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  1. #41
    Herald of the Titans Nadev's Avatar
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    Let people know when they're goofing. If they get mouthy, let the raid leader know.
    Men!

    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    I picked Biden because he may throw Obama into the Death Star's reactor core, restoring balance to the Force.

    Now having a ball on SWTOR!

  2. #42
    Are you part of the RLs 10 man team OPer?

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirque View Post
    Dear OP,

    There's a few issues with your post.

    First of all, you're only looking at others. In your post, you're blaming GM, and dps/healers who die of bats (that are being kited, in which case the kiter isn't doing a good job or someone (i'm looking at you hunters) has decided to root them). Are you sure it's rockfall direct hit killing them or is it unavoidable aoe, in which case the problem will lie elsewhere. And how's your raid cd usage, are you actively contributing to getting those sorted and using your personals? Are turtles being consistently slowed, also by you, if you are capable of it? Are they dying fast enough, have you looked up guides or vids or information that could help your guild or are you just joining and expecting the raid to fix itself and the boss to die on its own?

    Secondly - That's the thing, I get the impression you're not really putting all that effort in it yourself. You see, when I hear players blame others, the first thing I will notice when I play with him/her is how much he's lacking him/herself in so many areas. In short, if you like your guild, I do believe you should take your own advice as well and have a hard look at you and your own performance, and what you can do better both in play as well as in preparation/contribution.

    If however you don't like your guild and you believe you're better off elsewhere, then by all means. At the end that choice is totally personal and none of us can help you with that. I'd personally not call your guild noobish, I have many friends who haven't even touched ToT yet because just having jin'rokh look at them will wipe them. That's totally fine, they are having a great time in their guild and progress as they like. Maybe there's inexperience, or slow learning. What do I know. The decision is up to you, but don't be too quick on pointing fingers. You're after all part of the wipegroup, too.
    I agree with this, leaving a guild can never really be attributed to the fault of one person (unless there is an extreme case with harassment or such).

    I mean I am in sort of the same situation, except there is a lot more contributing to thoughts of me leaving. While we do go down to 10 mans, and I am in that group, on the nights we cant fuel a 25 (or on off nights) there still is no progression. Stuck on Horridon, with same progress in the fight as 25. A simple question by me to the main tank/GM about how he pulls inconsistently with the timer, making pre-potting or using army horrible for a pre pull, I recieved harsh reactions back and on the next pull after the countdown he yells over vent "OKAY USE A POTION NOW MAX" and then pulls. (This coming from a man whom is around 50 talking to a 20 year old).
    That along with blatant disrespect from the GM/raid leader, combined with the no progression, is why I am thinking of leaving. I love the guild I have many friends in it and I love the environment it has, I am just sick of it.

    Your situation is totally different though. You are progressing. Don't expect to go in and 1 shot everything, be happy you are downing things semi-regularly (hell its not even after second reset) a couple of nights or time spent on a boss is not a bad thing at all. If there are a few weaker dps or heals, then you need to replace them simple enough. Having a few short points does not mean jump guild. The fact you havn't gotten loot either should not contribute to it. There are 24 other people in the 25 man that need gear as well. Combine that with rng of drops, and it's natural you might not get something yet (again not even before second reset.)

    I would suggest all that Cirque said, along with really looking at what YOU can do to improve the raid. A raid can only be as strong as the members want it to be.

  4. #44
    No logs on Tortos yet but a council attempt if it helps

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/4...?s=1495&e=1810

  5. #45
    I always say this, basically play with a group of people at your level or close as possible. In every 25 man raid group there will be players at the top and bottom of the dps.
    You have to evaluate there gear compared to there performance and the same with healing. Obv dealing well with the fight mechanics while maintaining good performance is what determines the value of a player.

    If you find your picking up things faster on every encounter compared to others and being held back then try for another guild, but make sure you are as good as you think you are when you do that because you might be considered a baddie in a guild with higher standards.

  6. #46
    The Lightbringer Blitzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatspriest View Post
    Sounds more like your guild just needs to better gear those players in your raid so they can have a chance at performing better. With the patch this new as well as the raid, give it time before you contemplate leaving the guild.
    It's not always a gear issue, it's most likely a skill issue.
    “It is either easy or impossible.” - Salvador Dali

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  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by mstg View Post
    No logs on Tortos yet but a council attempt if it helps

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/4...?s=1495&e=1810
    Your raid dps looks more then fine to kill all normals in ToT, looks like tactic or healing issues u might be having.

  8. #48
    well, I don't know how hard council 25 is compared to 10, but if you got to Tortos after 3 nights, then your guild does not suck. If you have problems with the big bad toadie, then maybe you should consider switching your tactics.

    Stalagtite rocketfall does not only kill on impact, but it also damages everyone in 20y for a serious amount of damage, so use your defense cooldowns whenever a large number of stalags goes down near a player. You can try to tank the bats and have the kicker kick shells through them for debuff -> they die pretty fast then. You can have dedicated kickers who do nothing else but kick management and avoiding damage. Or, what we did on our killtry, you can shoot the shell at the spawning turtles after the 2nd /3rd wave when you already have an abundance of shells. This way the turtles will die *very* quickly, reducing damage on the raid.

    The T15 bosses so far are all about adapting individual tactics that work well for your group. Don't simply cook after the first guide you find and get creative. It'll help a lot
    Last edited by Lylandra; 2013-03-18 at 07:52 AM.

  9. #49
    3/12 after 6 nights of raiding a brand new tier... and you want to quit?

    I remember in BC when it took guilds MONTHS of practice to down 1 boss. One. single. boss. And you want to quit because you're 3/12 after a single week.

    Pardon me while I laugh.

    It's sad that impatient people like OP are the kind of player the game is now catering to. Welcome to the Xbox generation of WoW. A game run by children. You want to know why the community sucks these days? It's because the "me me me now now now" crowd has moved in.

    Have some patience, man.
    Last edited by Coldhearth; 2013-03-18 at 08:01 AM.

  10. #50
    Scarab Lord Valarius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coldhearth View Post
    3/12 after 6 nights of raiding a brand new tier... and you want to quit?

    I remember in BC when it took guilds MONTHS of practice to down 1 boss. One. single. boss. And you want to quit because you're 3/12 after a single week.
    Sorry what? I can't recall any bosses outside of the end ones in T5 or the last couple in BT and Sunwell that took *months*... even then I don't think I spent more than a few weeks with Vashj/KT/Illidan.

    6 nights of raiding can be a big deal depending on your guild. In mine it could be anything from 3 to 6 weeks since we're quite casual and raid when it suits everyone's schedules.. That's a lot of time to be wasting on the first 25% of the raid. These bosses aren't big on mechanics or gear. Tortos can be summarised in like 3 sentences. These are literally "are you afk?" checks for your raid unless you are sorely undergeared and trying to skip content.

  11. #51
    I am Murloc! Huntingbear_grimbatol's Avatar
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    What's your guilds goal? top 100? top 1000? top 2000?
    What's your goal? top 100? top 1000? top 2000?
    What are other peoples goal in the guild? top 100? top 1000? top 2000?

    The key to having a guild that's in balance is to have the core wanting the same things, my guild was world rank 150 after FL, from there we've gone up to push top 90~100. We're all happy at being at that rank, yes we can do better and it's within our reach but we won't go on a drama spree at each other if we don't get world rank 50.

    If you feel you can do better than your guild and they don't want (the core group) to do better then leave, you'll just bang your head against the wall.
    If you don't want to leave because of DKP then that's your choice, most decent guilds who clear normal usually don't need normal mode gear and thus gearing you up won't be a problem. That said if you're applying to any guild that clear normal with ease you should be of high caliber yourself.

  12. #52
    Herald of the Titans Syridian's Avatar
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    When you start the post dissing your own raid group (or one of them anyway), it sounds as though you've already made your mind up and just want us to reaffirm your decision.

  13. #53
    To me it sounds like you're in that guild for loot and progression only. If you don't enjoy being with them, and raiding with them - whats the point of doing so? Think of it like a job: You hate going everyday, because you got no social connection with any other employee, and you feel you dont get anywhere being there. What do you do then?
    Yeah you make a CV and start looking for new jobs, where you think you can progress and eventually get a better job.

    So if you dont like the guild you're in now, make a "CV" (Toss in logs and stuff) and start applying for new guilds. Though, you need to have the balls to tell your class officer/raid leader/guild leader about it when you start searching. So he/she got time to find a replacement for you, dont be the dick that leaves the guild with a "Sry, leaving cuz we aint getting nowhere" 1 hour before raid starts.

    And you others - there is nothing wrong about jumping guilds until you find a guild where you enjoy raiding, thats the most important part of this game. It's not the content that make a good tier, its how friendly and fun guild you're in and how much fun you have clearing the content. For instance my best raiding experience is from Kara, ICC and DS because thats the times I was in the best guilds with a bunch of friends, and we where stuck in Kara for like the whole expansion!

  14. #54
    checkout wol and see what the problem is. imo only gear the people that arent dying and arent moronic.. gear helps people but like its been said.. if u stand in the fire constantly.. gear wont help fix that.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    If you're asking this question your guild is better off without you
    This. For two reasons.

    1. Lack of loyalty
    2. Lack of ability to make own decisions.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Sorry what? I can't recall any bosses outside of the end ones in T5 or the last couple in BT and Sunwell that took *months*... even then I don't think I spent more than a few weeks with Vashj/KT/Illidan.
    Exactly. The bosses were hard.

    Lady Vashj - not killed for over 2 months.
    Kael'thas Sunstrider - not killed for almost 4 months.
    Archimonde - not killed for almost 2 months.
    Kil'jaeden - not killed for over 2 months.

    ... and OP cries because he can't down more than 3 bosses in 6 nights? Please spare me. Players like OP are the reason this game has been so dumbed down.

  17. #57
    High Overlord Fengorn's Avatar
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    Did he say they kite the bats??????????????????? no wonder u die lol, MD them to one of the tanks , stun them etc etc etc and nuke them down fast lol

  18. #58
    Think 25 experiment as a "worth going for" one.
    If your guild can field 25 ppl today, ofc they will have worse progress than the better 10 man, and ofc the shared lock will stall the progress of that 10 man even more but...

    You gain access to better gear when FINALLY will down the boss (7,5 times more thunderforged items instead of 2,5 times more thunderforged items in 25s, and 0,24 items instead of o,20 items per boss per person).
    That will close the gap IN TIME, in terms of progress, unless if you re a top notch guild that can clear all heroic content in 3-4 resets.

    Patience, and understanding of what people (your RL in our case) are trying to do.
    Average wow player is usually too concerned about today and about himself to see beyond that.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Sorry what? I can't recall any bosses outside of the end ones in T5 or the last couple in BT and Sunwell that took *months*... even then I don't think I spent more than a few weeks with Vashj/KT/Illidan.

    6 nights of raiding can be a big deal depending on your guild. In mine it could be anything from 3 to 6 weeks since we're quite casual and raid when it suits everyone's schedules.. That's a lot of time to be wasting on the first 25% of the raid. These bosses aren't big on mechanics or gear. Tortos can be summarised in like 3 sentences. These are literally "are you afk?" checks for your raid unless you are sorely undergeared and trying to skip content.
    Eh yea, most bosses in Sunwell took our guild weeks and weeks of wiping, same goes for Vashj. We killed Kael'thas a little faster but still took some hefty time.

  20. #60
    High Overlord Pippo89's Avatar
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    Hi OP

    You've been wiping 6 full nights on... Tortos?
    We had 7 attempts yesterday and we got him to 46%, it's no easy fight but for us it's refreshing after Council, less mechanics you know.

    We're raiding 10 man, we only managed to get 5/16hc before 5.2, but we'll get Tortos very soon.

    So if you do not know your guild very well, and if you do not like some members anyway, and if you are wiping on Tortos for 6 nights I'l look for another guild, yes.
    The roots of evil are deep. Irreversibly so in the hearts of men.

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