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  1. #1

    Mage alliance race

    So, i have decided to transfer my Mage, who was previously Horde and PvP to my home realm, and start PvE'ing on it, like i used to in tbc, cata and wotlk. However i'm not really sure what race would be the best for PvE right now, i'm going to be Alliance, so i'm thinking of Pandaren or Worgen, i was browsing the guides here on the forum but i only found the fire guide to say anything about which race is the best, now i'm most likely going to be fire, atleast in the start, as it's what i enjoy the most, but i might change the next week or whenever if i see that another spec is superior.

    So i would prefer a race that is 90% on all three specs (atleast fire and frost, doubt i will be playing arcane if it isn't FAR superior) over a race that is 100% on one spec and 0% on the other, if you understand what i mean. Thanks alot!
    Supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting. -sun tzu

  2. #2
    Bloodsail Admiral Saegno's Avatar
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    Pandaren and Worgen. Pandaren are solid for all specs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    If you're semi-hardcore or semi-casual what's the other half? To me, they're both the same thing.
    Canicus - 577 - Arcane Mage - US Mal'Ganis Horde - 12/14H T16

  3. #3
    High Overlord Adeltor's Avatar
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    For PVE go Worgen without ANY doubt. Darkflight (40% movement speed for 10 secs on 2min), 1% Crit what else do you need? It's quite more beneficial imo than the Pandaren, and my gosh I'd rather die than be a Pandaren.

    If you, however want to go full pvp i think it's obvious you have to go Human for the Every Man for Himself (2nd pvp trinket) thing. Whatever you do, don't go gnome, nelf or draenei, not a single good ability, maybe only a dwarf is an exception. But as mentioned above I would go worgen without a doubt straight away.


    I've been a Worgen my whole raiding life so I can assure you the Darkflight might save your ass or raid at times. The Crit scales great with Fire too, and assuming Frost has a Crit-cap aswell you won't regret it. Besides you'll have additional fast Skinning if you want it as a profession (it's buff is crit aswell, not that it's the best profession for a mage) and some utilities like being able to run without a mount by dropping at all four and Two Forms which is a cool utility whenever you hang out somewhere and want to look like a human.
    Last edited by Adeltor; 2013-04-08 at 05:39 PM.
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  4. #4
    Definitely human. Not only every man for himself, but if you use a sword now you get +1% hit.

  5. #5
    High Overlord Henzington's Avatar
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    Hit really isnt an issue so draenei human and gnome definitely not the best in pve. Although every man does work for some mechanics.

  6. #6
    So from a purely PvE aspect as fire Worgen is above Pandren, and I'll prove it this way. Pandaren get 600 int from the best food (easiest math), while everyone else gets 300int. So this is a gain of 300int. Worgen get 1% crit which is equal to 600 crit rating, and as we know from gemming 2 crit > 1 int therefore 600 crit > 300 int. That is how I calculated it and actually changed (among a few other factors too). Also darkflight is quite useful for its movement bonus, in particular the off but very frustrating times when blink bugs and it puts you in a jam where you need to get somewhere fast quick. This is much more useful than quaking palm which isn't really useful as a mage in most situations.

    PvP wise human obviously the best, contradicting adeltor, I Nelf can be very good for pvp if you can shadowmeld right, one of my best in game friends PvP's all day long and his spriest is a nelf and he talks about how Smeld wins him games. Gnome is also useful because if you're rooted and you really need a way out, instead of having to blow your trinket you got escape artist, not a huge gain and obviously human trinket wins out, but its just another thing that can really mess with other teams (you can screw frost mages due to breaking nova without blink or trinket or a dispell). Draenei can still be useful but obviously aren't super great in PvP as nothing they have is totally game breaking, but Gift of the Naruu can be quite helpful you can macro it to something (off GCD) and say use it with Ice block so you'll be invulnerable but heal over time. Dwarves are solid choices, however stoneform while can be incredibly useful, typically isn't the strongest choice as a mage imo, however it can still be a great asset as any racial can be in the player who uses it appropriately.

    Tl;Dr PvE Worgen for fire (can argue frost but falls behind pandaren here) Pandaren for frost/arc Draenei/gnome/human all are decent as they give 1% hit (for humans only when using a sword and gnomes swords or daggers).
    PvP Human if you value the trinket that much, if you don't Nelf/Gnome/dwarf
    Daft Punk Forever!

  7. #7
    Bloodsail Admiral Saegno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kladd View Post
    *Snip*
    So i would prefer a race that is 90% on all three specs (atleast fire and frost, doubt i will be playing arcane if it isn't FAR superior) over a race that is 100% on one spec and 0% on the other, if you understand what i mean. Thanks alot!
    This is why I mentioned pandaren. Yes worgen is ahead for fire and decent for frost but pandaren is good for all specs without any major drawback from one to the other.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    If you're semi-hardcore or semi-casual what's the other half? To me, they're both the same thing.
    Canicus - 577 - Arcane Mage - US Mal'Ganis Horde - 12/14H T16

  8. #8
    Gnome+Arcane= <3

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Adeltor View Post
    Whatever you do, don't go gnome, nelf or draenei, not a single good ability, maybe only a dwarf is an exception.
    Gnomes get extra hit from swords or daggers, and a snare/root removal.
    Draenei get an automatic extra 1% to hit everything all the time, and a self heal.

    How are those not good abilities? Don't confuse your personal preference with actual in-game utility.

    And yea, Night Elves are just shit...

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Chestbrah View Post
    Definitely human. Not only every man for himself, but if you use a sword now you get +1% hit.
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    Gnomes get extra hit from swords or daggers, and a snare/root removal.
    Draenei get an automatic extra 1% to hit everything all the time, and a self heal.

    How are those not good abilities? Don't confuse your personal preference with actual in-game utility.

    And yea, Night Elves are just shit...
    Unless my understanding of the English language has completely failed me, the +1% hit bonus from using a sword on those races does not translate to spell hit, it just gives melee hit. I honestly fail to see how carrying a sword can make your spells more accurate, or how someone could make that connection.

    Also, unless the character creation screens haven't been updated (I'm betting not), all I'm seeing are races with EXPERTISE bonuses, Draenei being the only ones with a +Hit bonus.
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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by endersblade View Post
    Unless my understanding of the English language has completely failed me, the +1% hit bonus from using a sword on those races does not translate to spell hit, it just gives melee hit. I honestly fail to see how carrying a sword can make your spells more accurate, or how someone could make that connection.

    Also, unless the character creation screens haven't been updated (I'm betting not), all I'm seeing are races with EXPERTISE bonuses, Draenei being the only ones with a +Hit bonus.
    In MoP blizz changed it so that for casters, exp = hit on an equal level. You can reforge exp on a caster and gain hit from it. These bonus's are the same as well, 1% exp gives 1% hit.
    Daft Punk Forever!

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by arizonapriest93 View Post
    In MoP blizz changed it so that for casters, exp = hit on an equal level. You can reforge exp on a caster and gain hit from it. These bonus's are the same as well, 1% exp gives 1% hit.
    Nice, thanks for the info. Glad to know Blizz finally did something about that!
    Quote Originally Posted by Warwithin View Post
    Politicians put their hand on the BIBLE and swore to uphold the CONSTITUTION. They did not put their hand on the CONSTITUTION and swear to uphold the BIBLE.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Except maybe Morgan Freeman. That man could convince God to be an atheist with that voice of his . . .

  13. #13
    High Overlord Adeltor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    Gnomes get extra hit from swords or daggers, and a snare/root removal.
    Draenei get an automatic extra 1% to hit everything all the time, and a self heal.

    How are those not good abilities? Don't confuse your personal preference with actual in-game utility.

    And yea, Night Elves are just shit...
    Mate, we have trinkets with 1.5k hit on them nowadays, not to mention that the itemization of a big amount of the Fire items is Hit, so are Frost's items aswell... So I don't even see your point with Hit and Exp!? The guy asks for PVE mainly, so I don't think humans used Every man for himself anywhere on the last tier except for Four Kings heroic /normal/lfr or Council of Elders quicksand and this tier!?

    Ofc i have a personal preference, but that doesn't prove either way that the other alliance races are any good for PVE. And for PVP you can go Blazing Speed aswell, it does the same what the gnome thing does. Hit and Exp aren't an issue, and if you check the higher geared mages in the top guilds - most of them reforge FROM hit to Crit/Mastery/Haste whatever...

    For Alliance it's only Pandaren/Worgen. And since someone did the math already I don't believe 300 int is better than 600 crit. So the choice is more than obvious. If you, however, do not like worgens (casting animations, emotes, looks, walk etc) then you just choose whatever you like the most. But one is for sure - compared to the Horde, Alliance races are bullshit big time.
    .
    Quote Originally Posted by zomgDPS View Post
    I want to feel the zomg in my dpspants when I throw pyros at someones face. How do you keep that feeling of 'zomg' in your pants while still nerfing throughput?

    Sig by Shyama!

  14. #14
    Went worgen since im going to play fire, was just deciding between worgen/pandaren, thanks for all the answers!
    Supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting. -sun tzu

  15. #15

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Adeltor View Post
    Mate, we have trinkets with 1.5k hit on them nowadays, not to mention that the itemization of a big amount of the Fire items is Hit, so are Frost's items aswell... So I don't even see your point with Hit and Exp!? The guy asks for PVE mainly, so I don't think humans used Every man for himself anywhere on the last tier except for Four Kings heroic /normal/lfr or Council of Elders quicksand and this tier!?
    Well first of all, I was merely replying to someone else (not you) who said that gnomes and draenei have no good abilities. Free stats, snare removal, and healing are at least moderately useful. And, I said nothing about humans... So I'm really not sure what you're getting at.

  17. #17
    Warchief Voyager's Avatar
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    Night Elf is by far the worst race for mages.

  18. #18
    And Akraens point is that the racial benefits are such a small factor in your overall output, that even being a Night Elf, the worst race for mage as you put it, he still ranks very high.

    Clearly skill, gear, and excution of mechanics vastly overshadow the pros or cons of the racial abilities.

  19. #19
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
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    If I was going to min/max race, I'd be Horde.

    Since I'm Alliance, I figure I'll play what adds flavor to the game and what I enjoy the most. I recommend more people do the same.

    I'd also like to point out that shadowmeld has done some incredible things for my DPM moreso than DPS. You can do some clever things with it, but I won't share all my secrets.

  20. #20
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by henzington View Post
    Hit really isnt an issue so draenei human and gnome definitely not the best in pve. Although every man does work for some mechanics.
    If by "some" you mean "all". It's 1000x more helpful than you know, though Worgen is overall the best.

    Worgen > Human (with a Sword) > Pandaren > Human (w/o Sword) >= Draenei > Gnome (Arcane) > Dwarf > Gnome (Fire/Frost) > NElf

    There's the overall order IMO.

    The only problem with Humans this tier is that there ARE no spellswords

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