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  1. #1

    battle fatigue /pvp power changes (ptr)

    Battle Fatigue now reduces the amount of healing and absorbs by
    50%, up from 30%.

    PvP Power bonus to healing for healing specializations has been
    increased to 100%, up from 50% for Druids, Monks, Paladins,
    Priests, and Shamans.

    PvP Power bonus to healing for damage specializations has been
    increased to 75%, up from 25% for Druids, Monks, Paladins, Priests,
    and Shamans.


    Looks like every healer will be going for pvp power now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    If rogues become shit, all they can become is a different type of shit.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by pkm View Post
    Looks like every healer will be going for pvp power now.
    Only as much as DPS specs go for PvP Power.

    I imagine most will still go Resilience in yellow, Resi/Int in Red - the only change might be going from Resi/Spirit to Resi/PvP Power in blues.


    This was a much needed change, anyway. Having healers not get the full benefit of PvP power - and then making it the only difference between PvE and PvP gear was pretty stupid. Glad it's been fixed.

  3. #3
    Bloodsail Admiral nerdjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snuggli View Post
    This was a much needed change, anyway. Having healers not get the full benefit of PvP power - and then making it the only difference between PvE and PvP gear was pretty stupid. Glad it's been fixed.
    This. Maybe now it won't be gimping your character to actually use a second PvP trinket as a healer.

  4. #4
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snuggli View Post
    Only as much as DPS specs go for PvP Power.

    I imagine most will still go Resilience in yellow, Resi/Int in Red - the only change might be going from Resi/Spirit to Resi/PvP Power in blues.


    This was a much needed change, anyway. Having healers not get the full benefit of PvP power - and then making it the only difference between PvE and PvP gear was pretty stupid. Glad it's been fixed.
    Well there goes my spirit gems...and most likely my pve trinket, it is not like I am going oom that fast...but it is nice to have mana>.<
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  5. #5
    The Lightbringer Speaknoevil's Avatar
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    Can we get percentage based self healing exempt from this sh##?

  6. #6
    It's a kick in the balls for elemental pvp though. We are already far behind on damage because we gotta gem enchant resilience all the way as it's our only survival. 10% dmg reduction glyph is meh. Now other hybrids will be much better off since they have the option of going for pvp power if they wish. Might start gearing up ret or spriest.....
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    If rogues become shit, all they can become is a different type of shit.

  7. #7

    5.3 Battle Fatigue Debuff and PvP Power Changes Explained in Detail with Math!

    In order to better explain the changes in 5.3, I constructed the following charts.

    Chart 1 Power Scaling Debuff Real Healing 5.3 % of Live Nerf %
    5.2 Live
    Healer 50% 50% 70% 87.50%
    Hybrid 50% 25% 70% 78.75%
    Percent Heals 50% 0% 70% 70%
    5.3 Target
    Healer 50% 150% 50% 87.50%
    Hybrid 50% 115% 50% 78.75%
    5.3 Real
    Healer 50% 100% 50% 75.00% 85.71% 14.29%
    Hybrid 50% 75% 50% 68.75% 87.30% 12.70%
    Percent Heals 50% 0% 50% 50% 71.43% 28.57%

    Chart 2 Power Scaling Debuff Real Healing 5.3 % of Live Nerf %
    5.2 Live
    Healer 60% 50% 70% 91%
    Hybrid 60% 25% 70% 80.50%
    Percent Heals 60% 0% 70% 70%
    5.3 Target
    Healer 60% 137% 50% 91%
    Hybrid 60% 102% 50% 80.50%
    5.3 Real
    Healer 60% 100% 50% 80.00% 87.91% 12.09%
    Hybrid 60% 75% 50% 72.50% 90.06% 9.94%
    Percent Heals 60% 0% 50% 50% 71.43% 28.57%

    Power: The raw pvp power percent, where power=pvp power rating/265
    Scaling: The percent of power used to modify healing.
    Debuff: The percent of healing and absorbs that affect players
    Real Healing Stated as a percent of pve healing, given Real healing=(1+(Power*Scaling))*Debuff
    5.3 % of Live: The percent of 5.2 Live healing done in 5.3
    Nerf %: The percent of healing lost in 5.3 compared to 5.2 Live
    5.3 Target: The scaling required if 5.2 Live healing was to remain exactly the same in 5.3
    5.3 Real: The real amount of healing done in 5.3 based on Blizzard post and ptr

    You'll notice that chart 1 considers 50% PvP power, while chart 2 considers 60% PvP power. It's important to note that due to scaling the total nerf is lower at higher pvp power ratings. Net healing nerf on healers and hybrids isn't too bad, around 10-15%. However percent heals and absorbs are getting destroyed at a 28.57% loss. The nerf differential between flat heals and percent heals could cause some imbalances. For example, warlocks use dark regen with health stone for major percent healing. This will be worth 28.57% less next patch while mitigation abilities, ie ice block, will be the same and off heals such as ret instant flash of light will be worth 12% less. In my opinion, it would be better to hit target scaling and let percent heals have a 70% debuff. This would allow pvp to remain a strong stat without changing real healing done. Another solution is allowing pvp power to affect percent heals, although if all dps classes received hybrid healing scaling on percent healing, the healing would be out of control.
    Last edited by Highmoon7; 2013-04-05 at 08:22 PM.

  8. #8
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speaknoevil View Post
    Can we get percentage based self healing exempt from this sh##?
    It's one thing I'd love to see. As a warlock, this is a massive nerf to my survivability and blizzard knowing they are not going to give a proper compensation for it.

  9. #9
    Im on the way off leveling a lock for pvp, 88 atm and i guess this will affect my selfheals? drain life already heals for a small amount imo and is useless when you get trained by melee, ofc locks have other meens to selfheal but this sounds like a big nerf in general for locks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    It's one thing I'd love to see. As a warlock, this is a massive nerf to my survivability and blizzard knowing they are not going to give a proper compensation for it.
    How big of a nerf are we talking? I will still play the lock, nerfs or not he is to fun.
    Last edited by ParanoiD84; 2013-04-05 at 03:36 PM.

  10. #10
    As others have brought up, Blizzard might be forgetting how this might adversely affect the balance of some classes, as it guts the self-healing abilities of classes like rogues, warlocks, warriors, death knights, etc., abilities that such classes are inevitably balanced around. Battle fatigue percentages should be different bases on whether or not the healing done is from a self-heal versus a healing effect that affects other players (the vast majority of healer specialization spells), but that will be a tough number for them to balance.

    There's also a difference between survivability and sustainability without a healer, where self-healing cause problems. Defensive cooldowns that don't heal provide survivability, but healing defensive cooldowns provide some survivability and sustainability, and the relative benefits of both can be tough to balance.
    Last edited by Brouhaha; 2013-04-05 at 03:46 PM.

  11. #11
    Bloodsail Admiral Cjeska's Avatar
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    Too bad this will balance out to be another ~15% nerf to healing :-(

  12. #12
    Dreadlord joepesci's Avatar
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    DPS specs should have %-based heals, exclusively, and those shouldn't be affected by battle fatigue.

    This thing was only introduced due to healers being OP, it wasn't the fault of DPS specs, which also have to suffer now, and according to the other thread, DPS specs get their healing nerfed the most with this change.

  13. #13
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkm View Post
    It's a kick in the balls for elemental pvp though. We are already far behind on damage because we gotta gem enchant resilience all the way as it's our only survival. 10% dmg reduction glyph is meh. Now other hybrids will be much better off since they have the option of going for pvp power if they wish. Might start gearing up ret or spriest.....
    What? Pretty much everyone gems resil as their main secondary... Ret sure as hell does. 10% Damage reduc all the time is not meh at all. It is a pretty MASSIVE buff.

  14. #14
    I am Murloc! Baracuda's Avatar
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    One thing I noticed on PTR is that warlocks healing is A LOT weaker. Any class which doesn't benefit from the pvp healing part will have extremely weak self healing.
    Quote Originally Posted by kbarh View Post
    may i suggest you check out wowwiki or any similar site, it's Grom that orders the murder of Cairne

  15. #15
    I am Murloc! Baracuda's Avatar
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    Indeed warlock self healing, and probably the self healing for all classes that don't get heal% from pvp power, has been gutted.
    Quote Originally Posted by kbarh View Post
    may i suggest you check out wowwiki or any similar site, it's Grom that orders the murder of Cairne

  16. #16
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ParanoiD84 View Post
    Im on the way off leveling a lock for pvp, 88 atm and i guess this will affect my selfheals? drain life already heals for a small amount imo and is useless when you get trained by melee, ofc locks have other meens to selfheal but this sounds like a big nerf in general for locks.

    How big of a nerf are we talking? I will still play the lock, nerfs or not he is to fun.
    From 70% healing to only 50% healing, which is roughly 30% less then what we have now... (Unless I fucked up on math).
    On live, you can compare it with having a permanent mortal strike debuff on you, on top of the 30% battle fatigue we have right now.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    From 70% healing to only 50% healing, which is roughly 30% less then what we have now... (Unless I fucked up on math).
    On live, you can compare it with having a permanent mortal strike debuff on you, on top of the 30% battle fatigue we have right now.
    Ok thanks, i dont like the sound off that and i doubt warlocks will get something else to compensate.

  18. #18
    I guess pvp power will again be better than int for healers come 5.3?

  19. #19
    I am Murloc! Baracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ParanoiD84 View Post
    Ok thanks, i dont like the sound off that and i doubt warlocks will get something else to compensate.
    If we make them aware of it they might change it, but I doubt it.
    Quote Originally Posted by kbarh View Post
    may i suggest you check out wowwiki or any similar site, it's Grom that orders the murder of Cairne

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Speaknoevil View Post
    Can we get percentage based self healing exempt from this sh##?
    I would rather see them scale the same way off pvp power as hybrid dps.

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