My issue with Blizzards new "gearing through LFR" game design.

[Xorn]

More sha crystals available = cheaper enchants. Why would you want that?

Because I also want to be able to enchant things for myself and my alts (who are not all enchanters). The Sha Crystals have to come from somewhere, and I don't want to be forced to drag my lock through old content, or rely on a once per day CD to get them.

[Obtuse]

I read through a number of posts and didn't see it mentioned so just in case you weren't aware, all 5.0 valor gear is notably cheaper now. I'm pretty sure there are pieces for 400 valor now. Most expensive was maybe 1000? Yes you still need rep to access them, but you gotta do a "little" bit of work to justify a cheap and effective reward.

[dexx]

they put loads of elder charms into the treasure cache scenario (seriously, i got 16 from 1 run and also picked up another key last night)

Can you tell me more about this "treasure cache scenario"? Is it a new 3 man scenario added for 5.2?

[ihyln]

Blizz is pushing LFR so they don't have to create dungeons to add catch up gear. Just more laziness, nothing else.

[Thelxi]

I honestly think that making justice points actually useful again would solve most of it. I don't mind linear progression, but I do appreciate reasonable shortcuts as the expansion goes on. The game is too old and stale for me to be happy with the clusterfuck and weekly/daily timesink that is maintaining alts right now.

[Wafffles]

Blizz is pushing LFR so they don't have to create dungeons to add catch up gear. Just more laziness, nothing else.

Want to talk about lazy? Lazy is whining to Blizz for a free-epicz 5 man so you can catch up in 45 minutes to the people who spend the past few months actively raiding for their gear. Lazy is not putting in a bit of effort to actually run the last raid tier for gear.

[Mormolyce]

My guild cleared all of MSV the first week it launched before any LFR was available, in pure dungeon blues and maybe 1 purple if you were very lucky. And it was harder then. You absolutely DO NOT need to step into LFR at any point if you don't want to. If all you want to do is raid NM then just do so, get all your loot from there. Hell, you don't even really need VP gear. Once you get to HMs all that LFR and VP loot is just junk anyway.

I feel like there's this huge chasm between what a lot of players have convinced themselves they HAVE to do and what they actually do.

That said, I personally don't get their logic with old gear costing VP. Why would I spend VP on lower ilvl gear instead of saving up for the new stuff? I guess it's for people who need to raise their ilvl now and aren't going to unlock the new VP gear for ages. But still.

[sergel02]

Can you tell me more about this "treasure cache scenario"? Is it a new 3 man scenario added for 5.2?

Yup. There are some videos on youtube. You find keys randomly on the Isle I think, and they are consumed when you enter the scenario. You have 5 minutes, and just run for loot while avoiding traps and mobs.

[Therougetitan]

It's.. easier to gear up more than ever.

My druid dinged 90, I bought some crafted gear like the new pvp crafted stuff and hit 460. I spent 10minutes in isle of thunder for a rare to spawn and I tagged it, got the key to Lei Shen's palace. I spent the 5 minutes getting 10 elder charms in it. After that I spent a couple hours in MV and used all my coins. My ilevel went from 460 to 470. I haven't even run HoF or Terrace yet. It is insanely easy to gear alts now, I don't know why I'm surprised at the topic since people complain about everything.

[Thelxi]

The illusion of gearing up easily is bigger than ever. What actually is happening is that the gap between dungeon-LFR-normal-HC gear is bigger than ever. LFR is now the equivalent of what used to be 5man dungeon gear in terms of effectiveness, with the big difference being that you have to deal with weekly lockouts if you want to gear up an alt instead of being able to chain heroics at your own pace. This is obviously good business for blizzard, but frustrating for many people.

[Xorn]

The illusion of gearing up easily is bigger than ever. What actually is happening is that the gap between dungeon-LFR-normal-HC gear is bigger than ever. LFR is now the equivalent of what used to be 5man dungeon gear in terms of effectiveness, with the big difference being that you have to deal with weekly lockouts if you want to gear up an alt instead of being able to chain heroics at your own pace. This is obviously good business for blizzard, but frustrating for many people.

How is it good business for them? They get paid the same no matter how many times we log in.

[yjmark]

The illusion of gearing up easily is bigger than ever. What actually is happening is that the gap between dungeon-LFR-normal-HC gear is bigger than ever. LFR is now the equivalent of what used to be 5man dungeon gear in terms of effectiveness, with the big difference being that you have to deal with weekly lockouts if you want to gear up an alt instead of being able to chain heroics at your own pace. This is obviously good business for blizzard, but frustrating for many people.

In TBC, you could not chain heroics since they were locked out daily. So LFR is intended to be more similar to TBC (from gearing, and not difficulty).

Also, you can still get valor gear from current 5-mans. So LFR is not the "only gearing" step right?

Finally, Blizzard stated that LFR is only in the progression path for the first tier. Not necessarily for future tiers. At least, that was my understanding of their post.

[Djuntas]

I think the main problem with this, is that LFR sucks as a gearing way. I personally don't play wow much anymore, so when I do sub I dont gear at all, but for people who haft to go trough LFR to gear up...poor them. Id much rather grind 5 mans for this. Gear is just way to get to the point off the game to a sertain point.

[Deleted]

personally i prefer the new gearing system a lot more.

the fact that in WotLK and Cata you had 3 dungeons that could farm over and over agian. for some gear that was on par with the 2nd last raid bosses just didnt feel right.
i like now how you go through each step of content like you did in vanilla and BC before you end up with current content. people have been requesting this old style progress for ages. and i never thought it was a good idea, but now that LFR is used. it works like a charm and im very pleased to see it done like this.

[Geegeez]

I resubbed in January adter a 5 year break and just hit fully epic in all slots this past week, so about two months to gear up completely through LFR. I think the pacing is fine and it's definitely faster than Vanilla/TBC, so I'm not seeing the issue here.

LFR is as high as I will go due to time constraints, so no raiding for me beyond that. But two months is pretty damn fast to get fully geared as compared to how it used to be when I did both hardcore and casual raiding.

[Super Kami Dende]

Yeah I don't think you understand how openraid works but ok whatever. It is clear you aren't interested in solutions you just want to whine.

I sat in the Open raid queue for 2 hours, I posted on the forums, and also posted in the general chat area for a few hours.

There were NONE that fit around my time schedule. So please shut your mouth, instead of just resorting to the typical "HURR YOU JUST WANT TO WHINE HURRR" card.

---------- Post added 2013-03-15 at 02:33 PM ----------

I resubbed in January adter a 5 year break and just hit fully epic in all slots this past week, so about two months to gear up completely through LFR. I think the pacing is fine and it's definitely faster than Vanilla/TBC, so I'm not seeing the issue here.

LFR is as high as I will go due to time constraints, so no raiding for me beyond that. But two months is pretty damn fast to get fully geared as compared to how it used to be when I did both hardcore and casual raiding.

So I should have to be subscribed.. for 2 months of not having any fun, and being mindlessly bored of grinding before I can actually start to be able to raid with my friends?

Sounds pretty fucking stupid to me.

[rhandric]

How is it good business for them? They get paid the same no matter how many times we log in.

Longer it takes to gear -> longer people stay subbed -> more subs

Of course, then you have the "I want it now or I quit!" group of players, but...well, Blizzard would probably notice their absence, but would anyone else?

[Geegeez]

I sat in the Open raid queue for 2 hours, I posted on the forums, and also posted in the general chat area for a few hours.

There were NONE that fit around my time schedule. So please shut your mouth, instead of just resorting to the typical "HURR YOU JUST WANT TO WHINE HURRR" card.

---------- Post added 2013-03-15 at 02:33 PM ----------




So I should have to be subscribed.. for 2 months of not having any fun, and being mindlessly bored of grinding before I can actually start to be able to raid with my friends?

Sounds pretty fucking stupid to me.

Well I had to level to 90 from 80 during that time (got SoR'd), and it did take me longer to get used to the game because of all the changes.

Also if you're raiding with friends why are you doing LFR? Aren't you doing normal raids?

[jimlow]

I share the OP's sentiment. While I agree we don't need a instant catch up mechanic, any player joining in patch 5.4 or later is going to have a significantly harder time catching up to anyone. I fear that once SoO is out most people will run just that with most of their characters. Also once the end of expac lull kicks in and people who are only doing 5.4 content quit, increased que times and general poor playing/sportsmenship will render LFR a even bigger chore that people will actively avoid.

[Osmeric]

No, they probably wouldn't. But for the vast majority of raiding guilds/players who grind away for months and months in normal mode raids, only to then realize that everything they had worked for is now pointless because of a new 5-man, such instant catch-ups are hugely demoralizing, and lead to overall sub losses for the game.

As opposed to the great majority of people who ground away in T14 normal, didn't finish the tier (median was 9/16), and then have their gear outclassed by T15 LFR?

Raid participation in T15 normal is horrific right now, down from 40+K guilds to about 13K guilds. These people know they won't be able to finish T15 normal either, which is hugely demoralizing. So, they give up.