View Poll Results: Is this class different enough for WoW?

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  • Yes! Different than Death Knights and Warlocks.

    111 52.11%
  • No! Too similar to Death Knights and Warlocks.

    86 40.38%
  • Other Opinion (Please explain)

    16 7.51%
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  1. #21
    Only problem I have with Necromancer is that the class is kinda like a gimped version of DK in lore. Necromancers in WC lore use basically the same spells as DK but they are not as strong in physical combat. DK could be seen as strongest amongst their kind. I think Blizzard realized this too when they had an idea of necromancer but they incorporated it into DK. For people who don't know, the ideas of Necromancer were considered by Blizzard to make it as a class but Blizz decided to incorporated it into DK. I am not against any suggestion for fun but I believe that Necromancer is one of the classes that would never happen in WoW along with some classes like Shadow Hunter Blademaster and some more.
    Last edited by Wildmoon; 2013-03-20 at 11:28 PM.

  2. #22
    Bloodsail Admiral DonQShot's Avatar
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    I liked the healer spec. It seems like a cool way of healing by unorthodox means =). You did a good job here( as is becoming usual but tbh this has more to do with DK/locks than my necromancer. your healing spec uses blood to heal just like the dk tank, the undeath spec is alright but it feels too much like a demo lock. ie: ur summon abomination is just a mix of a locks summon infernal with a dk's dark transformation's abomination. and ur bone and poison spec is basically a diablo's ripoff which is kinda meh but I would still play it if there was nothing better around ^^

  3. #23
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DonQShot View Post
    I liked the healer spec. It seems like a cool way of healing by unorthodox means =). You did a good job here( as is becoming usual but tbh this has more to do with DK/locks than my necromancer. your healing spec uses blood to heal just like the dk tank, the undeath spec is alright but it feels too much like a demo lock. ie: ur summon abomination is just a mix of a locks summon infernal with a dk's dark transformation's abomination. and ur bone and poison spec is basically a diablo's ripoff which is kinda meh but I would still play it if there was nothing better around ^^
    Actually the healing spec only uses blood to heal in some of its abilities. The majority of the healing comes from Life Link, Soul Infusion, and Poison Release. The other heals (including the blood-based ones) are there to keep the Necromancer alive while it is Life Linking with allies.

    I disagree that the Undeath spec feels too much like Demonology. Demonology Warlocks spend their time juggling their Demon form. The Undeath spec on the other hand is far more dependent on its summoned minions, not on maintaining a resource. An Undeath Necro would send wave after wave of Skeleton Warriors and Mages at the target, while abusing Cryptwalker and Meat Wagon to maintain its distance and keep itself alive.

    Also Demonology locks cant turn into Felguards or Shiveeras.

    As for "ripping off" The bone and poison tree from Diablo 2's Necromancer, guilty as charged. It wouldn't be the first time Blizzard used a Diablo class to inspire a Warcraft class.

  4. #24
    The only question I have is how available will corpses be? How many corpses will be summoned with Call of the Grave. I am just curious how that resource will work.

  5. #25
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bendita View Post
    The only question I have is how available will corpses be? How many corpses will be summoned with Call of the Grave. I am just curious how that resource will work.
    CotG should provide the Necromancer with 6-8 corpses at max duration. CotG should have a relatively short cooldown, between 1 to 2 minutes.

    Meat Wagon allows Undeath Necros to store up to 20 corpses to take with them and unload at any time. I'm considering making that a class-wide ability.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    CotG should provide the Necromancer with 6-8 corpses at max duration. CotG should have a relatively short cooldown, between 1 to 2 minutes.

    Meat Wagon allows Undeath Necros to store up to 20 corpses to take with them and unload at any time. I'm considering making that a class-wide ability.
    I can see from your edit to the first post that you are making it class-wide. Would it be easy to refill, during let's say wipes in a raid or dungeon setting? Is there a restriction on what kinds of corpses you can use? I hope there is a real meat wagon that follows the Necromancer around. :P

  7. #27
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bendita View Post
    I can see from your edit to the first post that you are making it class-wide. Would it be easy to refill, during let's say wipes in a raid or dungeon setting? Is there a restriction on what kinds of corpses you can use? I hope there is a real meat wagon that follows the Necromancer around. :P
    It should be pretty easy to refill, taking a few seconds more or less. Also there shouldn't be a restriction on corpses, allowing you to harvest player corpses in PvP for example shouldn't be an issue. However, you shouldn't be able to harvest critter corpses.

    I'm all for having a meat wagon follow you around. See the updated OP.

  8. #28
    The basic premise of a Necromancer is too similar to death knights to go through. A death knight is just necromancer equivalent of a spellsword-type class, especially so for unholy.

    With that said, I could see a new class having a necromancy specialization anyway, if it were fitting.

  9. #29
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eats Compost View Post
    The basic premise of a Necromancer is too similar to death knights to go through. A death knight is just necromancer equivalent of a spellsword-type class, especially so for unholy.
    I completely disagree. Death Knights are melee. Necromancers are Spellcasters. Death Knights only use unholy magic in one of their specs. Necromancers use unholy magic throughout the entire class. Death Knights summon one or two minions total. Necromancers can summon multiple minions at one time.

    In the case of my class idea, DKs and Necromancers are very different from each other.

  10. #30
    Warchief Zeror's Avatar
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    Cool idea. Thumbs up!

    The only thing i'm concerned at is the meatwagon. I think, cause it follows you like a pet, looks dumb. But I do think a visual object is needed for this.

    What about this: Instead of a meatwagon. The necromancer has circling bones around him. Max 5 bones can circle around the necromancer. With using only 5 bones max the necromancer needs to make much more tactical decisions of which ability he wants to use. Necromancer gets +1 bone when they kill an enemy.

  11. #31
    cool idea guy

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    I completely disagree. Death Knights are melee. Necromancers are Spellcasters. Death Knights only use unholy magic in one of their specs. Necromancers use unholy magic throughout the entire class. Death Knights summon one or two minions total. Necromancers can summon multiple minions at one time.

    In the case of my class idea, DKs and Necromancers are very different from each other.
    I think the reason DKs aren't able to use many minion in WoW is because of gameplay reason. In lore they can summon an army of undead you know. I explained about the similarity between DK and Necro in my previous post.
    Last edited by Wildmoon; 2013-03-21 at 12:31 PM.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    In any class thread where lore may be an issue for class implementation, I just say that Blizzard's desire to make money trumps any lore concerns. Like Demon Hunters, Necromancers are a highly requested and desired class by players.
    I would have to say that I disagree with this assertion. Considering that they've had a greater focus on lore than ever before, they aren't going to implement something that clashes with that lore.

    Going off of that, I'd say that at least in terms of armor... I understand why you chose it, but Warcraft necromancers wear cloth robes. I think it'd take a good amount of justification to go against that.

    On another note... an "undeath" necromancer? If I might make a suggestion, perhaps rename that spec to Corpseology. As well, I think that it would be best for that spec to just keep with undead creations rather than powerful entities like liches and crypt lords... Those guys aren't really minions. They're powerful creatures in their own right.

    As well, would corpses be mostly a cooldown thing or a frequent use, because I don't think that if they're supposed to be used often it will be a viable mechanic during a good number of raid bosses. There's also the fact that you'd have to gather corpses. They got rid of Soul Shards for a reason... I dunno if a mechanic like that would float in the game as it is being developed now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superman-BladesEdge View Post
    http://www.wowwiki.com/Class_ideas
    http://www.wowwiki.com/Hero_class

    If people want their ideas seen, they should put them here. Or, to check popularity of which classes have already been mentioned to Blizz.
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  14. #34
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildmoon View Post
    I think the reason DKs aren't able to use many minion in WoW is because of gameplay reason. In lore they can summon an army of undead you know. I explained about the similarity between DK and Necro in my previous post.
    My main point is that there are some significant differences between DKs and Necromancers as presented in this thread and in general. In short, Necros are to DKs what Priest are to Paladins.

  15. #35
    The restriction that you need corpses to use your abilities is a big one. Reminds me of Vanilla warlocks having to go soul shard farming before raids. The meat wagon as described does nothing to alleviate this, being essentially just a pet acting as a shard bag, and a puny one at that. But this is worse than the old soul shard system, because basic damage abilities run off it. So instead of farming shards before each raid, on a boss with few or no adds you'd be farming them before every pull. That's kind of a lot to swallow.

    The necro needs to be able to just create corpses somehow for it to work like this. Summon them up, drain life from enemies and make constructs out of it, whatever. Other than that, I like it.

  16. #36
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Madgod View Post
    I would have to say that I disagree with this assertion. Considering that they've had a greater focus on lore than ever before, they aren't going to implement something that clashes with that lore.
    Well that depends on the direction they're taking the game. I've seen Blizzard smash up lore quite a bit in order to sell a game.

    Going off of that, I'd say that at least in terms of armor... I understand why you chose it, but Warcraft necromancers wear cloth robes. I think it'd take a good amount of justification to go against that.
    My belief is that Necromancers would use bone in their armor, which would work as a type of mail. Also Monks tend to wear cloth robes as well, but Blizzard made them wear leather armor. Also Shaman really should be wearing mail armor either.

    On another note... an "undeath" necromancer? If I might make a suggestion, perhaps rename that spec to Corpseology. As well, I think that it would be best for that spec to just keep with undead creations rather than powerful entities like liches and crypt lords... Those guys aren't really minions. They're powerful creatures in their own right.

    As well, would corpses be mostly a cooldown thing or a frequent use, because I don't think that if they're supposed to be used often it will be a viable mechanic during a good number of raid bosses. There's also the fact that you'd have to gather corpses. They got rid of Soul Shards for a reason... I dunno if a mechanic like that would float in the game as it is being developed now.
    Yeah, I'm also not too keen on the "Undeath" name. I'll try to find something that works with it. I also agree with you about Crypt Lords and Lichs, so I updated the Undeath tree to make it more reasonable.

    As for corpses, I wanted them to be a resource, and I gave the Necromancer quite a few ways to get around situations where there's no corpses available. One of the things I dislike about the new Affliction, and many classes in general is that everything is just too easy and streamlined. Having to purchase arrows, having Totems in your bags, and having to farm Soul Shards really helped with immersion, and I wanted to bring that back with Necromancers. Also Necromancers have methods outside of minions to deal significant damage.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2013-03-21 at 08:24 PM.

  17. #37
    Keyboard Turner Soupiertiger's Avatar
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    I don't really think it sounds that much like DKs or Warlocks. Obviously, there are things that are similar, but there are things that are similar between other classes, so that's not a huge deal. The idea that you have for the healing spec makes it feel unique in my opinion. This would be a very fun class to play.

  18. #38
    I would see the Reaper spec having fists wep. Fighting with their nails would be awesome!
    I really like the idea, and I can't see that much inflicting on DKs and warlocks actually, it's a good idea and a really nice spec. (I would play it, but not reroll from my wounderful Warlock tho, sry

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    My belief is that Necromancers would use bone in their armor, which would work as a type of mail. Also Monks tend to wear cloth robes as well, but Blizzard made them wear leather armor. Also Shaman really should be wearing mail armor either.
    The biggest difference between the two though is that a monk's armor would probably incorporate leather... no real depiction of necromancers in WoW have more bone than a ram's skull on their crown. Plus, there's no agi cloth, so agi leather's the closest to that. There's already int cloth. Not the biggest point against your idea, but it might have been what they were thinking. Also bones aren't very mail-like... they're not like any kind of armor, actually. Hard to categorize.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    As for corpses, I wanted them to be a resource, and I gave the Necromancer quite a few ways to get around situations where there's no corpses available. One of the things I dislike about the new Affliction, and many classes in general is that everything is just too easy and streamlined. Having to purchase arrows, having Totems in your bags, and having to farm Soul Shards really helped with immersion, and I wanted to bring that back with Necromancers. Also Necromancers have methods outside of minions to deal significant damage.
    I can understand where you're coming from.
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  20. #40
    Immortal Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soupiertiger View Post
    I don't really think it sounds that much like DKs or Warlocks. Obviously, there are things that are similar, but there are things that are similar between other classes, so that's not a huge deal. The idea that you have for the healing spec makes it feel unique in my opinion. This would be a very fun class to play.
    Thanks for the kind words. Unfortunately, the people who said that it is too similar to DKs and Locks haven't really commented. I'm glad that you think think the healing spec is unique. It was tough to come up with.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-21 at 10:52 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingpinwlock View Post
    I would see the Reaper spec having fists wep. Fighting with their nails would be awesome!
    I really like the idea, and I can't see that much inflicting on DKs and warlocks actually, it's a good idea and a really nice spec. (I would play it, but not reroll from my wounderful Warlock tho, sry
    Yeah, my original concept was to have Reaper be a Melee spec, but I just felt that casting was the way to go. The pic I found for the Reaper spec reinforced that.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-21 at 10:57 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by The Madgod View Post
    The biggest difference between the two though is that a monk's armor would probably incorporate leather... no real depiction of necromancers in WoW have more bone than a ram's skull on their crown. Plus, there's no agi cloth, so agi leather's the closest to that. There's already int cloth. Not the biggest point against your idea, but it might have been what they were thinking. Also bones aren't very mail-like... they're not like any kind of armor, actually. Hard to categorize.
    Yeah fair point. I guess we'll find out whenever the next class is announced. Ironically, I was able to get around the mail issue with Demon Hunters, but it has proven more difficult with Necrmancers.


    I can understand where you're coming from.
    Thanks man. I really hate the dumbing down of WoWs classes.

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