1. #1

    Bad Juju not proccing

    Topic is pretty self explanatory. Obtained this trinket tonight in raid, beat on a target dummy with full rotation for 10 minutes without a proc. After the 6th Heroic Bottle proc without a Juju proc, I started noticing that something may be wrong.


    Edit: After 14 minutes I finally had a proc. Something is seriously wrong with this,
    Last edited by Shaley; 2013-03-07 at 04:34 AM.

  2. #2
    Probably put .05 PPM instead of .5 RPPM or something.

    Anyhow, why are even using this trinket? If your raid is good enough to kill that boss you should have the heroic elegon trinket, in which case you should be using H Bottle and the Shado Pan assault trinket, as even if the RPPM trinkets were to work properly they are behind those two.

  3. #3
    Keyboard Turner
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    Please post on this thread on forums about your issue:

    us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/8155705932

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    Probably put .05 PPM instead of .5 RPPM or something.

    Anyhow, why are even using this trinket? If your raid is good enough to kill that boss you should have the heroic elegon trinket, in which case you should be using H Bottle and the Shado Pan assault trinket, as even if the RPPM trinkets were to work properly they are behind those two.
    I'd rather test a trinket than let it be disenchanted

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-07 at 06:34 AM ----------

    Just did Scholomance and it didn't proc a single time.


    Players who have "Breath of the Hydra", the caster .5 RealPPM trinket, are also experiencing the same thing.
    Last edited by Shaley; 2013-03-07 at 06:59 AM.

  5. #5
    Well, the trinket has an expected 18% uptime (for my current gear) and I had 14% uptime during an 1 hour test. It works pretty much like it should (4% difference should be due to small sample size) - it's just that all of these rppm trinkets are pretty bad now with Slice & Dice and the raid buff not counting anymore.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashvael View Post
    Well, the trinket has an expected 18% uptime (for my current gear) and I had 14% uptime during an 1 hour test. It works pretty much like it should (4% difference should be due to small sample size) - it's just that all of these rppm trinkets are pretty bad now with Slice & Dice and the raid buff not counting anymore.
    so ashvael... im combat...
    us.battle.net/wow/en/character/illidan/Hansell/simple
    atm so using elegon trinket 510 +essence 517 is probably better then bad juju (reg)
    Last edited by Wheelchair; 2013-03-07 at 09:14 AM. Reason: inserted armory

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashvael View Post
    Well, the trinket has an expected 18% uptime (for my current gear) and I had 14% uptime during an 1 hour test. It works pretty much like it should (4% difference should be due to small sample size) - it's just that all of these rppm trinkets are pretty bad now with Slice & Dice and the raid buff not counting anymore.
    This happened to a guildie of mine, as well.

    I mentioned this issue on mumble, and he went to the dummy. It procced within ~20 seconds, and again about 2 minutes later. I thought I was crazy until he told me it stopped proccing.

    Something like 15 minutes later, he got 2 procs back to back.

    To everyone: Don't take what I'm about to say with anything more than a grain of salt. I'm fully aware of how "RNG" works. I helped diagnose RNG loot problems in early SW:TOR, and the fabled Sha/Galleon mount problem last month. I'm fully aware of what is acceptable range for RNG. I know what I'm about to say is reaching tin foil hat territory. With that in mind:

    I had a substantially better proc chance on the target dummy with Slice and Dice not activated, than when I was going through a normal rotation. I was getting procs every 2 minutes or so when I was just auto attacking. When I was going through my full rotation, I would go as long as 30 minutes without a proc.

    I know Bad Juju used to scale via Slice and Dice until very recently. It -could- be possible that something has gone wrong in the coding.

    I fully understand this is a sample size of one, and is difficult to be considered as a serious assumption.. If anyone else would like to test this out I'd love it.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-07 at 06:03 PM ----------

    Don't know what happened with me going 30 minutes without a proc last night. That being said:



    Small sample size is small. If I remember right, I'm simmed to be roughly 18-20% up time.

    25 minute test. Didn't start stopwatch until first proc, which occurred during my 3rd Vendetta. Roughly ~4 minutes if used at 0:02, 2:02, 4:02



    The first 15 minutes I had 4 procs: Uptime 8.8% up time

    The last 10 minutes I had 6 procs: 20% up time

    Overall in 25 minutes I had 10 procs: 13% uptime.

    Only 2 procs in 9:44 to start is a little out of hand. If these trinkets procced at the start of fights like every other trinket, it may be ok. The fact that you have to wait upwards of 4 minutes to get your first proc, you may not even get a second proc in a fight.

    If a fight dies in 7 minutes, and your second proc of this likely won't happen until the 8 minute mark, you've successfully obtained a trinket that will proc a single time on a fight, resulting in a 4.7% uptime. A trinket with an agility value of ~17. I'll keep my Darkmoon Card, thanks.

    There is an instance above where it procced 5 times in 5 minutes for a 33% up time. RNG gods shined on that block of time.

    If this is how they really intended this to be, If they want trinkets to be a "sometimes" boost to keep you guessing, rather than a guaranteed power-up every 1-2 minutes, then patch 5.2 wasn't the place for this. This trinket either needs it's rPPM increased, or it needs to be guaranteed to proc at the start of a fight like all other trinkets are so you at least have a chance to get more than a single proc on a damn fight.

  8. #8
    Our enhance shaman got it.
    8 procs during Primordius kill (7 min 42 sec), 31% uptime.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazius View Post
    Our enhance shaman got it.
    8 procs during Primordius kill (7 min 42 sec), 31% uptime.
    Interesting. How much haste does he have? Though apparently these rPPM trinkets are behaving differently in raids vs target dummies. Explanation below:

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/8156015977

    Definitely keep an eye out on that thread.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Shaley View Post
    Interesting. How much haste does he have? Though apparently these rPPM trinkets are behaving differently in raids vs target dummies.
    4k rating. But flurry has close to 100% uptime for enh.

  11. #11
    i dont think flurry will give him more procs it behaves likes SnD

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheelchair View Post
    i dont think flurry will give him more procs it behaves likes SnD
    I wouldn't be so sure:

    ...and you gain 50% additional benefit from Haste granted by items. Lasts 15 sec, or until 5 melee attacks have occurred.
    Haste on gear multiplied by 1.5 while flurry is active.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazius View Post
    I wouldn't be so sure:



    Haste on gear multiplied by 1.5 while flurry is active.
    If this does work for shamans, based on wording, and not Slice and Dice as they explained, that will be extremely disappointing.

    Really wish this thing proc'd immediately at the pull, or at least had SnD buff it.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Shaley View Post
    If this is how they really intended this to be, If they want trinkets to be a "sometimes" boost to keep you guessing, rather than a guaranteed power-up every 1-2 minutes, then patch 5.2 wasn't the place for this. This trinket either needs it's rPPM increased, or it needs to be guaranteed to proc at the start of a fight like all other trinkets are so you at least have a chance to get more than a single proc on a damn fight.
    Those deviations look a little long if things were working as expected. Take 5 minutes to write up a quick simulator of this proc based on 20% haste so 1% chance to proc per second. The average comes out to 100 seconds as expected (data set of 64K) with a standard deviation of 98. A single interval of 4 minutes would be explainable, its over 1.4 standard deviations away but seeing multiple at over 1 standard deviation away within this time window strike me as implausible.

    That said the fact that it wouldn't be unexpected to see a proc interval of 2-3 minutes really makes me question the use of the rppm system for trinkets.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by fierydemise View Post
    Those deviations look a little long if things were working as expected. Take 5 minutes to write up a quick simulator of this proc based on 20% haste so 1% chance to proc per second. The average comes out to 100 seconds as expected (data set of 64K) with a standard deviation of 98. A single interval of 4 minutes would be explainable, its over 1.4 standard deviations away but seeing multiple at over 1 standard deviation away within this time window strike me as implausible.

    That said the fact that it wouldn't be unexpected to see a proc interval of 2-3 minutes really makes me question the use of the rppm system for trinkets.
    Hey there , just saw your post.

    Today I'm having roughly a 18-20% uptime.

    The most important thing is this trinket is now proccing on the first hit of combat, as opposed to coming 2-3 minutes into combat.

    I ran a dungeon that lasted 13:40 in length, and had procs at the following time increments:

    :01, 2:30, 5:30, 7:10, 8:15, 10:50, 11:20

    Upon leaving the dungeon, I waited 5 minutes to make sure any potential procs or cooldowns had been reset. The Bad Juju has procced on the first 1-2 hits of combat 9 consecutive times.

    Something has definitely changed, and for the better.

  16. #16
    i tried it now on my rogue... no procs 2 minutes... EDIT: 3min first proc.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheelchair View Post
    i tried it now on my rogue... no procs 2 minutes... EDIT: 3min first proc.
    Are you US or EU?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Shaley View Post
    Upon leaving the dungeon, I waited 5 minutes to make sure any potential procs or cooldowns had been reset. The Bad Juju has procced on the first 1-2 hits of combat 9 consecutive times.

    Something has definitely changed, and for the better.
    RPPM trinkets will have a higher proc chance if you haven't hit anything for 10 seconds but not to the point of a guaranteed proc. It is possibly Blizzard uncapped the time since last attack factor but short of any announcement to that effect its hard to say.

  19. #19

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