allowing a guaranteed 2 fully buffed CB and good chances for a 3rd (KTT will have faded for the 3rd CB but would till have DS/pot/PBoI).

    I don't have any hard facts or simulations to back this up, its just an intuition that I've been trying out and it seems to work out OK.
    Last edited by Lionor; 2014-01-31 at 09:51 AM.

  15. #3375
    So, I'm trying to maximize my destro locks DPS, and I feel like the guides that are out there give conflicting information. I'm low geared - 540. My question is, when does it become better (or has it always been) to gem for pure mastery instead of intel (or orange gems with both mastery + intel)?

    Also, is it correct that Kil'jaeden's Cunning + Grimoire of Sacrifice > Archimonde's Darkness + Grimoire of Supremacy?

    Any feedback would be very appreciated.

  16. #3376
    The answer will depend somewhat on your specific gear. I would think the changeover point is somewhere around 540 if not slightly sooner. You can test this in simC very easily by editing the "simulate" import wall of text page. Look down to the gearing section and simply edit which gems are being used. Sim it with the int based and with the secondary stat based setup and see which is better for you.

    As for what spec choices to make that also depends on ilvl, playstyle, and the fight/guild strat itself. In ToT I recall definitely being into the "secondary stats are better" territory which 540 is approximate too. Once you start getting geared to SoO levels gosac is pretty potent, especially with a KTT trinket. Especially if you are good at shadowburn/havoc cleaving. KJC vs AD is again preference/playstyle...if I were on progression most of the time I'd use KJC. If its farm and I'm going for max damage AD can be better....stress on the "can be". You can also get poo flung at you everytime you hit a CD, get a trinket proc, or a burn phase pops....in which case its a loss lol.

  17. #3377
    Quote Originally Posted by Werst View Post
    The answer will depend somewhat on your specific gear. I would think the changeover point is somewhere around 540 if not slightly sooner. You can test this in simC very easily by editing the "simulate" import wall of text page. Look down to the gearing section and simply edit which gems are being used. Sim it with the int based and with the secondary stat based setup and see which is better for you.

    As for what spec choices to make that also depends on ilvl, playstyle, and the fight/guild strat itself. In ToT I recall definitely being into the "secondary stats are better" territory which 540 is approximate too. Once you start getting geared to SoO levels gosac is pretty potent, especially with a KTT trinket. Especially if you are good at shadowburn/havoc cleaving. KJC vs AD is again preference/playstyle...if I were on progression most of the time I'd use KJC. If its farm and I'm going for max damage AD can be better....stress on the "can be". You can also get poo flung at you everytime you hit a CD, get a trinket proc, or a burn phase pops....in which case its a loss lol.
    Thanks - I'm going to use simC tonight to see what the best outcome is.

    As far as the trinket goes - yes that does look like a potent combination with Sac. Unfortunately right now I'm using the 50k timeless trinket and the LFR Malkorok one (~2%) chance to cleave.

    I think because of where I find myself I'll stick with AD for now. It seems like the second proc adds a lot of forgiveness to people that aren't perfect. Hopefully that's right...then again being able to cast while moving might be amazing. /conflicted
    Last edited by Sargiean; 2014-01-31 at 10:29 PM.

  18. #3378
    Deleted
    Personally I would always recommend kjc.
    It's a massive a quality of life improvement!
    Even today while farming the bosses I still use it - I just love being able to cast while moving.
    Then again, that kind of made me a worse player. It happens that I interrupt casts on my alts nowadays, because I forget that they can not move while casting :/

  19. #3379
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Sargiean View Post
    I think because of where I find myself I'll stick with AD for now. It seems like the second proc adds a lot of forgiveness to people that aren't perfect. Hopefully that's right...then again being able to cast while moving might be amazing. /conflicted
    I'd be careful with that reasoning. Incinerate is a big part of destruction's damage (in comparison so say shadowbolt for Demo) and Destro's Dark Soul is probably the weakest of the 3. It's nice to have a second one during execute, but if you're in the position where you want a talent that offers the most "forgiveness", then KJC is 100% the way to go.

  20. #3380
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Grizelda View Post
    For Iron Juggernaught: you can avoid all bomb damage if you teleport out as you are jumping on them.http://www.mmo-champion.com/newreply...ply&p=25031486
    How does this work properly? I tried it several times - sometimes i got the bombdamage and sometimes i got kicked into the air after i teleported back to my demonic circle.

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