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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by SyberGilneas View Post
    I know on Megaera me and our other Feral were in the top 3 for most of the fight
    idk what im doing wrong, top 3ish all fights but mega, top 15ish :[ it isnt single target issue cuz i do ok in jin, so i nono

  2. #22
    I'd be more worried about our lack of raid cds, I mean if you're getting benched in a top 100 guild(as I am now), it's purely because of your lack of raid utility. Just take a look at the other melee, Rogues got their smokebomb turned into a 20% raidwide reduction, warriors with their obvious rallying cry/demo banner + not to mention skull banner/burst aoe with bladestorm etc etc. DKs have AMZ which isn't that "great" but for all I care it's twice as good as our tranq and at least they dont need to stand still for 8seconds while using it. Rets have Auramastery / Bops / Sacs / Purity(seems to be useful on quite a few fights this tier). It's literally just enh shamans that can compete with our uselessness. As for dps, if you're half decent at what you do you'd make it to top 5(25m) easily.
    Last edited by RayLeeAnna; 2013-03-14 at 09:10 PM.

  3. #23
    I'm quite sure it's not my lack of dps, nor ability to play the class (Yes, I parse lower than most druids, but I also am less geared). I personally believe that the raid leader, and officers, prefer to have multidotters/range over melee of any spec and class. I'm not sure if it's because of "us" sharing the same loot / tokens, etc or the inability to keep up with shadow preists/boomkins/warlocks on fights

  4. #24
    I'd be more worried about our lack of raid cds
    A.... lack.... of raid cd's? Lack of.... raid utility? Are you kidding me? Are we still playing the same class?

    Tranq - (can equip a spellpower weapon to make it stronger)
    Tranq with HotW - (spellpower weapon - probably the strongest healing output cd out there)
    HotW rejuving - (spellpower weapon, no mana costs and insane healing)
    Single target healing touches (yes... those do about 10k hps over a fight for me. They crit and woops you just saved someone in a sandtrap).
    SI+barkskin+Might of ursoc counts as raid utility. For example yesterday we lost a tank on horridon and the one who was tanking had 9 stacks alrdy. I called out for a hand of protection on him while I tanked horridon.
    Divine shield can be misused as well.
    Bear form --> Taunt --> Dispersion (and maybe more cd's) and tank something beyond enrage.
    Stampeding roar. Another one with symbiosis for the warrior.
    Other symbiosis stuff, a lot of stuns and such as well.

    Just use your imagination. We are not worse in utility than other melee dps. Neither in dps. We have more ways to deal damage than most of them, which makes us able to do good numbers in all situations. HotW wrathing as well.
    Last edited by Karlzone; 2013-03-15 at 09:21 AM.

  5. #25
    If they benched you because you didnt pull alot of dps, they did you a favor and if they have the mind of "omg lets stack mages for moar dps" they wont be doing heroics for along time. Try to find a new group and tell them you know how to use all your abilities.

    the raid needs class buffs/debuffs, utility/defensive and offensive CDS too, and we know feral druid excels on that.

    As Karlzone said use your imagination HOTW is beautiful.

  6. #26
    I am feral from top 30 world 25 ppl guild with 6 years of feral experience and i seriously think that feral's single target damage is really low

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Vasek View Post
    I am feral from top 30 world 25 ppl guild with 6 years of feral experience and i seriously think that feral's single target damage is really low
    I don't know where that came from, in all honesty we're pretty competitive at the moment, especially on single target. If your damage is indeed low then you're either doing something wrong, or you're under-geared, which might lead to false judgement.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Karlzone View Post
    A.... lack.... of raid cd's? Lack of.... raid utility? Are you kidding me? Are we still playing the same class?

    Tranq - (can equip a spellpower weapon to make it stronger)
    Tranq with HotW - (spellpower weapon - probably the strongest healing output cd out there)
    HotW rejuving - (spellpower weapon, no mana costs and insane healing)
    Single target healing touches (yes... those do about 10k hps over a fight for me. They crit and woops you just saved someone in a sandtrap).
    SI+barkskin+Might of ursoc counts as raid utility. For example yesterday we lost a tank on horridon and the one who was tanking had 9 stacks alrdy. I called out for a hand of protection on him while I tanked horridon.
    Divine shield can be misused as well.
    Bear form --> Taunt --> Dispersion (and maybe more cd's) and tank something beyond enrage.
    Stampeding roar. Another one with symbiosis for the warrior.
    Other symbiosis stuff, a lot of stuns and such as well.

    Just use your imagination. We are not worse in utility than other melee dps. Neither in dps. We have more ways to deal damage than most of them, which makes us able to do good numbers in all situations. HotW wrathing as well.
    This is 5 man stuff. None of it counts for much in progression heroics. It is certainly far outclassed by what other classes bring to the table in both DPS and raid utility. The only one that is really useful at all in ToT is Stampeding Roar on Jikun. But since the cooldown is longer than the time between Downdrafts it ends up being mostly useless.

  9. #29
    Since I DPS 0.13% of the time on ToT heroics as kitty, figured I'd throw in my two cents.

    First of all, where one stands in their raid's personal damage meter is more of a metric of player skill (versus purely class viability) and how your raid does encounters. Simply said, if you're topping the meters as Feral, it could simply mean the rest of the people playing classes that could destroy Feral aren't playing up to snuff or the encounter is being executed in a manner that favors a Feral. Blizz obviously feels that Feral damage is low since we're getting the SR buff shortly, so I highly doubt Feral is capable of legitimately putting out more sustained damage and easily top meters compared to other classes under control of the same player skill.




    Quote Originally Posted by teddabear View Post
    This is 5 man stuff. None of it counts for much in progression heroics. It is certainly far outclassed by what other classes bring to the table in both DPS and raid utility. The only one that is really useful at all in ToT is Stampeding Roar on Jikun. But since the cooldown is longer than the time between Downdrafts it ends up being mostly useless.
    Saying that about Stampeding Roar is like saying Smoke Bomb ends up being mostly useless on Megaera since it can't be used for every single Rampage. If you have two druids who time it so they're always on the platform for a Downdraft, the world keeps on turning.

    With respect to other raid utility cooldowns, I'd have to agree to some level that we might be lacking in terms of cooldowns that are desired to be used every encounter. The buff to 25man aoe-heals (aka Tranquility in our case) should help to some degree, however its long CD and weaker power w/o the use of HotW make it a less-reliable tool. Anything else requires Symbiosis, and while I don't like the idea of it being considered a raid utility since it relies too much on your comp and not the specific druid (especially 10man), it can be useful... I personally love Dispersion. Stampeding Roar is pretty much our go-to raid cooldown, and it's really useful where it can be used (Ji-kun's Downdraft, getting out of Iron Qon's storms, AoE snare removal on multiple encounters, general movement on Lei Shen, etc). While it doesn't seem as sexy has a direct damage-reduction or raid damage-boosting CD, it's use can accomplish the same goal.
    *Since I'm tired of reposting the link:* EH vs TTL and Hybrid Tax

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by RayLeeAnna View Post
    I'd be more worried about our lack of raid cds, I mean if you're getting benched in a top 100 guild(as I am now), it's purely because of your lack of raid utility. Just take a look at the other melee, Rogues got their smokebomb turned into a 20% raidwide reduction, warriors with their obvious rallying cry/demo banner + not to mention skull banner/burst aoe with bladestorm etc etc. DKs have AMZ which isn't that "great" but for all I care it's twice as good as our tranq and at least they dont need to stand still for 8seconds while using it. Rets have Auramastery / Bops / Sacs / Purity(seems to be useful on quite a few fights this tier). It's literally just enh shamans that can compete with our uselessness. As for dps, if you're half decent at what you do you'd make it to top 5(25m) easily.
    agree with you for one point ... we lack of real raid utility. Even enh sham are way better than us for this (great healing timer on short cd +stormlash), and good enhs have really good dps ... on a fight like twins or iron qon, they heal for 20millions, on raden, they can heal for 30millions each without big dps loss, "reals" healeurs were between 45 and 55millions (their healing rain is way too op, ag, totem). We have ... what ? A tranquility, 1.2 to 3+millions if used with hotw (so ... no doc) with a 8min timer and several seconds without dps and without moving ? Stampeding ? Why bring a feral if a ranged (boomkin) can do this as well ?
    I was bench on some fights not because of my dps (hum ... ok, i'm low on durumu, and primordius with too much melee is a pain), but because i'm melee and i can't brought good raid cds ...

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by exochaft View Post
    Since I DPS 0.13% of the time on ToT heroics as kitty, figured I'd throw in my two cents.

    First of all, where one stands in their raid's personal damage meter is more of a metric of player skill (versus purely class viability) and how your raid does encounters. Simply said, if you're topping the meters as Feral, it could simply mean the rest of the people playing classes that could destroy Feral aren't playing up to snuff or the encounter is being executed in a manner that favors a Feral. Blizz obviously feels that Feral damage is low since we're getting the SR buff shortly, so I highly doubt Feral is capable of legitimately putting out more sustained damage and easily top meters compared to other classes under control of the same player skill.






    Saying that about Stampeding Roar is like saying Smoke Bomb ends up being mostly useless on Megaera since it can't be used for every single Rampage. If you have two druids who time it so they're always on the platform for a Downdraft, the world keeps on turning.

    With respect to other raid utility cooldowns, I'd have to agree to some level that we might be lacking in terms of cooldowns that are desired to be used every encounter. The buff to 25man aoe-heals (aka Tranquility in our case) should help to some degree, however its long CD and weaker power w/o the use of HotW make it a less-reliable tool. Anything else requires Symbiosis, and while I don't like the idea of it being considered a raid utility since it relies too much on your comp and not the specific druid (especially 10man), it can be useful... I personally love Dispersion. Stampeding Roar is pretty much our go-to raid cooldown, and it's really useful where it can be used (Ji-kun's Downdraft, getting out of Iron Qon's storms, AoE snare removal on multiple encounters, general movement on Lei Shen, etc). While it doesn't seem as sexy has a direct damage-reduction or raid damage-boosting CD, it's use can accomplish the same goal.
    I agree symbiosis could be useful in 25 man but there just aren't that many 25 mans around anymore. Magaera and Jikun are different situations, there are a lot more classes with a useful CD for Rampage than there are for Downdraft and you need more for Magaera. Tranq is somewhat useful on Magaera since you need all you can get but it pales in comparison to Smokebomb. Feral's utility is always so far down the list compared to other classes that it rarely gets used in 10 man. I can see 25 man would be a completely different situation but in 10 man potent raid CDs are few and highly valued. I haven't done 25 man in MoP but it's fairly obvious it's very different, especially in regard to Raid CDs.

  12. #32
    Iirc Midwinter has a feral druid and a rogue.

  13. #33
    Stood in the Fire unrealeck's Avatar
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    Ferals aren't bad with sustained DPS. They're just crap on trash and have 'meh' AOE. One thing I dislike is lining up trinket procs with other buffs like DoC and Synapse Springs for your Rip applications.

  14. #34
    On the contrary, we (midwinter) think ferals are very strong on cleave fights and ok on single target Rogues have stronger single target and better utility which is why they are usually slotted more than our feral.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by unrealeck View Post
    Ferals aren't bad with sustained DPS. They're just crap on trash and have 'meh' AOE. One thing I dislike is lining up trinket procs with other buffs like DoC and Synapse Springs for your Rip applications.
    Ferals are bad on trash.... okay. Who cares?

    Ferals have 'meh' aoe in very few scenarios. A fight like tortos where you can have saved up energy and will have TF for all bat spawns, is amazing for ferals! We don't really have rampup time on our mass AoE. A fight that has an AoE requirement that lasts longer, you can use HotW and cast hurricane.

    And you dislike lining up trinket procs and such with bleeds? o.O
    That's my favorite part. There are always ways to improve; I love that!

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