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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by spaace View Post
    unlimited target living bomb > seed of corruption

    improved shadow bolt = scorch


    2.8k warlocks? ya... rogues with dual glaves weren't even that high
    Living bomb didnt exist back then. Living bomb is a talent that was added in WoTLK.

    Improved shadow bolt was completely different from scorch. Scorch was more closely related to the shadow priests shadow weaving (9% increased fire damage vs 10% increased shadow damage). Both shadow weaving and scorch were debuffs that just had to be maintained on the target. Improved shadow bolt however worked completely different as I explained above. The more warlocks with improved shadowbolt you stacked, the stronger it became. Therefor it was extremely beneficial to go for a 'shadow setup' rather then a 'fire setup', and this is what top guilds did during sunwell.

    I'm also sure rogues with dual glaves were very capable of beating 2.8k dps, I clearly remember seeing logs from both hunters and rogues beating 3k dps on terron gorefiend and brutallus.
    Last edited by willemh; 2013-03-08 at 02:28 AM.

  2. #82
    Blademaster Wheatley's Avatar
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    Coming from a top guild we have decided to remove all mages from our raid because they do less dps than other classes, mages are bottom dps whats the point of them being a class, they bring nothing to a raid.

  3. #83
    We're happy with mage performance ATM. We'll reevaluate after more than 2 days have passed.
    Ghostcrawlers twitter.. So yeah, they must be seeing something else than we are, or they actually want mages to suffer miserably. I wish they would just get a round table with raiders and find out how specs and classes actually work in PvE..

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheatley View Post
    Coming from a top guild we have decided to remove all mages from our raid because they do less dps than other classes, mages are bottom dps whats the point of them being a class, they bring nothing to a raid.
    That would be why the numbers look so grim; a guild that's only in the top 300 drops their mages because they heard an actual top guild was doing it. So we're left with only subpar mages in subpar guilds posting logs.

  5. #85
    I am Murloc! Volitar's Avatar
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    Someone has gotta be at the bottom and I'm sure most people aren't sad to see Mages take a hit after being so good for so long.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Volitar View Post
    Someone has gotta be at the bottom and I'm sure most people aren't sad to see Mages take a hit after being so good for so long.
    Bottom would be fine, if warlocks weren't on top with a large margin to bottom and there is not a single drawback on taking a warlock instead of a mage if that is an option for your guild. Every guild wants to be the best they can and bringing a mage atm, outside of crit+sp+lust on 10 man, there really ain't any.

  7. #87
    I am Murloc! Volitar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrgreenthump View Post
    Bottom would be fine, if warlocks weren't on top with a large margin to bottom and there is not a single drawback on taking a warlock instead of a mage if that is an option for your guild. Every guild wants to be the best they can and bringing a mage atm, outside of crit+sp+lust on 10 man, there really ain't any.
    That's how many classes felt in 5.1 compared to a Mage, I'm not saying it's fair but that is just how things are.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Volitar View Post
    That's how many classes felt in 5.1 compared to a Mage, I'm not saying it's fair but that is just how things are.
    For first 6 bosses, mages didn't even get raid spots in top guilds cause fire started to scale with raid gear.. But yes in HoF and in ToES for sure, fire was too good to pass on, but other classes had cd's and stuff that helped the raid, so they werent lackluster to the extent that mages are atm(we actually have nothing to offer to the raid than dps and personal player skill, no raid wide cd's, no targetable cd's, nothing to help the raid). Though why are we even talking abt this? It really ain't a good justification just because somebody else went through it.

  9. #89
    Field Marshal zandiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spaace View Post
    unlimited target living bomb > seed of corruption

    improved shadow bolt = scorch


    2.8k warlocks? ya... rogues with dual glaves weren't even that high
    Yes they were, glaive rogues doing less than 3k were pure shit

  10. #90
    Lol mages higher than locks on sunwell hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

    Unless you were 2 pc t5 arcane being mana fed by your raid at expense of your healers, mages were completely shit compared to warlocks

    Someone was playing mario party during sunwell.

    -----------

    On topic, LOL. What a surprise! But obviously fire need more nerfs, its too high one you get 5222135 item level lol

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigsilly View Post
    QQ - Mages had the highest DPS spec of all the classes in 5.1 - http://raidbots.com/dpsbot/
    mage class is supposed to be at least top3 any patch/expansion, so yea it is a big deal when you take one of the strongest classes and throw it in the trash for no reason.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Videl View Post
    Well,

    Time to cancel my subscriptions until they fix this.

    I'd encourage others to do so as well.
    thats the only way they will listen for shure

  13. #93
    Blademaster Wheatley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by klaps_05 View Post
    mage class is supposed to be at least top3 any patch/expansion, so yea it is a big deal when you take one of the strongest classes and throw it in the trash for no reason.
    I 100% agree with you Top 3 or gtfo no reason to play otherwise!

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Volitar View Post
    That's how many classes felt in 5.1 compared to a Mage, I'm not saying it's fair but that is just how things are.
    And that is the justification for putting all three specs at the bottom of the barrel to rot? It was one spec abusing a non intended rotation. If they just fixed that issue alone it would have seen a nose dive into the middle of the pack. And yet Affliction sits pretty atop the pedestal blizzard has put them on. And lets face it fire got hit hard 5.1 and still has not recovered, frost really hasn't been a contender and arcane was bugged and cheesed. No I'm sorry after this "balancing" and poor design on blizzards behalf we now have to sit with our thumbs up our arse because we are being benched. Best mage spec? "Affliction" true story....

  15. #95
    FIRE:

    Combustion reduced by 50% hurt, and the Crit multiplier from 1.5 to 1.3 was just over the top.

    Fix: Crit Multiplier to 1.4 and Combustion damage increased 10-20% seems about right for a decently competitive spec. Also, what is the purpose of a pyroblast nerf blizz... Reverse the 10% dmg reduction nerf.

    FROST

    Damage just does not exist...

    Honestly water elementals are essentially useless in raids...

    Fix: Fix mastery for raids, Frost mastery is a large reason why mages are so powerful in pvp, and also the reason mastery is so weak in raids. When has your boss been frozen... Improve damage of frostbolt and frostfire bolt! Why? Would help bring frost damage up in raids and would not hurt pvp(To any large extent) And if it did affect pvp, reduce ice lance damage!

    These are just some thoughts of mine when Im bored.
    My avatar of Paul Revere Looks like Jack Black -Now your looking-

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by zomgDPS View Post
    Eh? Hmm...

    I guess I'm just just a little taken aback by the fact that even after.. what was it? 2 months? Of heavy PTR testing and feedback. With some of the worlds best mages giving Blizz feedback about how the class is not going to do well in 5.2. With reports and numbers and math and data all being thrown at Blizz in giant ogre sized chunks, that even after all of that, Blizz still decided to listen to the glorious MVP who was the only mage in the entire community who made it his personal mission to go around every forum and zealously defend Blizz and state, over and over again, that "Mages will be great in 5.2!!" And Blizz, in their infinite wisdom, listened to him instead of the vast pool of some of the best mages in magekind.


    At least we tried this time...
    Oh shut up - if you were any good you'd get something done. You bitched about the mvp when MoP was about to be released - with the same sort of words. Look what happened to arcane..... so much for your prescience.

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by lostdrewid View Post
    Try telling that to the people who were on the bottom time and time again. No, you don't get off that easy. I don't care if you're low, you've had your time to shine. You'll get your time to shine again. Stop complaining when others have a moment in the sun for once.
    This is the kind of response a non mage class would say that has no clue what its actually all about.
    (Except for the people claiming we should be atleast top 3) Barely anyone is saying: we should be number one or fo.

    I have no idea what class ur playing atm, but lets say ur a warlock, ok?
    You are happy with your dps now arent you?, but actually.. you are still doing quite the same dps right now as u were before patch.
    Its stuck on ur mind that ur finally doing good dps, just because u dont have a mage pulling 10-25k more dps then you are, amirite?

    THAT IS NO REASON to nerf mages damage with this massive amount in every talent specialization, dont you agree?

    Before the patch, lets say we had 2 mages and 2 warlocks in a raid, the 2 mages if played as they should with the warlocks playing as they should, the mages will top at.. lets say 140k sustained single target and the warlocks on 125k sustained single target (no bullshit, warlocks did very good dps too)

    That doesnt mean you had to nerf mages to doing ~90k - 100k single target dps.. based on a massive RNG!!!, now you are even way more ahead of mages than mages were ahead on warlocks in 5.1.. and your comment on that is: deserved.. like w t f, everyone whining on mages that are whining are all a big bunch of hypocrits.

    Dont make me best, make me useful is all im saying.

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Mexa View Post
    im a mage and i dont care. We have ups and we have downs, every class cant be best, there has to be a worst class every patch. We are the class the raid deserves, but the the one it needs right now, so they will laugh at us, because we can take it. Because we are not their hero. We are a silent bottom scrub, a watchful lootwhore... a dark knight.
    This is EPIC! "like" m8 ^^

  19. #99
    Happy with where mages are atm? /Absolute disbelief & disgust

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheatley View Post
    I 100% agree with you Top 3 or gtfo no reason to play otherwise!
    Just so everyone is aware, Wheatley is trolling y'all trying to get a reaction - probably from myself or SpaceDuck. We suck yes, but we haven't dropped the other mages or myself just yet. Though I do believe he's paraphrasing me from TeamSpeak, "if a class brings no utility other than dps, why bring that class when it no longer even provides that?". That's something I stand by.

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