abortion wrong/right?

[Tradewind]

Why not draw the line at birth?

Also, sex doesn't create life. It simply continues life. (course the definition of life is fuzzy at best)

*Insert Keanu Reeves shocked face*

That's actually very interesting lol and made me think of something new...

[Deleted]

A fetus is not self aware. Is someone on life support alive? Yes. So is it wrong to pull the plug? No. Do you think that a pro life Governor or Senator, or even Rush Limbaugh himself wouldn't have their daughter have an abortion if the baby were conceived from a rape? They would do it as secretly as possible and continue throwing their hypocrisy at the world.

This issue is more about people wanting to control what other people do because they aren't happy themselves. People aren't that worried about other people. Are all of these pro lifers adopting babies? No. They're standing in front of abortion clinics with pictures of aborted fetuses.

So because the fetus cannot think or feel the loss of its life,its ok?
No,that's were we step in.They can't feel the loss of their life.But we can.We,as society,should think for these lives.That's our job as elders.We feel their loss and it's not ok.

[Twotonsteak]

Giving the father any say would deny the mother her autonomy.

This is a double-standard often used and abused. The fact is that it takes two to make a baby. Even if you opt for a "test-tube" infant you still need a "donor." As such I think it's only acceptable that the father, should he wish to be involved, be given a say during the pregnancy. Like-wise should the mother deny the father any say, assuming he want's to have one, then she should not be able to petition for things such as support.

After all she wanted total control and responsibility for the pregnancy, right?

[Underverse]

Abortion is simply one more powerful group of humans thinking that is perfectly okay to do whatever they want to a less powerful group of humans. Why have the child when I can just kill the less powerful fetus for my own convenience? Why pick cotton when I can just work a less powerful black guy to death picking it for me for my own convenience?

If one is wrong, both are wrong. Either all humans have the most basic liberty to live unless that life would cost the death of multiple lives or the death of a more innocent life, or the very premise of liberty is shattered.

You assume parasites have a right to whatever this liberty thing is. I'm pretty sure, btw, that fetuses and babies are entirely dependent on their mothers. Some liberty that is.

[phayze]

To the OP: it is not your place or mine to tell a woman or a family how to live their life, nor how to deal with the consequences that life brings us. The very same pro-lifers want to ban all public sex education, they want to ban all forms of publicly funded birth control, they do not want women to even be allowed to talk to their doctors regarding what and how they can avoid unwanted pregnancies.

All that aside, bringing an unwanted child into the world, then basically ignoring all of their most basic needs as they grow through childhood, adolescence, adulthood, and old age is something society typically does not want to invest in. Sure, there are a few abortions done because people were irresponsible, but the majority is because the parent(s) are not in any position to give the lifetime of care and support that this new child will need, and society is not going to step up to the plate. Yes, we lose on potentially good, upstanding citizens. But we also don't breed a generation of what prolifers like to call "welfare babies and jailhouse population".

We can sit here til next decade and not change each other's position on this issue. But neither you, nor me, has the right to tell a mom what she can or cannot do with her body. If she is willing to take the psychological and physiological burden of an abortion, then all the power to her. I would much rather have 1 child that grows in a loving, caring home with parents that truly want that child, than 20 children that are unloved and unwanted.

Stop playing dictator. Live your life for yourself. Don't try to preach onto others.

[Underverse]

tbh, this issue has been hotly debated for such a long time that I doubt a thread on mmo champion will have a ton of benefit, so I'll say this and be done. Abortion is wrong because it destroys the life of a child. Some will disagree with me because they either disagree when "valuable" life begins, or disagree that life is worth protecting. It all comes down to worldview.

Worldview, and facts

[davesurfer]

You assume parasites have a right to whatever this liberty thing is. I'm pretty sure, btw, that fetuses and babies are entirely dependent on their mothers. Some liberty that is.

As is a 1 year old. Not sure your distinction works

[Deleted]

It's neither.

/endthread

[Deleted]

sincerely hoping this is a poor attempt at trolling, because that kind of thought process is.. terrible.

free access to safe abortion needs to become a human right~

What's terrible about saving a life?
Is an accident or a rape enough reason for you to forfeit your own life?
You would be ok if you didn't exist because some women somewhere made the mistake of having unprotected sex due to being drunk at a party?
Is that enough reason for you to disappear?
I find this thought process terrible.

[Lily Crowley]

For the thread name; there isn't really a right or wrong answer to the question. Its neither imo. Or as I like to call it; a necessary evil.

The moral areas of abortion is grey, but do you really think a total ban to it would be a good solution? I think we already have a good middle-way solution, the 12 weeks rule.

You would be ok if you didn't exist because some women somewhere made the mistake of having unprotected sex due to being drink at a party?

Side-eyeing you hard because of your assumption that the woman is in the wrong when it could very much be the guy who refused to use a condom because "it doesn't feel as good!".
If any man/boy in here is so against abortion, wrap your dicks up! Protect yourselves and all those potential fetuses as well! Takle some responsibility yourselves instead of always dumping it on the girl in question. Sheesh.

[Crashdummy]

Women already have a choice.To have safe sex or have sex that can lead to pregnancy.
Sex has been society lately as something less serious this is really is.
It is primordially the creation of life.And there's nothing wrong with it being fun or having casual sex.But that shouldn't lessen the seriousness of it.
By having unsafe/unresponsible sex you make the choice to possibly become pregnant.
That's where women make their choice.
Not when they are pregnant and a life is waiting to be lived.By then it is too late.And one should become responsible for a life is depending on them.

This is wrong on so many levls...

No non-intrusive prevention system is fail proof.
Raped women dont have the choice to have "safe sex"

Those are only two examples of how your kind of mentality fails to take into consideration the women that is having to make such a difficult choice.

[Twinkelle]

So because the fetus cannot think or feel the loss of its life,its ok?
No,that's were we step in.They can't feel the loss of their life.But we can.We,as society,should think for these lives.That's our job as elders.We feel their loss and it's not ok.

There is no loss of life. Remove the foetus from it's mother during the period where abortion is permissible and it will die. That's a growth, not a living person like you or me.

I'm entirely OK with abortions. I do not mourn a single one.

[Underverse]

As is a 1 year old. Not sure your distinction works

Isn't a 1 year old a baby?

[Crashdummy]

What's terrible about saving a life?
Is an accident or a rape enough reason for you to forfeit your life?
You would be ok if you didn't exist because some women somewhere made the mistake of having unprotected sex due to being drink at a party?
Is that enough reason for you disappear?
I find this thought process terrible.

You dont dissapear, you never appear in the first place. You dont exist. You are just a collection of cells at that point.

And you trying to simplify the situations that lead to a woman having to make such a choice makes you a troll or a person having a terrible thought.

Infracted: Don't call other users a "troll".

[Deleted]

This is wrong on so many levls...

No non-intrusive prevention system is fail proof.
Raped women dont have the choice to have "safe sex"

Those are only two examples of how your kind of mentality fails to take into consideration the women that is having to make such a difficult choice.

I already talked about rape in my post.
It is a horrible and sad event.But one wrong does not make a right.
Even if it's painful,a life still needs to be saved.And society should assist such women,and compensate them for their greater effort.

[jonoy8]

There is no loss of life. Remove the foetus from it's mother during the period where abortion is permissible and it will die. That's a growth, not a living person like you or me.

I'm entirely OK with abortions. I do not mourn a single one.

~snip~

hardly looks like a "bunch of cells" to me


I think it's killing, but alot of wrong things go in the world, it's something I will never take part in

fact is you can even have late term abortions up to around 8 months, a 8 month baby can live outside the womb, nothing but infantcide

Infracted: Don't post NSFW images please.

[Catta]

Explain. That was far too simple.

We are denied the right to it until it is no longer illegal to abort and even then the mothers health and safety would override the fetus.
The fathers right to autonomy or offspring can and should not override the mothers.

Imagine the fathers family having Huntington's. The father does not know if he has and does not wish to know. However he has gotten a woman pregnant who wants to abort the fetus should it be shown to have Huntington's. If the child is shown to have Huntington's then the father has it too. Should the mother's right to know be overridden by the fathers right to not to know?

If your answer is yes, then should the child once it is born never be able to be tested for it as long as the father does not wish to know?

[Vyxn]

It isnt about right or wrong.

Its about having the right to make the choice or not.

And i think women should have the right to decide it.

It has everything to do what is right or wrong if you ignore that then you condom murder. You need to make a personal decision when does a human life begins. some believe at conception some believe when a fetus is viable out side the womb and some believe at birth, when you make that personal decision anything after that time is murder

[DEATHETERNAL]

You assume parasites have a right to whatever this liberty thing is.

Human parasites (the unemployed, those who live off welfare, etc) should have that liberty, yes.

There is a difference, you don't legally exist until the moment of birth. A slave is already a person.

You want to make a solely legalistic argument? Wonderful, so all I need to do is get the law to say that black people don't legally exist as people and then slavery is A-okay in your book, right? Oh, it isn't? Then make up a half way decent argument.

Stop playing dictator. Live your life for yourself. Don't try to preach onto others.

The same arguments used by the slave masters.... I am called crazy, yet the abortionists themselves show it all too clearly.

[Dedweight]

For me it depends on the situation, if it's conception through rape then no I wouldn't think an abortion would be wrong. Now if the couple had unprotected sex, with no plans of getting pregnant, then decided to abort there might be a problem(same goes for those financially unable to support a child but get pregnant anyway). If you are unable to support the new child or don't want one to begin with you should take the proper precautions(both male and female members) otherwise deal with the consequences.