1. #1
    Moderator Alarinth's Avatar
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    Requesting in-depth explanation for destro GoSacs Stat priorities

    Hi.

    Disclaimer: I've read the destruction guide, and I know it's mastery>crit as destro gosac. That is not what I'm asking for.

    This is not a post where I ask about information I could've found in the sticky destruction guide, this is a request for the mathemathics and exact reasoning behind why mastery becomes so good with GoSac. Is it because of the 15% increase that mastery becomes 15% better, is it just so simple as that? Or is there a more complicated reason?
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  2. #2
    When you sacrifice your pet, you discard the one aspect of your damage which is not affected by mastery. In a GoSup build, mastery is very slightly behind haste and crit, as your pet gains zero benefit from mastery at all, getting rid of that weakness allows 100% of your damage (excluding Doomguard) to be affected by mastery either in full (chaos bolts, fire and brimstone) or partially (immolate, conflag, incinerate, fel flame).

    But yes, your analysis is also an accurate depiction as well, as your single target spells are increased by GoSac, it essentially makes mastery 15% stronger when affecting Chaos Bolts and single target Incinerates, Conflagrates, and Fel Flames. Increasing the benefit of mastery by 15% easily pushes it above the other two stats, as it isn't terribly far behind to begin with. Also since one of the large aspects of mastery is increasing Chaos Bolt's damage, even when cleaving with Havoc with the 15% increase from GoSac (which also affects Havoc'd Chaos Bolts), Mastery/GoSac becomes even stronger, as long as there are 2 or more targets which you can Havoc (as it allows your Grimoire bonus to apply to multiple targets simultaneously, something a pet can never do)

    TL;DR
    GoSac and Mastery both increase the damage of the same spells, they have a lot of synergy.
    Last edited by Delia; 2013-03-22 at 04:05 PM.
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  3. #3
    Field Marshal Leyl's Avatar
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    This thread can and should be moved to the guide. The question could have been asked there.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Delia View Post
    it essentially makes mastery 15% stronger when effecting Chaos Bolts and single target Immolates, Incinerates, Conflagrates, and Fel Flames.
    Good post, but GoSac doesn't affect Immolates.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by darlissa View Post
    Good post, but GoSac doesn't affect Immolates.
    Fair enough, I'm at work and was too lazy to go check tooltips, original post edited accordingly.... also corrected my incorrect used of effect vs affect...
    Last edited by Delia; 2013-03-22 at 04:06 PM.
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  6. #6
    For pvp my stat priority is this: Master > haste (10%) > crit with gosac as destro

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Delia View Post
    When you sacrifice your pet, you discard the one aspect of your damage which is not affected by mastery. In a GoSup build, mastery is very slightly behind haste and crit, as your pet gains zero benefit from mastery at all, getting rid of that weakness allows 100% of your damage (excluding Doomguard) to be affected by mastery either in full (chaos bolts, fire and brimstone) or partially (immolate, conflag, incinerate, fel flame).

    But yes, your analysis is also an accurate depiction as well, as your single target spells are increased by GoSac, it essentially makes mastery 15% stronger when affecting Chaos Bolts and single target Incinerates, Conflagrates, and Fel Flames. Increasing the benefit of mastery by 15% easily pushes it above the other two stats, as it isn't terribly far behind to begin with. Also since one of the large aspects of mastery is increasing Chaos Bolt's damage, even when cleaving with Havoc with the 15% increase from GoSac (which also affects Havoc'd Chaos Bolts), Mastery/GoSac becomes even stronger, as long as there are 2 or more targets which you can Havoc (as it allows your Grimoire bonus to apply to multiple targets simultaneously, something a pet can never do)

    TL;DR
    GoSac and Mastery both increase the damage of the same spells, they have a lot of synergy.
    You have a few inaccuracies in your post here that I want to correct:

    1. GoSac doesn't benefit Fire and Brimstone, or Immolate
    2. Technically GoSac doesn't increase the benefit of Mastery by 15%. That's assuming a rather simplistic view of how stats interact with each other.
    3. GoSac is balanced around 2 target cleave, and is ONLY roughly even with GoSup/Serv on 2 target cleave. On single target GoSac is significantly behind.


    ---------- Post added 2013-03-22 at 01:57 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Alarinth View Post
    Hi.

    Disclaimer: I've read the destruction guide, and I know it's mastery>crit as destro gosac. That is not what I'm asking for.

    This is not a post where I ask about information I could've found in the sticky destruction guide, this is a request for the mathemathics and exact reasoning behind why mastery becomes so good with GoSac. Is it because of the 15% increase that mastery becomes 15% better, is it just so simple as that? Or is there a more complicated reason?
    TL;DR:

    Pets benefit from Haste/Crit and don't from Mastery.
    Using GoSac removes the pet component of damage.
    Using GoSac buffs many of your mastery-benefiting damage sources.

    Therefore Haste/Crit become slightly devalued.
    Therefore Mastery becomes more valued.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    You have a few inaccuracies in your post here that I want to correct:

    1. GoSac doesn't benefit Fire and Brimstone, or Immolate
    Never said anything about it affecting FnB, I said mastery increases FnB, which it does, by its full "ember consuming abilities" value. And someone already corrected me about the Immolate (5hrs before your post by the time stamps, so by the time you read my post I had likely already even made the corrections... meaning you were probably again reading what I was saying about mastery not sacrifice...) I don't mind being told that something I said it's accurate (as noted was corrected by the other guy earlier, and had already changed the part you apparently felt the need to repeat...) but if doing so, at least read what I write before doing so...

    For being so nit picky, I didn't think it was unclear, but I highlighted the sections where you might have thought I said something I never did, just in case...

    Quote Originally Posted by Delia View Post
    ...to be affected by mastery either in full (chaos bolts, fire and brimstone) or partially (immolate, conflag, incinerate, fel flame)...
    Quote Originally Posted by Delia View Post
    ...your single target spells are increased by GoSac, it essentially makes mastery 15% stronger when affecting Chaos Bolts and single target Incinerates, Conflagrates, and Fel Flames...
    If it makes you happy I can say "roughly 15%" or "close to 15%" or "around 15%" that better? I realize he said "in depth" but unless he wants me to post a spreadsheet or a page of formulas to the forums (which honestly is rather pointless unless he wants to straight up theorycraft on his own, rather than get a general understanding), or I could just simply say "they have synergy go away"... that's the thing with math, trying to use words to get it across tends to require simplifying sorry if that was "too simplistic" for you...

    Sorry... I'm being overly pissy, but yea, it irks me to no end when people go out of their way to put words in my mouth to prove a non-existant fault... or to correct something I have already apologized for and corrected, dead horses are dead. I respect that you're trying to be helpful, I don't respect the way you did it.
    Last edited by Delia; 2013-03-23 at 06:04 AM.
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