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  1. #1

    should 10 man raids have 1 extra piece of loot?

    I'm 486 disc /485 shadow priest Healyourmind on Stormrage in a guild called Grave Yard Shifters. We are a 10 man raiding guild with some of the most horbile comps ever. but we all have 1 thing in common we love to raid and have fun but the way gear drops in 10 man some of us have fell behind in loot and having several tanks and dps at around 490s main tank is 495 a warrior named swoody. while we have healers like me who have had the worst luck and also have had bit more loot trouble and slaking a little bit behind our friends. i just had this idea this morning but i see no reason why it just has to drop only 2 pieces of loot. it would be a bit faster and easer to gear up whole group if a 3rd loot piece was added only 2 loot pieces per boss with several agility wearers and 2 priest healers is a bit much. the loot just needs to be a little more.
    Last edited by fireywrath; 2013-03-11 at 10:16 AM.

  2. #2
    I feel, with u, one thing is for sure they need to change whats going on in 10 mans now cause people get frustrated and quit the game instead. Cause there are no option for competativiness for a raider now in 10 man , u get punished to mutch if u want to keep a nice tight raid stable. Not all 10 mans have the lux to keep several teams to push up their loot on main raiders to compensate for the crappy loot differency it is in 10 man now.
    I have no suggestion , but now the way its done now dont work at all, it gives more frustration to the already punished 10 mans as it is. They talk about how mutch more work it is for the 25 mans, but this is silly, its all about logistic and how u do it. I have runned 25 as 10, but the logistic is the same. So its sad to see a game that struggles with balance from befoure gething now totally out of hand. The arguments are many, but it all boils down to that u choose 25 man and u choose 10 man, no one should be punished in less game rewards for that, it makes u feel less of a player and quit instead.
    Last edited by Tahsou; 2013-03-11 at 10:30 AM.

  3. #3
    With that logic why not drop double the loot or hell, 10 pieces?

    If you are getting behind then the loot policy of your raid should be looked at. The point of loot is to strengthen the team so you can kill more shit. Having one priest win every piece of loot and sit on ilevel 496 and having the other win nothing and be 20 ilevels behind is stupid in my eyes. Also valor gear and crafted mats are there to make up for bad luck. Our guild takes essenses that drop and give enough to people that need them so they can craft items.

  4. #4
    Stood in the Fire Winkle's Avatar
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    The loot drop rate is based on what they feel is reasonable to ensure the content remains compelling for a suitable length of time. If they increase the number of items that drop per boss they also effectively reduce the number of times you would need to clear the place to fully gear from it.

    Having a mixed raid comp for both gear distribution and buff provision is generally good practice anyway, and would remain so regardless of how many items a boss dropped. Just beacuse you could run a raid with 10 paladins doesn't mean you'd ever want too.

  5. #5
    Brewmaster AutomaticBadger's Avatar
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    The issue then becomes that people will simply farm more versions of Normal runs in the first week for the added gear. Meaning anyone in a really competitive guild will be forced to run it in 10 at patch week the move to 25.

    Then also with the new gear 10 man will gear faster and people will /cry about it being unfair.

    I'd rather go a step further and just drops blank toekns that can be redeemed for items that the boss has access to. Like you get [charm of <insert boss>] this can be redeemed with a vendor for whatever that boss might be able to drop. This would let us keeo the current 2 for 10 and 5 for 25 and then there will be no real problem of having gear from bosses you haven't been able to kill. No more weeks of "oh look holy Paladin gear dropped again" and you have no Paladin even in the raid
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  6. #6
    I made the suggestion back in Cataclysm that ten man should drop two tier tokens, each with 5 classes on them, and 25man should keep the 3 tier token system. That would help reduce the amount of "hey shaman, how's your third 4-set going for you" while others haven't even got a single 2-set bonus.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by AutomaticBadger View Post
    The issue then becomes that people will simply farm more versions of Normal runs in the first week for the added gear. Meaning anyone in a really competitive guild will be forced to run it in 10 at patch week the move to 25.

    Then also with the new gear 10 man will gear faster and people will /cry about it being unfair.

    I'd rather go a step further and just drops blank toekns that can be redeemed for items that the boss has access to. Like you get [charm of <insert boss>] this can be redeemed with a vendor for whatever that boss might be able to drop. This would let us keeo the current 2 for 10 and 5 for 25 and then there will be no real problem of having gear from bosses you haven't been able to kill. No more weeks of "oh look holy Paladin gear dropped again" and you have no Paladin even in the raid
    hell yeah lol why didn't i bring my holy paly this time it could of used that dam dont de that i have a holy paly nope just de away oh god.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by AutomaticBadger View Post
    The issue then becomes that people will simply farm more versions of Normal runs in the first week for the added gear. Meaning anyone in a really competitive guild will be forced to run it in 10 at patch week the move to 25.

    Then also with the new gear 10 man will gear faster and people will /cry about it being unfair.

    I'd rather go a step further and just drops blank toekns that can be redeemed for items that the boss has access to. Like you get [charm of <insert boss>] this can be redeemed with a vendor for whatever that boss might be able to drop. This would let us keeo the current 2 for 10 and 5 for 25 and then there will be no real problem of having gear from bosses you haven't been able to kill. No more weeks of "oh look holy Paladin gear dropped again" and you have no Paladin even in the raid
    The blank token and redeemed for items that the boss has access to, is one of the best ideas so far, and would be a verry good solution for 10 man problems right now.

  9. #9
    Immortal Sigma's Avatar
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    Sure, I dont mind if 10 mans get an extra piece of loot. But you also have to increase the amount that 25 mans get at the same time to the same ratio.
    Quote Originally Posted by Acelius View Post
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  10. #10
    The Lightbringer Razorice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Thoris View Post
    With that logic why not drop double the loot or hell, 10 pieces?
    Make it 20, just to be sure everyone gets loot. Oh and Off-spec can get loot too then

  11. #11
    Diversity is needed in wow, even for optimisation.
    another point : maybe you've a problem with loot attributions... loots must balance the ilvl between raid members, not upgrade one mate totally while others stay with same stuff at the end of the raid (even if same armor type drop, all miscellaneous items can go to another char).

    about the 10ID loot's number : 2 is good : all raids have a lot of bosses, don't forget 2/10 is 1/5
    5.2 raid = 12 boss = 24 loots/ID => so 1 to 3 loots per week is a really good number, don't you think?
    i know, not all people will clean, but don't forget loots are not ONLY made for upgrade you and kill the next boss, they're also a REWARD for being able to kill the boss/

    About loots : an idea : all items who must be dezed could became bind-on-account with an in-game option, for attrib to a raid member's alt.
    Last edited by Pej; 2013-03-11 at 10:52 AM.

  12. #12
    How about a system that ensures that loot can only drop for the classes that participated in the boss kill?
    Meaning that if there was no class that could wear mail, no mail items would drop. Maybe make it spec dependent as well?

    That would solve a lot of problems, seeing as we had to disenchant 5 items out of our 6 Sha of Fear Heroic kills on 10m because no class was available during the boss kill that could wear those items.
    Last edited by Snuzzfizzle; 2013-03-11 at 10:56 AM.

  13. #13
    RNG is RNG. It is not that much better in 25 man. I used to raid 25 but switched down to 10 in MoP, really not noticing a difference in loot, almost the opposite.

    After killing a boss 15+ times in 25 man, there were still drops that never dropped, and some drops that always dropped. Remember Magmaw HC, oh how I wanted those tank boots.

    After 3 weeks, we was disenchanting the 2h mace, even our tank warriors had 2 for his off spec. We averaged on over two 2h maces every week, we were disenchanting them for 80% of the tier. Same went for that holy chest he dropped.

    Tier tokens was the same thing, some people had their alts off spec geared whereas some tokens, not even half the people had even normal version.

    I do not understand why people think 25 and 10 is so different. I am in 10 now and it is just fine. I would not want more loot, especially now with coins, feels like you are gearing up to fast already. Gearing up should be a journey, not a gift.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
    Sure, I dont mind if 10 mans get an extra piece of loot. But you also have to increase the amount that 25 mans get at the same time to the same ratio.
    25 mans already get more loot per player AS WELL as having it easier to distribute their loot since they are less affected by RNG due to having a larger spread of classes... Plus they get more than twice as many thunderforged. I think they are fine the way they are...

  15. #15
    Bloodsail Admiral Saegno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
    Sure, I dont mind if 10 mans get an extra piece of loot. But you also have to increase the amount that 25 mans get at the same time to the same ratio.
    This. I'm all for 10 mans getting more but what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
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  16. #16
    Id like it to go back to like it was in Firelands for 10m loot, 2 peices and a token.

    Not this 1 piece and 1 token like in T14.

  17. #17
    Stood in the Fire Confucius's Avatar
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    main problem with 10 is not the 2 loot that drops but the fact that way way more loot that drops can useless and DE'd compared to 25.

  18. #18
    With the Coin/Charm system they added for MoP, it's less of an issue.

    Sure, there's always the chance that you'll get unlucky, but if you save your coins for the bosses where you *really* want something, overall it feels less shitty than previous expansions.

    It would be nice to have the loot table limited to things that are usable, but that would lead to people gaming it, having raid groups set up to get just plate to drop, etc.

  19. #19
    Bloodsail Admiral Saegno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theiea View Post
    Id like it to go back to like it was in Firelands for 10m loot, 2 peices and a token.

    Not this 1 piece and 1 token like in T14.
    I can agree with this. Tokens should be on a separate loot table from regular drops.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    If you're semi-hardcore or semi-casual what's the other half? To me, they're both the same thing.
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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
    Sure, I dont mind if 10 mans get an extra piece of loot. But you also have to increase the amount that 25 mans get at the same time to the same ratio.
    You do realize that atm it's 1:5 10 man and it's 1:4 25 man loot ratio, I totally agree 10's should get 1 extra loot because, what you run into a lot in 10 man is pieces that can't be used because that certain class isn't there. Like for example my group doesn't have a hunter or shaman so all mail gear goes to waste.

    Where as in a 25 man you won't ever come across that to often till much later on because of having a larger pool of classes and specs in the raid.

    So yes please give us 1 more loot slot, tired of d/e'n mail gear.
    Last edited by kilj; 2013-03-11 at 11:43 AM.

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