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  1. #961
    I seem to recall that it was a very, very common complaint around here, in both Cata and Wrath, that older raids became invalidated by catch-up mechanics that allowed them to be bypassed late in the expansion. The general consensus, or at least the most vocalized one, was that people should have to progress through an expansion's raids in a linear fashion in order to reach current content. This was the model in TBC.

    The problem is that the model in TBC sucked the fat ass. Adding a new player to a raid required the entire raid to take time off to go back in time and get the rookie some gear and attunements from raids they had already done to death and didn't care to ever see again in their natural lifetimes, instead of doing the new and fresh content that was right in front of them.

    Resolving these two factors is LFR, a raid that you don't need a raiding team to go through. This method of character progression - this catch-up mechanism - which has received what looks like almost 50 pages of complaints - is probably one of the most requested features I've ever seen added. Let this be a lesson to all ye who beg for things to revert to the state of expansions past. Be careful what you wish for.

  2. #962
    Warchief Seefer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adieu View Post
    LFR lets the casuals see content. How is that the worst thing about this game? Without LFR 10m and 25m raiding would be dull and easy.
    Because cross realm everything has ruined raiding guilds and the community, it has bred bad players who seem to think LFR counts as experience when it doesn't, and it is nothing more than a loot pinata.

  3. #963
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Personally I hate LFR as well, I think it was the second worst thing put into this game.
    It has its appropriate place and its something I wanted put into the game since cross realm BGs first came onto the scene in mid 2006. Again, everyone's life doesn't revolve around a set schedule with 10/25 other people at all times. A good tool for players that have erratic work times among other possible outcomes and a great tool for alts (just shouldn't be the only option as it currently is).

  4. #964
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotef View Post
    Then why didn't you quit in the last three expansions then because, that's exactly what happened ya know (don't worry, we can all be a bit forgetful at times so I'm here to help you out! Yay!).



    I honestly don't give a single rat shit about what other people did with 5-mans nor whatever gear they gained from them. As a heroic raider that type of shit honestly doesn't concern me as gear is a means to an end, not for you to flaunt around with screaming "tee hee, look at me guys! Aren't I cool?" I honestly hope this decision comes back and bites them in the ass as I like having that gear drop from later 5-mans (and no, waiting on several long ass LFR queues with a lesser gear drop rate is not a good replacement) so I can keep my alts decently geared at a decent rate. That and enchants would be cheaper as well from DEs.
    Yeah god forbid you focus on 1 character maybe 2 and become great at them, gotta have all those alts that just sit there and do nothing but farm or do professions.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 12:54 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotef View Post
    It has its appropriate place and its something I wanted put into the game since cross realm BGs first came onto the scene in mid 2006. Again, everyone's life doesn't revolve around a set schedule with 10/25 other people at all times. A good tool for players that have erratic work times among other possible outcomes and a great tool for alts (just shouldn't be the only option as it currently is).
    Yeah that's when people pugged and saw the content back in WOTLK, god forbid people use their own server.

  5. #965
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    To me the ICC 5mans in WotLK and the Hour of Twilight 5mans in Cataclysm stood out in terms of storytelling and atmosphere, better than some of the raids in the game.
    Exactly! Loved the storytelling in these. No new 5-mans is terrible IMO! One person scenarios that have basically no rewards and dailies after dailies to tell a story is just plain boring. I cannot believe this is the route that Blizz is taking. I enjoy the game and have a lot of toons. I do have my issues with Mists but not enough to keep me from playing. But this has me thinking about unsubbing once I am bored with 5.2.

  6. #966
    Dreadlord Turbotef's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Because cross realm everything has ruined raiding guilds and the community, it has bred bad players who seem to think LFR counts as experience when it doesn't, and it is nothing more than a loot pinata.
    This is all personal opinion, bro, and I know for a fact you wouldn't even be able to back most of it up. Been along for the WoW ride myself since Jan 2005, and let me tell you that the community has always been shit even before cross realm systems were added in. I really wish you and other people would stop trying to play that card constantly.

  7. #967
    Fortunately, a lot of Blizzard's decisions are actually okay with the majority of the community. There are always going to be people that complain but to be honest those were probably the people that bitched and moaned in game and I am glad they are gone. I'm going to enjoy my dailies, wowkemon, and scenarios. Just because some people don't like them and think they are a bad idea doesn't mean that everybody hates them.. just that vocal minority.

    I am kind of disappointed that there will be no more 5 mans this expac but after reading a lot these posts it really does make sense. Now with LFR and scenarios there really is no point in making new 5 mans except for the sake of just making them. Scenarios tell better stories to me anyways. I don't have to focus too much on meters and mechanics and I can just enjoy the run.

  8. #968
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotef View Post
    This is all personal opinion, bro, and I know for a fact you wouldn't even be able to back most of it up. Been along for the WoW ride myself since Jan 2005, and let me tell you that the community has always been shit even before cross realm systems were added in. I really wish you and other people would stop trying to play that card constantly.
    Yeah cuz I was always called racist and homophobic names and told to go kill myself, yes there were trolls but guess what? They didn't last long because they got black listed, I was able to form friendships on my own server and avoid grouping with the jerks that DID exist, now it's in almost every LFD I do.....people who live in delusion such as you saying cross realm everything was a god send are the ones who are sugar coating.

  9. #969
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Yeah god forbid you focus on 1 character maybe 2 and become great at them, gotta have all those alts that just sit there and do nothing but farm or do professions.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 12:54 PM ----------



    Yeah that's when people pugged and saw the content back in WOTLK, god forbid people use their own server.
    Yeah, that because all servers are awesome and offer extremely optimal experiences to enjoy this game fully. Give me a fucking crying break here. I just moved off (whee, there goes $125 down the drain) my shit server after 6 years of being stubborn about it. I honestly wish i could have moved sooner but that also comes from me not wanting to fling Blizzard extra money for not fixing their own problems that they let stagnant.

  10. #970
    Good. I hate 5mans. I try to avoid them at all costs.

  11. #971
    How does working for your gear instead of getting hand outs breeding bad players? Last time I checked bad players do not get into raids. New 5-Mans give welfare epics and are for people who do not want to put in any effort into their toons. Gearing up alts is not difficult especially with boosted rep, so that is not an excuse. If you want to see story do the scenarios. They take 10 mins max anyway.

  12. #972
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotef View Post
    Yeah, that because all servers are awesome and offer extremely optimal experiences to enjoy this game fully. Give me a fucking crying break here. I just moved off (whee, there goes $125 down the drain) my shit server after 6 years of being stubborn about it. I honestly wish i could have moved sooner but that also comes from me not wanting to fling Blizzard extra money for not fixing their own problems that they let stagnant.
    They could have merged servers rather than do cross realm BS.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 01:03 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Adieu View Post
    How does working for your gear instead of getting hand outs breeding bad players? Last time I checked bad players do not get into raids. New 5-Mans give welfare epics and are for people who do not want to put in any effort into their toons. Gearing up alts is not difficult especially with boosted rep, so that is not an excuse. If you want to see story do the scenarios. They take 10 mins max anyway.
    If you are implying LFR is working for your gear than I must laugh, people sit and AFK, stand in bad crap, ignore what few mechanics they left in the raid.........it's a joke and worse than 5 mans.

  13. #973
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Yeah cuz I was always called racist and homophobic names and told to go kill myself, yes there were trolls but guess what? They didn't last long because they got black listed, I was able to form friendships on my own server and avoid grouping with the jerks that DID exist, now it's in almost every LFD I do.....people who live in delusion such as you saying cross realm everything was a god send are the ones who are sugar coating.
    Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're making most of that up. BGs, I can understand as competitive gaming areas can get people riled up. In the 3+ years LFD has been out, I've had maybe 10+ bad ones out of hundreds. I honestly get a worse experience listening to a CS complaint on the phone. Then again, maybe that's why i don't let little stuff like that phase me, that and not having to wait and hour or two after work at 2am to get a dungeon run whenever I wanted.

  14. #974
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotef View Post
    Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're making most of that up. BGs, I can understand as competitive gaming areas can get people riled up. In the 3+ years LFD has been out, I've had maybe 10+ bad ones out of hundreds. I honestly get a worse experience listening to a CS complaint on the phone. Then again, maybe that's why i don't let little stuff like that phase me, that and not having to wait and hour or two after work at 2am to get a dungeon run whenever I wanted.
    Could give a shit if you think I am making it up, in 1 dungeon run I said not a word and it was a clean run no wipes, at the end I was politely called a F word meaning homosexual and told to uninstall the game and kill myself, if you wish to ignore the fact that it happens a lot that is your choice but I know the truth and you can keep on being delusional, also I didn't wait for squat, I had a guild that I found that fit my times and needs I am sorry you don't want to put in the effort for that either.

  15. #975
    I'm implying putting time and effort into your toons. All those people who afk and stand in shit wont get raid spots. At least not in my raids. People who are in actual raiding guilds use lfr to practice, especially right now with the new raid. I seriously doubt you will see a lot of horrible players in the new LFR. Do lfr with your guildies. 4-8 players that are not brain dead does a lot in LFR.



    I do say the old LFR are awful to do and I tend to stay as far away as I can.

  16. #976
    Bliz's idea of content is dailies and scenarios.
    Why add 5 mans? You can spend just as much time doing the same dailies over and over and over. What the problem?

    Worst expansion by far...and not getting better.

  17. #977
    Dreadlord Turbotef's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Could give a shit if you think I am making it up, in 1 dungeon run I said not a word and it was a clean run no wipes, at the end I was politely called a F word meaning homosexual and told to uninstall the game and kill myself, if you wish to ignore the fact that it happens a lot that is your choice but I know the truth and you can keep on being delusional, also I didn't wait for squat, I had a guild that I found that fit my times and needs I am sorry you don't want to put in the effort for that either.
    Back in November 1998, I was walking home down the dirt road from the store after grabbing a Ruby Red Squirt and a bag of Sour Cream chips (was on my way back to play Zelda OoT and Half-Life) when this car passed by me and the passenger threw a 32oz plastic drink cup at my face.

    Point of the story? Shit happens sometimes. Random asshole will be a random asshole.

  18. #978
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterHamster View Post
    Yes, I think we all do. But not everyone appreciates how a new set of 5mans reduce the number of dungeons you farm
    Easy fix.

    For example, hypothetical new 5.2 dungeons could have dropped 489 ilvl gear (5.0 DAILIES ilvl, lower than 5.1 daileis, lower than HoF and Terrace NORMAL) and the old dungeons could have their loot revamped to 489 (including those that have them in their inventory).

    You just added new dungeons, without making old dungeons irrelevant.

    Dungeons are the core of MMORPGs, specifically WoW, this World of Dailycraft is desztroying everything, even the very CORE of the game.

    We deserve to have dungeons content, Blizzard is trying to inflate their numbers by giving us CHEAP content instead of push hard the content we deserve.
    Last edited by Crashdummy; 2013-03-12 at 05:16 PM.

  19. #979
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nelrock View Post
    Bliz's idea of content is dailies and scenarios.
    Why add 5 mans? You can spend just as much time doing the same dailies over and over and over. What the problem?

    Worst expansion by far...and not getting better.
    The setting, story, challenge modes, and raids (well, except HoF) are all excellent IMO. Its the gating VP gear behind a rep (LOL, gotta work twice to get that item, LOL) among other things (and not even reducing the old VP to JP) that has be throwing a shit fit. That and no flying for my alts for ease of access.

  20. #980
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adieu View Post
    I'm implying putting time and effort into your toons. All those people who afk and stand in shit wont get raid spots. At least not in my raids. People who are in actual raiding guilds use lfr to practice, especially right now with the new raid. I seriously doubt you will see a lot of horrible players in the new LFR. Do lfr with your guildies. 4-8 players that are not brain dead does a lot in LFR.



    I do say the old LFR are awful to do and I tend to stay as far away as I can.
    If anyone told me they are using LFR to practice I would laugh at them because they remove mechanics and dumb down the damage, I was nodding off on my mage in MSV LFR (before ToES release) and was still doing 35k and lived through the fight............LFR is a JOKE.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 01:19 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotef View Post
    Back in November 1998, I was walking home down the dirt road from the store after grabbing a Ruby Red Squirt and a bag of Sour Cream chips (was on my way back to play Zelda OoT and Half-Life) when this car passed by me and the passenger threw a 32oz plastic drink cup at my face.

    Point of the story? Shit happens sometimes. Random asshole will be a random asshole.
    Yep but it doesn't happen on a daily basis, I can go into an LFD and be called all sorts of colorful racist names or other remarks that ruin my fun and experience even if I don't say or do anything wrong, people say those who want the days of Vanilla/BC have on rose colored glasses but the people who think todays model is great and nothing horrible has come from all this have their eyes completely covered and their fingers in their ears going "LALALALA I can't heeeeeeeeeear you"
    Last edited by Seefer; 2013-03-12 at 05:20 PM.

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