1. #1

    Is it wrong to take advantage of a bot/gold farmer?

    So, my main is a LW. I was fortunate enough to get the 522 agi boots pattern on one of my first few daily CDs. I think I was one of the first on the server, as quite a few people paid me to make their boots for them. Most of the people I crafted for were normal people, but there's one that's a little... off.

    I'm 99.9% sure this guy is a gold farmer. When I was advertising in trade, he hit me up. Level 1 toon. Offered a nice sum of gold. Very, very bad English. At first I figured maybe he just sucked at typing or was maybe foreign, but he has started hitting me up multiple times a day - always from a different toon. I know it's the same guy because he always types the same way (ends every sentence with a comma - with a space in front of the comma, etc) The toons are either level 1 with starter gear on, or level 80 in the green 232 gear (from the SOR free level 80 bonus). The toons are always at the Org bank in VoS. The entire situation just screams bot/gold farmer.

    I don't know if this guy is duping or what to get all these haunting spirits, but he's let me hold quite a few to make various 522 boots for him. He's also given me a sizeable sum of gold over the last few weeks. I'm slightly worried that I could get in trouble for doing business with him, if/when his account gets the axe. I'm sure some of you AH moguls out there have dealt with these type of people in one way or another, so some advice would be nice.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by kindar; 2013-04-03 at 09:29 PM. Reason: Took out the ending portion about stealing.

  2. #2
    If you feel this guy is a goldfarmer/seller/duper then in the interest of the game you should report his behaviour and have Blizz look at it. Is it really worth it to ruin the game in various ways by aiding crooks like that?

    And about the scamming the possible scammer, yeah, that's a recipe for succes You can bet your ass Blizz will eventually look at this guy's activities and look at his transactions. I wouldn't want to be constantly worried I'd get in trouble on my precious account because of a paltry bit of gold.
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  3. #3
    Immortal Sigma's Avatar
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    hes giving you mats to make items + a crafting fee.
    you in return make him some boots and get paid.

    Doesnt matter to your account where the mats are comming from, your just making the item and trading it back for gold. Everything about that is legitimate.
    However if you where to take the mats and not give him anything in return then you would essentially be scamming him, and regardless of if he is a duper or not he would be within his rights to report you and you could face a suspension.

    Just play it safe. Make the items for him, take the payment and stop worrying about it. Report if you want to saying that your suspicious of where the mats are coming from.
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  4. #4
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    You cant get any repercussions from trading with him, your just selling your stuff, if hes duping or whatever its not your fault. If you were to put them up on the AH and the same guy bought them that wouldnt be your fault either.

    Might aswell make some cash out of him before he gets banned.

  5. #5
    If you're worried about selling stuff to a bot then just refuse to trade with him.

    Planning to rip him off has nothing to do with that, you're just using it as a justification.
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  6. #6
    The Lightbringer Gobra's Avatar
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    The problem arises when Blizzard check his gold/item trade, and see's the accounts been doing a lot with you, If he is using different accounts each time then it would indeed be harder, So you could be in the clear, But in regards to scamming him, Personally i would just see what happens, If you're sure he is doing things that he shouldn't, then it would be decent to report him
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  7. #7
    So this guy has been paying you good money to craft stuff and you want to rip him off?
    Bot or no bot, you deserve a ban too.
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  8. #8
    Blademaster
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    You are crafting stuff for someone. Why is it your problem where his items come from? You can't get banned for that unless you start discussing this in whispers with him or something and then carry on if he confirmed that he was (even then he could say he was a bot for a joke) Just start charging him more for crafting the gear. Keep upping it every few days and see what you can get it to. This maybe a better way to make the gold. Don't rip him off - makes you an exploiter same as him.

  9. #9
    I appreciate the responses. I should not have brought up the stealing thing at all - it was a passing thought, and I've never been the type to steal in game or in real life. I will admit it's been tempting though. So we can drop that. The bulk of my post was about doing business with those people, so thank you to the people that actually responded to that part.

    The varying responses kinda show why I made the post in the first place, as I was feeling the same. Some people are saying it's a normal business transaction, and others say it could get me in trouble. I've been just going with it lately. I don't THINK I'll get in trouble, but I wasn't sure. Hence, forum post.

    I was mainly looking for any encounters others have had in a similar vein. I understand the philosophy of "these people are bad, report report report" and it's just that - a philosophy. Some people do business with them, some do not. I think that's apparent. I'm not looking for a discussion on that aspect at all.

    Basically, has anyone dealt with someone they were fairly sure was a bot or gold farmer in-game? If so, how did it go and what happened afterwards?

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by kindar View Post
    I was mainly looking for any encounters others have had in a similar vein. I understand the philosophy of "these people are bad, report report report" and it's just that - a philosophy. Some people do business with them, some do not. I think that's apparent. I'm not looking for a discussion on that aspect at all.
    Trouble is you are helping people that ruin the game in many ways, that hack accounts, steal credit card information and other real life shitty things. You can't pretend this is just an in-game issue, cause it's not.

    You have pretty damn good evidence of someone that is a real life crook and yet you do nothing with this information. Regardless of if something will happen to your account through Blizzard's intervention at some point, you are actively not trying to stop someone who you have quite good evidence of that he's a crook on a hacked account. You are wilfully not helping Blizzard put a stop to this guy if you don't report it and thereby ruining someone else's account(s) in the process. This isn't just about you, I'm afraid, it's about the consequences of everything this guy does while you were in a position to have him stopped.
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  11. #11
    You wouldn't get in trouble no way a bot or duper is going to take the chance of being investigated as they are just duping mats anyways. Although its wrong and you should just report him as sketchy and give information and describe what you think he's doing. Blizz will investigate and deal with it.

    Edit: After thinking about it for a bit i would pretty much sum the situation as doing deals with a person you thinks in the mob, they're paying you good cash but you think its dirty and your thinking of screwing the guy over (thinking he can't go to the cops) but maybe you should worry about them coming after you in a revenge situation, where they'll take your Life....er Account.
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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    You have pretty damn good evidence of someone that is a real life crook and yet you do nothing with this information. Regardless of if something will happen to your account through Blizzard's intervention at some point, you are actively not trying to stop someone who you have quite good evidence of that he's a crook on a hacked account. You are wilfully not helping Blizzard put a stop to this guy if you don't report it and thereby ruining someone else's account(s) in the process. This isn't just about you, I'm afraid, it's about the consequences of everything this guy does while you were in a position to have him stopped.
    The thing is, what would I say in a report? "This guy talks funny and gives me lots of expensive items on strange toons?" I mean, to most players, the demeanor of this guy would raise some red flags. All I have is speculation though. Me pointing a finger at this guy seems like a drop in the ocean. Yes, if enough people report that guy I'm sure it'd be investigated, but I'm not so sure that my single report would cause anything. I'm sure when he gets caught, it'll be because he raised a red flag in their internal systems (loads of gold flowing through that account to all sorts of confirmed gold sellers, etc) not because I said to them "Hey, this guy is weird. Check it out." I'm sure they get enough of that as it is.

    Anyway, that's why I'm not interested in a discussion on that. It's a whole different topic altogether, and it's definitely a slippery slope. I can tell you already how a thread like that would go: Some people would adamantly feel that these people always need to be reported, and some people would feel just as strongly that, in the game's current state, these people will continue to operate and rake cash in so it's better to play ball than fight it. It's a simple conflict in opinions. Both sides are going to have perfectly good reasons to warrant their thoughts, but there's no hard answer. Nonetheless I'm sure it'd be a great discussion, but it's not the one I'm looking for.

    I'm not a fan of analogies, but it feels like I'd be calling the FBI on the guy that sells weed out of his basement when those guys are far more interested in the entire network of drug dealers, and the drug lord that runs it all.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by kindar View Post
    The thing is, what would I say in a report? "This guy talks funny and gives me lots of expensive items on strange toons?" I mean, to most players, the demeanor of this guy would raise some red flags. All I have is speculation though. Me pointing a finger at this guy seems like a drop in the ocean. Yes, if enough people report that guy I'm sure it'd be investigated, but I'm not so sure that my single report would cause anything. I'm sure when he gets caught, it'll be because he raised a red flag in their internal systems (loads of gold flowing through that account to all sorts of confirmed gold sellers, etc) not because I said to them "Hey, this guy is weird. Check it out." I'm sure they get enough of that as it is.

    I'm not a fan of analogies, but it feels like I'd be calling the FBI on the guy that sells weed out of his basement when those guys are far more interested in the entire network of drug dealers, and the drug lord that runs it all.
    You're in the mindset of "they have bigger fish to fry, why bother mentioning this" which is exactly the reason bots are so hard to squash - people think "eh, it's someone else's problem" and say nothing. If you have suspicions, report them. It's up to Blizzard to investigate things and make the judgement-call on if they're botting or not, not you, and Blizzard can do nothing if they have no reports to get their attention.

    To follow the chain of analogy usage here, Blizzard is the fire department. They don't know where a fire is or how big it is, until it is reported, then they can take action. But whether it's a backyard leaf-burning pile or a house-destroying inferno, it's still a fire and still important, because small fires can become bigger ones if nothing is done about them.
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    Apparently, the superintelligent jetpack gorilla from the Moon makes perfect sense, but chrono-displaced lesbians and transgender automatons is just ridiculous!

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    If you feel this guy is a goldfarmer/seller/duper then in the interest of the game you should report his behaviour and have Blizz look at it.
    And promptly do nothing.

    I'd rather milk him for my own gain while I can.

  15. #15
    Keyboard Turner Frozian's Avatar
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    I'd just get as much gold as possible. A kinda simular situation like this happened to me in GW1

  16. #16
    That guy is a bad guy, can i kill him without charge for murder?
    ^
    ops question.

  17. #17
    Brewmaster Otaka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    If you feel this guy is a goldfarmer/seller/duper then in the interest of the game you should report his behaviour and have Blizz look at it. Is it really worth it to ruin the game in various ways by aiding crooks like that?

    And about the scamming the possible scammer, yeah, that's a recipe for succes You can bet your ass Blizz will eventually look at this guy's activities and look at his transactions. I wouldn't want to be constantly worried I'd get in trouble on my precious account because of a paltry bit of gold.
    Hes not aiding them, if you read he going to ABUSE. Which means the goldfarmer instead wont get anything.

  18. #18
    Edited the op. As I said in an earlier post, the stealing bit was not the main focus of my thread and was more of an funny thought than anything. Really biting my tongue right now, but I'll just say I appreciate the posts so far and hopefully my edit will keep people from responding to the wrong portion. Thanks again guys.

  19. #19
    If it benefits you and youre happy with what you get - Keep on doing it. You wont get in trouble.
    In the past I bought loads of duped (where else lvl1 would have few stacks of those) epic red gems from lvl1s, cut them and resold - guess what? NOTHING! Except me earning tons of gold.

  20. #20
    He could just be a legit player, with lots of connections and gold thus giving him the ability to amass tons of the spirits.

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