This thread needs to be immortalized somehow. The amount of straws being grasped here to try to justify the ends is staggering.
Im just baffled at what some people want out of this game. 8 pages deep and people are still passionate at having ToC's styled raids with Patchwerk/Heigan encounters throughout.
So LFR isnt fun, Normal isnt fun, Heroics arent an option, and dungeons are boring. Am I getting this right? The game sucks for you yet you keep paying for it. The only winner here is Blizzard.
Seriously, who cares.
Although I don't agree with a lot of his opinions, Osmeric makes a good point: there has been a substantial drop in Raiding Activity with this expansion.
Raiders are the minority, and they're the few who still enjoy doing such an activity.
Players are looking for more and more to do, which is why Mists included so many features outside of raiding.
That's the unfortunate reality of it. I'm simply laying a base down, and my own personal explanation plus opinion, as to why things are like this.
REGARDLESS! I do love Raiding myself, especially when it's for story purposes and simply challenging myself, and I love the new raid in its entirety.
I too am tired of the endless bar-raising of encounter complexity. When designing encounters, they should decide on a few mechanics, then tightly tune the fight damage and healing-wise and throw in active aggro management. There should be periods were DPSers need to do damage slowly to avoid gaining aggro, nuking periods, and periods where healers need to heal sparsely to avoid aggro.
Big damage mechanics are fine, since you learn to counter or dodge them, thus utilizing every skill a player has in some way. Big dps numbers actually show that with each piece of gear, each patch, each expansion you grow better and tougher. Adds... they are freaking annoyting and don't have anything to do with everything else.
Check ICC, one of the best raids ever (not as good as Ulduar tho, but still great). What are the most memorable fights there? Festergut/Rotface, Professor, Sindragosa, Deathbringer, Queen and of course Lich King himself. NONE of those fights are tedious add zergs like Madness, Will or (most probably) Horridon. You've got a well-developed boss with some neat mechanics, and perhaps a few adds that don't really count as anything else then just one more mechanic. Those were the best fights ever. Like Mimiron from Ulduar, Ragnaros from Firelands and Illidan from BT. No adds, or making adds just a small part of the encounter, is a way to go.
How is Blizzard missing that?
Raiding in WoW is moving to Raid Finder much like dungeon running in WoW moved to the Dungeon Finder.
There were way more people who saw Empress and Sha of Fear the last 6 months than saw Illidan in all of TBC. Raid content is now consumed by a much larger audience than before. So raiding isn't dying. Hardcore progression raiding might be declining(like in every other MMO), but casual raiding is huge now and overshadows progression raiding in numbers.
(1) numbers were tuned way down, and
(2) encounter complexity was massively reduced, due to neutering or removal of many mechanisms.
In the context of this thread, LFR shows that the complexity the devs are striving for really is a very minority taste.
They want to make mechanics more important in T15 LFR. I suspect this attempt will be entirely disastrous, not least because the players who do LFR don't want more complexity. It's almost as if the devs are miffed that players are spurning their creation, and want to force the complexity on them regardless.
"There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
"Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler
"Nothing will ever be attempted if all possible objections must first be overcome." -- Samuel Johnson
Horridon and council are sensory overload.I like challenging fights but theres just too much going on it exhausts me.
Not tired of designs at all. MOP raids are fantastic. T14 and T11 are probably my two favorite tiers of raiding ever, and T8 hard modes. T15 so far feels pretty well designed although we'll see.
If you don't like complexity, then run LFR. Raiding is for challenges.
So, people actually miss DS? You realize you guys are not actually human right? It's impossible.
Seriously these raids are a breath of fresh air compared to retarded playgrounds like DS, there was NOTHING interesting in Dragon Soul, not one fight. So to bitch about fights with too many mechanics?... My god, people will bitch about anything Blizzard does I guess.
What made me quit is this pattern of many bosses. Most of them have the same pattern: "Kill things > Kill Boss > Void zone > Repeat".
And yeah, this is through the WHOLE fight. And isn't one, two, but 80% of the raid. I just few bit bored raiding MoP.
Wanna be sucessful in raids? Forget the fancy skill names and simplify it. For example: Amethyst Pool = Fire.
If you learn the pattern, welcome to the Club of bored WoW players
edit: You kind of missed the point of this thread. This thread is complaining that the patterns in MoP raids are too complex and there are too many of them.
Last edited by SamR; 2013-03-08 at 09:06 PM.
i think a huge problem is the lore in this expansion. who seriously cares of pandaria? i didnt think for a single nanosecond about it before the expansion released...
what about the characters everyone cares about? saurfang? rexxar? the old gods? the titans? burning legion... sargeras? bolvar?... any of the alliance lore characters...? out of all of that we get the thunder king? which noone has ever heard of or cares about? and sha?
EDIT: Also, all you're trying to do is talk crap about everything in the expansion. You're pretty much talking to yourself and going off-topic in your own thread.