Why the US is in so much Debt.

[Spectral]

America's debt isnt that terrible once you realize that it includes the debt of the people that live here and that debt includes debt for houses/cars

Our situation looks much worse when I think about people with this depth of knowledge participating in elections.

[mvaliz]

Our situation looks much worse when I think about people with this depth of knowledge participating in elections.

Wow... you're not kidding. =/

To Tierbook - the National Debt is government tax-funded accrued debt only. The National Debt does not include civilian debts like Credit Cards, Mortgages, bank loans, car loans, ect...

[Wells]

To Tierbook - the National Debt is government tax-funded accrued debt only. The National Debt does not include civilian debts like Credit Cards, Mortgages, bank loans, car loans, ect...

which is still a huge problem in all fairness.

[mvaliz]

I saw an expert today who was asked why Cyprus couldn't happen to America and they said because we can borrow more or print more money.

Gawd.

Define "Expert"...

...because the "Experts" lauded on News Media sites are not "Experts"... they can pull any kid out of college working on a Consumer Education bachelor degree and he would qualify as an "Expert" - so long as that "expert" gives them the controversial angle they want.

---------- Post added 2013-03-25 at 03:36 AM ----------

which is still a huge problem in all fairness.

Ummmmm.... yeah? I wasn't saying it wasn't... it's a damn big problem obviously. o_O

[Spectral]

which is still a huge problem in all fairness.

Right, there's been some substantial private deleveraging, but private debt is still a pretty big problem that the moment. I'm not a "grab your gold and bury it in the hills!" person, but I'm not totally sure that everything's hunky dory. I wouldn't be shocked by another very large recession in the relatively near future driven by another Minsky moment.

[mvaliz]

Are there any estimates of how much larger the National Debt would be if it included the civilian debts?

Curious <<

Don't give FOX news any ideas!!! They'll probably do exactly that and call it the "TOTAL National Debt!"

[Spectral]

Don't give FOX news any ideas!!! They'll probably do exactly that and call it the "TOTAL National Debt!"

That's a real number, and it's not irrelevant. The last time I'd checked, it was something in the ballpark of 300% of GDP, counting public and private debt, but that might not be quite right.

[Wells]

Hah, indeed.

But seriously, I am curious.

And what kind of things could be done to reduce private debt?

improved jobs and wages.

[Machomaije]

because they run on war. And they steal other coutries resourses, like oil. They invade places where its resourses the can benefit from. Much suspicious USA have to "save their freedom" the one and only place they grow opium, which America can benefit from ALOT. It costs to run on war, and after a while resourses will drain, which basicly means there is no more money to steal.

[Banawani]

The wars have total real costs in the $4 trillion vicinity. The gigantic recession cost something in the vicinity of another $3 trillion to lost revenue and bailouts. Take those away, and our debt would be at entirely sustainable levels.

There's no need for lengthy explanations to this to have a basic understanding.

I don't understand how the answer is so clear, yet people decide that the bailouts were bad.

The government didn't just give out money first off. They essentially bought shares from companies; enough that the companies could use that money to get back on their feet. In the long run that would make the US money, but would take some time to do so. The US is already even in returns from the bailouts.

Also, if the US didn't bailout companies, the collapse would have been significantly worse. It wouldn't have stopped at those large banks and companies, people would have absolutely no money to spend (instead of just a small amount) and we would have seen a worse economy than the great depression.

Bailout 101.

because they run on war. And they steal other coutries resourses, like oil. They invade places where its resourses the can benefit from. Much suspicious USA have to "save their freedom" the one and only place they grow opium, which America can benefit from ALOT. It costs to run on war, and after a while resourses will drain, which basicly means there is no more money to steal.

You must have been bad at History. The Romans conquered much of the known world and prospered because of that, just like the Egyptians, Spartans/Athenians, Chinese, Japanese, etc. We don't live in a Utopia, everyone doesn't like everyone. The US will continue to take resources from those who can't defend themselves and the US isn't for doing so. Norway has done the same thing, albeit when they did have a Military that would allow them to do so.

[obdigore]

improved jobs and wages.

INFLATION!

QUANTITATIVE EASING!

HOUSING BUBBLE!

GOLD STANDARD!

Clearly the solution is to bust unions, remove any kind of regulation protecting the citizens of the US, and then get rid of minimum wage. That should bring us back to the time of the Robber Barons when people died on the streets. That was clearly the most glorious time in US' history.

[Linkedblade]

The free market works. China is one of the fastest growing economic powers in the world and they have almost no regulations. Compare/contrast to our situation where we continue to have and more regulation for both companies and fiscal policy and our economy is going down the shitter.

Why is the US in debt? Because the government has no idea how to properly manage money at all. The government has no reason to spend or have that money either. The constitution only says that the federal government is responsible for compensating congress for wages lost and paying for war expenses during time of war. And we arent at war (congress never declared).

Problem is we have dumbasses in congress. Dumbass voters. And terrible media. All that combined leads misinformed voters, duped into thinking that Obama is some grand person. Meanwhile the wealth of the middle class is being redistributed to the rich, the middle class is shrinking, and our civil liberties are being stripped away.

[mvaliz]

Hah, indeed.

But seriously, I am curious.

And what kind of things could be done to reduce private debt?

Honestly? IMO trying to educate people on the concept of saying to yourself either "I have enough" or "I have MORE than enough!"

You seriously don't need an Humvee and a 3 floor starter castle with pool, regardless if you can afford it or not. If you can afford it that's fine... but then teach them that you're tied to your job and are now FORCED to maintain a certain minimum of income JUST to support all that crap, and if ANYTHING happens to that job/career/industry - you're SOL.

Oh, and seriously teach people that having children can be EXPENSIVE!!! Teach them to NOT have kids until they're financially out of any debt...

We need to teach people to FIRST pay off a home (even a small one/condo for your first), Car and any credit card/educational loans. Only AFTER that should you consider any major investing... if you pay all those things off, then you can work at a gas station and not worry about going homeless or hungry.

[Wells]

The free market works. China is one of the fastest growing economic powers in the world and they have almost no regulations.

They don't have anything even close to a free market.

And given how you can see the smog in Beijing from space on a bad day I don't know what I'd call it "working".

[Banawani]

The free market works. China is one of the fastest growing economic powers in the world and they have almost no regulations. Compare/contrast to our situation where we continue to have and more regulation for both companies and fiscal policy and our economy is going down the shitter.

Why is the US in debt? Because the government has no idea how to properly manage money at all. The government has no reason to spend or have that money either. The constitution only says that the federal government is responsible for compensating congress for wages lost and paying for war expenses during time of war. And we arent at war (congress never declared).

Problem is we have dumbasses in congress. Dumbass voters. And terrible media. All that combined leads misinformed voters, duped into thinking that Obama is some grand person. Meanwhile the wealth of the middle class is being redistributed to the rich, the middle class is shrinking, and our civil liberties are being stripped away.

Actually, you are quite wrong.

It is estimated that 50% of China's wealth will leave the country in the next year. They are well on track for that number, probably even more.

Free market =/= Unregulated,

As Wells said, the Chinese aren't too welcoming of the smog. So they may have quick growth, but at the cost of keeping it for a very limited period.

[obdigore]

They don't have anything even close to a free market.

And given how you can see the smog in Beijing from space on a bad day I don't know what I'd call it "working".

Facts don't matter to a majority of Libertarians, I thought you knew this?

[mvaliz]

The free market works. China is one of the fastest growing economic powers in the world and they have almost no regulations.

...that is because their entire work force is built on the back of slaves, slaves that American Businesses are sending our jobs too. That's thanks to China having little regulations - they don't have pesky things like "People's health and well being and general morality" to think about. That costs money!

[Wells]

Facts don't matter to a majority of Libertarians, I thought you knew this?

In fairness to libertarians, I think a lot of people right now are wrapping themselves in the libertarian flag without really understanding their ideology because they're feeling disaffected.

[Deathpath]

First off bush started the wars then that got us in the shitter initially but then obamma kept barrowing and barrowing money that we dont have and that sealed mine, my future children, and grand children's fate. And the debt keeps going up every day. thats it in a nutshell.

[obdigore]

In fairness to libertarians, I think a lot of people right now are wrapping themselves in the libertarian flag without really understanding their ideology because they're feeling disaffected.

I don't feel like being 'fair' to people who see the age of the robber barons as the height of what the country could and should be.