1. #1

    Question Raid Wall Stack??

    Help a Sin'dorei out here guys.

    Can you stack Raid Walls, I'm not asking if its a good idea, I don't care how much more effecient they are, I just want to know can you stack them and do they work ( I understand the dimishment of each CD (% > % < %)

    E.G Devo Aura + Priest Barrier + Smoke Bomb = ? Will the strongest work or will all three interact?

    Please don't ask why or any of this stupid stuff, just answer the question or don't write anything at all.

    Lastly can I have proof or this instead of just going of gut instinct.

  2. #2
    Stacks multiplicatively, yes.

    Google "wow damage reduction stacking", there's plenty of sources.

  3. #3
    This is extremly outdated and has nothing to do with what I need to know. I am seeing if RAID WALLS go together. Devo aura and barrier. EXTERNALS. Not personals and externals because obviously that works.

    Also since cata there has bene massive changes to the WAY raid walls work. Including rogues having bomb and devo being only magic dmg.

    So any input would be nice.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    This is extremly outdated and has nothing to do with what I need to know. I am seeing if RAID WALLS go together. Devo aura and barrier. EXTERNALS. Not personals and externals because obviously that works.

    Also since cata there has bene massive changes to the WAY raid walls work. Including rogues having bomb and devo being only magic dmg.

    So any input would be nice.
    He gave you exactly what you needed to know don't be so rude. Personals and raid cds work the same way for damage reduction calculation.

  5. #5
    Priest barriers don't stack with each other. It would appear that smoke bomb and barrier do however stack together.

  6. #6
    100 damage
    -25% from Power word barrier = 75 damage
    -20% from Devotion aura = 60 damage

    The strongest reduction applies first as I recall, but it doesnt matter either way because its multiplicative. This same multiplicative damage reduction applies to all relevent sources of player-based damage reduction in the current game, including armor. The easiest anecdotal proof of this is a paladin tank who has 50% base physical damage reduction and uses Shield of the Righteous, an additional 50+% damage reduction. You still take damage, obviously. For proof, specifically, of raid walls stacking together, you're just going to have to trust me that they do. People rarely use them that way, so logs of that showing the numbers will be hard to find.

  7. #7
    Pretty sure that the only thing that doesn't stack is multiple Power Word: Barrier from Disc. Priests. Everything else should stack multiplicatively with everything else. I am fairly certain I have seen multiple Smoke Bombs at the same time that works.

    Not 100% on this though.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    This is extremly outdated and has nothing to do with what I need to know. I am seeing if RAID WALLS go together. Devo aura and barrier. EXTERNALS. Not personals and externals because obviously that works.

    Also since cata there has bene massive changes to the WAY raid walls work. Including rogues having bomb and devo being only magic dmg.

    So any input would be nice.
    How are those massive changes? Smoke bomb gained 20% DR, the same (mechanically, not by amount) DR as all other DRs. Devotion aura was adjusted to not reduce magic damage by resistance anymore, because resistance no longer exists - so now it just reduces by a flat %. I believe the average amount reduced when it still worked by resistance was ~15%, but resistance is different. They made it simpler, if anything.

    There is absolutely no reason that you need to consider an "external" DR cooldown and personal one as different. DR is DR.

    edit: To clarify, resistance does still exist, but it isn't intended to be relevant to the game anymore (though unfortunately still was due to a badly designed Lei Shi encounter and old world FR gear still existing).
    Last edited by Spiralphoenix; 2013-04-10 at 02:01 PM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noorri View Post
    Pretty sure that the only thing that doesn't stack is multiple Power Word: Barrier from Disc. Priests. Everything else should stack multiplicatively with everything else. I am fairly certain I have seen multiple Smoke Bombs at the same time that works.

    Not 100% on this though.
    I am on a team that runs 3 paladins sadly, i am pretty sure their Devotion Aura does not stack and you only get the benefit of one if they use it at the same time, so i would guess the smoke bomb works the same?

  10. #10
    Pandaren Monk
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    Why would you want to stack them and not chain them ?
    More consistent damage reduction over a longer time :s

    OT. Yes, all % based DR stacks multiplicative

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by sisk View Post
    I am on a team that runs 3 paladins sadly, i am pretty sure their Devotion Aura does not stack and you only get the benefit of one if they use it at the same time, so i would guess the smoke bomb works the same?
    Err that's right huh.. so I guess there are a few examples of the same raid walls not stacking on each other. As far as I know they all stack with OTHER raid walls, but with each other I guess they're determined on a case-by-case basis, as theres nothing in the tooltip indicating that limitation

  12. #12
    I'm still not getting any sort of proof.

    The question that was asked was, do raid walls stack. Everything else is completely off topic and wasting time. Thank you to those who DID put some good input about stacking etc.

    So the question still remains. Do CDs stack and what does or does not. Devo - Barrier and BomB I will need as what I want it for only lasts 6-10 seconds.

    Devo on Devo? Barrier on barrier? Spirit link on barrier? Etc etc. Keep the good answers in. Keep the bad answers in your head.
    Last edited by kaption; 2013-04-10 at 02:35 PM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    I'm still not getting any sort of proof.

    The question that was asked was do raid walls stack. Everything else is completely off topic and wasting time. Thank you to those who DID put some good input about stacking etc.

    So the question still remains. Do CDs stack and what does or does not. Devo - Barrier and BomB I will need as what I want it for only lasts 6-10 seconds.

    Devo on Devo? Barrier on barrier? Spirit link on barrier? Etc etc. Keep the good answers in. Keep the bad answers in your head.
    as already said, Barrier does not stack with barrier.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    I'm still not getting any sort of proof.

    The question that was asked was, do raid walls stack. Everything else is completely off topic and wasting time. Thank you to those who DID put some good input about stacking etc.

    So the question still remains. Do CDs stack and what does or does not. Devo - Barrier and BomB I will need as what I want it for only lasts 6-10 seconds.

    Devo on Devo? Barrier on barrier? Spirit link on barrier? Etc etc. Keep the good answers in. Keep the bad answers in your head.
    check your attitude.

    Basic game mechanics indicate that they SHOULD stack, although there are cases where they don't. As far as I'm aware, its always one ability stacking with itself that doesnt work. As to which abilities that applies to, individual testing would have to be done to confirm them, as nobody is going to roll into this thread with the answer. If you really need the answer so badly right now, log on and grab a friend, go find a mob in the wild, see how much it hits for normally, then use those cooldowns and do the math. If you get any interesting results definitely let us know.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by dennisdkramer View Post
    check your attitude.

    Basic game mechanics indicate that they SHOULD stack, although there are cases where they don't. As far as I'm aware, its always one ability stacking with itself that doesnt work. As to which abilities that applies to, individual testing would have to be done to confirm them, as nobody is going to roll into this thread with the answer. If you really need the answer so badly right now, log on and grab a friend, go find a mob in the wild, see how much it hits for normally, then use those cooldowns and do the math. If you get any interesting results definitely let us know.
    This thread should be closed based solely on the ops attitude.

    For testing you don't even have to go that far. You can just look at your buffs. Devo doesn't stack and you can tell this by looking when 1 paladin uses it you get a buff. When the 2nd paladin uses it it overwrites the first. Pretty much the rule of thumb is that 2 of the exact same cooldowns don't stack. I would be surprised if double smoke bomb worked but who knows.[COLOR="red"]

    edit -- also @op were not here to give you a formal proof of with logs and screenshots if you really want that do it yourself and if your feeling generous make a post describing your results. Otherwise only expect helpful advice and answers with little to no formal proof.
    Last edited by iDrunkenheal; 2013-04-10 at 03:19 PM.

  16. #16
    For testing I need the people. If I had the people I would not be asking.

    As for my attitude, I am looking for an answer and all I am getting is flame. Not an arguement. I have told you what I am looking for so you yourself posting this is counter productive. If wanting a straight answer is bannable. Perma ban me because I don't like "going around the houses". (So they saying goes)

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    just answer the question or don't write anything at all..
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    I'm still not getting any sort of proof.
    Quote Originally Posted by kaption View Post
    Keep the bad answers in your head.
    Nobody here is your personal slave and you don't own the thread. If you don't have the people to do testing, you should be trying your guild or someone from trade chat for a short while, maybe offer them gold for their time.

    Nobody will go out of their way to find results you want, as

    * Raid walls of different kinds have been stacking for a long while.
    * Raid walls and personal cooldowns have been stacking for a long while.
    * Different personal cooldowns and external single targets cooldowns have been stacking for a long while.

    There is literally no reason to suspect if X and Y doesn't stack now. I sincerely doubt someone thought "Oh things changed after Cataclysm, let's try all the cooldowns together and make a list".

  18. #18
    Devo and smoke bomb stack - there's a good dip in damage from our last logs during a rampage, when we failed to roll them sequentially and got them simultaneously instead.

    I'm not surprised that you can't get people to help you test this out if you approach everyone with that attitude.

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