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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadii View Post
    Well Ele shamans are bringing more utility to the raid than a mage does, with totems, off healing if needed etc. As a mage you bring medicore dps.
    I agree, and I did mention that. Ele Shamans are doing well right now, and they do bring utility. Except head over to the Shaman forums and you'll see the exact opposite argument. Higher utility shouldn't be a reason for having lower DPS, Ele Shamans have been middle to last of the pack pre-5.2.

    Again, I'm all for Mage buffs, I leveled one just so I could switch over from Ele Shaman, I just dont understand the entitlement that some players seem to have about being #1 over others, with or without the utility.

  2. #162
    Brewmaster Kiry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaintOnASign View Post
    I never said "every single person in this thread". But there are quite a few people who are very specific of being #1, you can't deny that. And frankly, if we're being realistic, not every single Mage in the game is being replaced or sat. Yeah, some very hardcore guilds who class-stack will prefer other classes, but I think we also forget that Mages have actually been in a position to be stacked too. Not every class has had that... luxury?

    Yeah, again. If this was a massive epidemic scouring the land of Azeroth, I'd understand. But its not. Exaggerating your point doesn't really help. Again, I agree with the buffs, but at a certain point, things do get overblown.
    In a raid tier that emphasizes movement, turret classes aren't doing so well. Instead of modifying things, Blizzard grounded us more (see arcane). We are surprised and trying to adapt. Add to that our dps issues. So picture us a bit defensive when someone comes into our thread misunderstanding our issues.

    Ty but let us continue to have our dialogue. We need it right now.
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  3. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaintOnASign View Post
    I agree, and I did mention that. Ele Shamans are doing well right now, and they do bring utility. Except head over to the Shaman forums and you'll see the exact opposite argument. Higher utility shouldn't be a reason for having lower DPS, Ele Shamans have been middle to last of the pack pre-5.2.

    Again, I'm all for Mage buffs, I leveled one just so I could switch over from Ele Shaman, I just dont understand the entitlement that some players seem to have about being #1 over others, with or without the utility.
    If they gave us some decent raid utility, I wouldn't mind being middle of the pack, but we're well, WELL under "middle".

    Seriously, either top DPS or good utility. One of the two has to happen.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 09:15 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiry View Post
    In a raid tier that emphasizes movement, turret classes aren't doing so well. Instead of modifying things, Blizzard grounded us more (see arcane). We are surprised and trying to adapt. Add to that our dps issues. So picture us a bit defensive when someone comes into our thread misunderstanding our issues.

    Ty but let us continue to have our dialogue. We need it right now.
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    @Whoever doesn't know the Mage issues: Please just GTFO. You have no idea how annoying it's been to be a Mage since MoP and if you're annoyed because a Mage 1v1'd you hardcore in PvP, you have no need to be here.

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  4. #164
    the buff was not sufficient for pve, raiding now, boost to bomb damage is only going to effect aoe fights like protectors or amnbershaper where you can spread living bomb to 3 targets or spam nether tempst on 12 adds. Other than that i see no reason why they wont revert or tune this buff to make frost bomb not be so buffed in pvp, and come up with a better fix for pve

  5. #165
    Arcane is seems "okay" NT is doing really good damage with mastery as arcane

    They should buff the l90 talents and it'll be fine imo.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragon9870 View Post
    Which is how I feel about Arcane.

    Arcane is the ULTIMATE turret specc. On Patchwerk-style fights, Arcane should ALWAYS, I mean, ALWAYS be the #1 DPS (unless the Mage has no idea how to play Mage or is completely ungeared against geared folk).
    Because you say so ? ALWAYS ?

  7. #167
    Why so much QQ? The will RE-EVALUATE Mages once again... as the hot fix says... Calm your titties. I've managed to stay very competitive with the rest of my raid group regardless of the mage situation atm.

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emek View Post
    the buff was not sufficient for pve, raiding now, boost to bomb damage is only going to effect aoe fights like protectors or amnbershaper where you can spread living bomb to 3 targets or spam nether tempst on 12 adds. Other than that i see no reason why they wont revert or tune this buff to make frost bomb not be so buffed in pvp, and come up with a better fix for pve
    I'd read the blue notes. They already compensated frostbomb for pvp.
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  9. #169
    this buff is not enough. just saying

  10. #170
    I thought the buffs were pretty good, particularly for frost. Frost bomb hits like a truck now.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Thelxi View Post
    Wow. What about pvp.. nvm
    Tried playing a caster in pvp atm? You might as well /sleep cause your gonna get silenced to death.

  12. #172
    good(its not bad overall) buff imo well....not so flashy for fire mages but for frost and arcane (esp arcane) its a decent 5-6% overall buff

    i mean i was kinda expecting frostbolt/fireball/arcane blast buff >_>

    what buff were ppl expecting btw??? dont except a raid cd in middle of patch >_> wait for next patch or even expansion for that.....

    edit: frostbomb on pvp is gona be....interesting......mmmmmm
    Last edited by Soulstrike; 2013-03-13 at 05:18 AM.

  13. #173
    The buff looked pretty good for Frost. I was near the top on most fights.

    I was able to rank ~14th on Jin'rokh the Breaker at 176965 dps wearing two 483 items.

  14. #174
    Why do I feel that this was a last ditch attempt to see some mages in the current heroic progression? As it stands and as I understand the top 10 who are working on heroic fights at the moment are not using any mages.

  15. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Skidd View Post
    Why do I feel that this was a last ditch attempt to see some mages in the current heroic progression? As it stands and as I understand the top 10 who are working on heroic fights at the moment are not using any mages.
    Well.. they already made mages roll another characters and now mages are hopelessly(not really, but in world first race they are) undergeared for them, cause they funneled all their gear to non-mage characters. So even if this brings mages on par with others, none of those guilds will use mages, unless they got the gear to match other people.

  16. #176
    Not sure what you guys are talking about, go watch the Blood Legion stream - they are not sitting all their mages.
    My style is rich, dope, phat; in which we'll bake a cake today that looks rich.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Bullarkie View Post
    The buff looked pretty good for Frost. I was near the top on most fights.

    I was able to rank ~14th on Jin'rokh the Breaker at 176965 dps wearing two 483 items.
    So with the buff your ranked ~ 450 for 10man on a fight that wouldnt have the top guys touching anymore due to starting heroics today. with 2 483 items, does that mean the rest are heroic items?

    The buff is a bandaid and an extremely average one at that.

    I personally just quit the raid team, not that they want/need as many mages as we have in raid atm. TBH I haven't had fun on mage in mop since 5.1 hit and even then invoc was a pain in 5.0. Arcane severely burnt me out with the no movement and bullet in brain rotation. Now with no spec being crash hot im gonna have my cry and move on.

    GL with the mage guys hopefully they will address the problems before mop ends, if they do I'll come back.

  18. #178
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    I do definitely see an increase in DPS from last week with the bomb buff. Though I do know the fights a little bit better. But My gear hasn't really changed either. My other mages in my guild are way behind me, I have a couple ilvl pieces higher I believe, I've been trying to feed all pieces into them. And both of my raid pieces have come from my extra rolls luckily. I personally don't think its a large enough of a buff to bring the mage class up a bit more competitively with the other classes yet. Maybe a tweak from our lvl 90 talents.

    Jin'rohk - R#53 - Don't judge, wasn't really payin attention.
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    Logs didn't post for some reason. Recount had me at approx 117,868 DPS @ #3 in total damage done. I did dot both heads for more FFB procs. Nether Tempest/Ice Lance/Frost Bolt were all about 1% of each other and Frostfire Bolt was about 4% under.
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  19. #179
    We are a 100 percent pure Damage spec and bring nothing to the raid outside of Damage. Last week, all 3 of our specs were the lowest DPS specs in the entire game out of every spec from every class.

    How does this make sense?

    Elemental Shamans can melee, cast or heal. You have options, variety, and are middle of the pack in damage, where Hybrids should be. Allowing a skilled player to top the charts.

    Mages, don't have variety. We have three classes that all stand at range, that all requiring standing still outside of procs and scorch, and two of the classes play almost the same. They were nerfed so bad, everything, including Beast Master hunters were higher DPS than all three of our specs.

    So if a Mage can't do damage. Why bring a Mage to a raid?

    It's also not like Mages never had specs that sucked. Frost has pretty much been the worst PVE raiding spec from the end of Vanilla up until RIGHT NOW. Now, our two other specs were nerfed so badly, they are at the bottom, where Frost has been for over a half a decade.

    Imagine Shaman were the lowest DPS melee class, lowest DPS casting class and the worst healing class in the game, then offered nothing unique to bring to the raid.

    Welcome to a mage right now.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-13 at 06:17 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by goulet goulet View Post
    So with the buff your ranked ~ 450 for 10man on a fight that wouldnt have the top guys touching anymore due to starting heroics today. with 2 483 items, does that mean the rest are heroic items?

    The buff is a bandaid and an extremely average one at that.

    I personally just quit the raid team, not that they want/need as many mages as we have in raid atm. TBH I haven't had fun on mage in mop since 5.1 hit and even then invoc was a pain in 5.0. Arcane severely burnt me out with the no movement and bullet in brain rotation. Now with no spec being crash hot im gonna have my cry and move on.

    GL with the mage guys hopefully they will address the problems before mop ends, if they do I'll come back.
    The notion that the best mages are all in guilds doing Heroic right now is mostly true, but not completely. I know Mages that have left top 10 guilds and now raid casually. They are not worse, and in fact many are superior to the Mages that replaced them. They just don't have time to grind out heroics every night of the week, and want a more casual raid pace. Last expansion and WOTLK most of the highest DPS mages on all the fights were from no-name guilds.

    Even today, most of the people topping WOL are being handed situations to do so.
    Last edited by Titan; 2013-03-13 at 06:18 AM.

  20. #180
    Is this a step in the right direction? Yes.
    Does this suddenly make mages perfect? No.

    /thread?

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