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  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by Ailerist View Post
    Actually, Raidbots has Destro over Affliction for heroic content now. If you play destro right, it will smash affliction and demonology through and through. Lock in my guild plays affliction and I smash him by a few million at least every fight. There is no fight in ToT where affliction will out due destro. Demonology was on par, but with nerf its not worth it now.


    This is just not correct.
    You are backing up your statement with personal experiences and raidbots. The problem here is, that raidbots' data are from raiders that are at T14H gear level or slightly above. And your personal experiences.. well.. don't get me wrong, but they don't really count.

    Simc clearly says, that Affliction is going to outperform the other 2 specs once you get closer to your BiS gear (I'm pretty sure the 30% haste legendary meta will be a significant milestone on that path).
    And this is only single target dps. Affliction is already outperforming destruction in some multi target fights.
    Last edited by spookyy; 2013-03-24 at 03:07 PM.

  2. #282
    idd spookyy, there is no point in basing a statement based on personal experience, atleast when you consider that sims tend to be made in BiS and NOONE has that yet, so there is no point in doing so atm. once every1 gets BiS gear, then you can start to make the proper assesments as sims are just that, sims, and in game data will trumph that but not until you see ppl in that BiS gear which will take a while as we're still in the beginning of the tier.

  3. #283
    Why the F do people say that spec A or class A is fine as long as they are BiS?

    Majority of the raiders will never get BiS heroic gear and at best only a large portion of raiders will obtain BiS normal mode gear (also highly unlikely).

  4. #284
    Its amazing how many people are clinging to Affliction being the top spec and bash anyone who questions it. More sad than amazing, actually.

  5. #285
    High Overlord woly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Its amazing how many people are clinging to Affliction being the top spec and bash anyone who questions it. More sad than amazing, actually.
    People seem to be so used to Aff being the top spec so it shocks them to see that other specs just may be on par with almighty Affliction.

  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Its amazing how many people are clinging to Affliction being the top spec and bash anyone who questions it. More sad than amazing, actually.
    I don't know if you were referring to me with this statement. I didn't "bash" anyone's argument, I simply criticized his arguments since they were based on personal experiences and feelings.
    What I did is quoting simcraft and mathematic facts.

    Anyways.. I don't know about the other locks, but I don't keep clinging to affli, I'd have no problem whatsoever switching to destro, but as long as there's no clear proof for a significant supremacy of destro over affli that makes destro the best spec for ALL fights and not just a few (which would result in respeccing/reforging every now and then) I prefer affliction.

  7. #287
    Quote Originally Posted by spookyy View Post
    I don't know if you were referring to me with this statement.

    Was just a general statement about the attitude of these forums for the last few months.

  8. #288
    People got used to Affliction being "the spec" and GoSac being "the talent" and got all gemmed and reforged for it and played it religiously for all of T14. Now numbers aren't as clear, sims show Destro slightly ahead in T14H but Aff ahead in T15H with Demo floating downward meanwhile. Some say "Aff is fine, keep playing it," but this actually seems to make make most of those T14 Aff players more uncomfortable, as they're unsure if by sticking with Aff they're missing out on playing "the best spec," which might be Destro.

    When you have a situation like T14 where one spec (and talent, for that matter (GoSac)) is by far better than the others, you see people clamoring for balance, especially those who prefer the other two specs. When you have a situation like T15 where things are more balanced, you see the other half speak up in outrage, as there is no longer a "correct" choice. It's especially frustrating when the previous winner is so unclear in its potential.

    I was uncomfortable and considered sticking with Aff for the first week after the hotfix nerfs but decided Destro would be a good change of pace anyways. And those big Chaos Bolt numbers never get old.

  9. #289
    Quote Originally Posted by spookyy View Post
    This is just not correct.
    You are backing up your statement with personal experiences and raidbots. The problem here is, that raidbots' data are from raiders that are at T14H gear level or slightly above. And your personal experiences.. well.. don't get me wrong, but they don't really count.

    Simc clearly says, that Affliction is going to outperform the other 2 specs once you get closer to your BiS gear (I'm pretty sure the 30% haste legendary meta will be a significant milestone on that path).
    And this is only single target dps. Affliction is already outperforming destruction in some multi target fights.
    Raidbots is showing live data from last 2 weeks, yes destro is marginally ahead http://www.raidbots.com/dpsbot

    Simulation craft is a great tool, but it does not compare to live data. Most fights where there is a significant amount of aoe and the targets are within 10 yards Destro rains supreme. Even still with the hit to corruption, affliction will barely be = destro or a little bit ahead on council. Rest of ToT is destro.

    Keep in mind, Simc is a simulator and in noway is it the finite and absolute compared to live data. Perhaps you might have been referring to affliction being top spec pre corruption nerf, but it will certiantly not come close to destro, not now. Seems like the rest of the community raiding 25H is going destro/demo. Keep in mind, SimC also suggests observer as highest dps pet for your GoSup......
    Last edited by Ailerist; 2013-03-25 at 10:21 AM.

  10. #290
    U can't play one spec anymore if you want stay competitive in DPS. And if you do switch specs per boss you should do extremely well. And seriously i would ignore patchwerk simulations for this tier since there aren't many patchwerk fights. Also Demonology gets big dps boost with Unerring vision of Lei-Shen trinket, for example Council heroics im pretty sure no other class/spec can beat demo with unerring vision. Im also destroying everyone in our megaera HC attempts with Demo. I'm pretty sure i would have destroyed everyone in tortos also if i was allowed to do as much as AoE as i would have liked and didn't have to play affliction for slow.

    Cant wait for next week to try demo in Jin'rohk and Horridon.

  11. #291
    Tortos U can keep RoF entire fight FnB snare turtle drop RoF on bats and chaos bolt ur heart out. Played right, not seeing how either spec with its current nerfs are going to pull over Destro played right.

  12. #292
    Quote Originally Posted by Ailerist View Post
    Tortos U can keep RoF entire fight FnB snare turtle drop RoF on bats and chaos bolt ur heart out. Played right, not seeing how either spec with its current nerfs are going to pull over Destro played right.
    What's missing from this conversation, with the exception of esatikkane's comment above, is that fight mechanics greatly change the power of one spec against another, and the fights this tier are nothing resembling an exception. Destruction is ahead (for most people) on patchwerk or if you've got free reign to rain (hah, hah?) but only care about EITHER 1 specific final target OR sustained AoE (Horridon-ish, Consorts). For a few distant targets with similar priority (Council before Demo has Unerring vision) affliction should be on top. For a mix of sustained and burst AoE, or a short phase of massively increased enemy damage taken, Demo takes the lead with ease - usually but not always for total DPS, as well as getting the target you need dead, dead.

    For me, since I just play abhorrently as destruction compared to the other two specs, I've stayed aff/demo and I'm having no issues trumping just about everyone else and matching the damage from rankings for destro players. What's actually IMPORTANT in a fight has played a bigger role in my picking specs between fights than anything else; I didn't get enough wipes at Consorts to think about the possible advantage of demo, but getting SB:SS on the second boss was a nice mini-boost, but I can't imagine for a moment trying to AoE the lightning balls on Lei Shen as affliction rather than Demo (first few pulls, I had my damage around a 87/10/3 split, rather than 66/30/4 as Demo).

    If you're min-maxing, even post-nerf, it's all about fight mechanics.

    Edit: as for Tortos, not sure what has the most total damage potential, but as always, the best spec will vary with what your group has you focused on. Glyphed SB:CoEx is invaluable for me.

  13. #293
    High Overlord pvw1075's Avatar
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    I was a huge affliction fanboy... honestly I tried Destruction for the green fire..and whoa..I like it.

  14. #294
    With this discussion long past the point where it was relevant, or on topic very much AND with the new patch and new nerfs coming in I feel it's best to close this thread now. Feel free to discuss about the relative power of specs in their respective stickies, or discussing any 5.3 changes (nerfs) and such in the new 5.3 thread.

    Closed.
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