Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst
1
2
  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Jizzler View Post
    Then spells for Paladins, Druids and Shamans will just end up costing alot more. I dont see any logic in this chance, as its written.
    They haven't finished the change. They can increase the base mana and reduce the % of mana cost to compensate.
    This is more reasonable as it's very unlikly they apply the same nerf to 3/5 of the healer classes.

    Of course this is just my guess. We will have to wait for the future patch notes.

  2. #22
    As I said. It's a blatant change for arena-ing purposes I guess. Increasing the mana pools to 100k for DPS classes (Enh Shaman, Ret Pallies, Feral/Guardian Druids) is pretty big. I can't even see this as a "nerf to mana pools" for healers and ranged DPS (Ele Shaman and Boomkins) because Resto Druids are still really terrible, so are Resto Shaman. The only class that would warrant a "nerf" is Paladin and this targets the wrong area: they need a nerf to their mastery and (wholly so) a nerf to the t14 4 piece.

  3. #23
    Pandaren Monk Freia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland
    Posts
    1,809
    Quote Originally Posted by Treseme View Post
    As I said. It's a blatant change for arena-ing purposes I guess. Increasing the mana pools to 100k for DPS classes (Enh Shaman, Ret Pallies, Feral/Guardian Druids) is pretty big. I can't even see this as a "nerf to mana pools" for healers and ranged DPS (Ele Shaman and Boomkins) because Resto Druids are still really terrible, so are Resto Shaman. The only class that would warrant a "nerf" is Paladin and this targets the wrong area: they need a nerf to their mastery and (wholly so) a nerf to the t14 4 piece.
    They are calling it a nerf to said healers because they haven't announced a buff to the base mana of said classes. Right now it just looks like the mana pools are decreasing with no other information on why and consolation. At this point everything is speculation.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Treseme View Post
    As I said. It's a blatant change for arena-ing purposes I guess. Increasing the mana pools to 100k for DPS classes (Enh Shaman, Ret Pallies, Feral/Guardian Druids) is pretty big.
    I keep seeing this 100k figure tossed around. That would give post-adjustment (hesitant to say nerf just yet) hybrid casters 400k mana. That'd be quite the buff for us!

    To result in no net change to healers/casters, the base mana for those specs would need to be adjusted only to 75k, not 100k, along with an across-the-board decrease in spell costs of 20%. Spell costs remain unchanged, non-caster hybrid specs get a modest 15k / 25% increase in mana pool. That's less than one extra Flash of Light.

    Before: 60k * 5 (base 100% + 400% spec bonus) = 300k
    After: 75k * 4 (base 100% + 300% spec bonus) = 300k

  5. #25
    There is a tweet by GC that this is just a slightly complicated tooltip fix. Not a real change.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by oldnmean View Post
    There is a tweet by GC that this is just a slightly complicated tooltip fix. Not a real change.
    Link to this?

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Katen View Post
    Link to this?
    https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/sta...57810993635331

    "Buffs in 5.3 to Ret, Enhance, WW, Feral, hunters and mage AE are real, at least for now. Mana pool changes are not."

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Hjelpen View Post
    https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/sta...57810993635331

    "Buffs in 5.3 to Ret, Enhance, WW, Feral, hunters and mage AE are real, at least for now. Mana pool changes are not."
    Hopefully it stays that way. As much as i enjoy pally right now, and i agree we deserve a nerf, lessening mana pools doesnt seem the best route to go.

  9. #29
    Reducing the size of the base mana pool isn't really a change they're going to make in a minor patch. It effects far too much regarding base regeneration and predicted longevity.
    Video Game Blog - Now with 100% less World of Warcraft!

  10. #30
    Heal Adinne @HealAdinne
    @Ghostcrawler Re: 400% -> 300% mana pool increase on hybrid healers. Is this accompanied with an increase of base mana for hybrids?


    Greg Street @Ghostcrawler
    @HealAdinne Not a real change. Slightly complicated tooltip fix.
    Last edited by rinleezwins; 2013-04-12 at 07:44 PM.

  11. #31
    if they do this, they need to reduce all healing mana costs to compensate

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBmNL...ature=youtu.be (#1 SSB Gold run on Bleeding Hollow)
    "Your lights will go out. The darkness will envelop you. And you will fear the shadows that move within it."

  12. #32
    Pandaren Monk Freia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland
    Posts
    1,809
    Quote Originally Posted by Pyroness View Post
    Hopefully it stays that way. As much as i enjoy pally right now, and i agree we deserve a nerf, lessening mana pools doesnt seem the best route to go.
    We deserve a nerf why exactly? I am not seeing WoL showing only paladins like it did with monks and disc priests before their nerfs. We are strong but we don't deserve nerfs because 2 of the healing classes are weak.

  13. #33
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Posts
    4,210
    Quote Originally Posted by Freia View Post
    We deserve a nerf why exactly? I am not seeing WoL showing only paladins like it did with monks and disc priests before their nerfs. We are strong but we don't deserve nerfs because 2 of the healing classes are weak.
    The only thing I see as a bit out of line is the T14 4pc, it's annoying and stupid that I am expected to have it to be competitive (with the highest possible item level). Of course, nerfing that is a nerf to all paladins unfortunately, but Ghostcrawler did hint that saying "T14 > T15 4-sets" equals "nerf T14"

    It's also counter-intuitive that I should have to ask others to farm T14 with me (and try to drag/bribe people along) because the gear we collect from the T15 raid, until we get all of the tier dropping-bosses on heroic, is not competitive.

    Point being, I think nerfing the T14 four-set will 1) take away most of what was OP (if anything) about the class, and 2) allow people who weren't able to get the T14 four-set to be competitive by getting T15 2-set for instance.

  14. #34
    Pandaren Monk Freia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland
    Posts
    1,809
    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    The only thing I see as a bit out of line is the T14 4pc, it's annoying and stupid that I am expected to have it to be competitive (with the highest possible item level). Of course, nerfing that is a nerf to all paladins unfortunately, but Ghostcrawler did hint that saying "T14 > T15 4-sets" equals "nerf T14"

    It's also counter-intuitive that I should have to ask others to farm T14 with me (and try to drag/bribe people along) because the gear we collect from the T15 raid, until we get all of the tier dropping-bosses on heroic, is not competitive.

    Point being, I think nerfing the T14 four-set will 1) take away most of what was OP (if anything) about the class, and 2) allow people who weren't able to get the T14 four-set to be competitive by getting T15 2-set for instance.
    That is annoying to me as well. I would rather upgrade gear over sticking with previous tiers.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    The only thing I see as a bit out of line is the T14 4pc, it's annoying and stupid that I am expected to have it to be competitive (with the highest possible item level). Of course, nerfing that is a nerf to all paladins unfortunately, but Ghostcrawler did hint that saying "T14 > T15 4-sets" equals "nerf T14"

    It's also counter-intuitive that I should have to ask others to farm T14 with me (and try to drag/bribe people along) because the gear we collect from the T15 raid, until we get all of the tier dropping-bosses on heroic, is not competitive.

    Point being, I think nerfing the T14 four-set will 1) take away most of what was OP (if anything) about the class, and 2) allow people who weren't able to get the T14 four-set to be competitive by getting T15 2-set for instance.
    They need to rework t15 sets not nerf t14. Just because they did a shitty job a designing the set bonuses doesn't mean all paladins have to suffer for it because blizzard is lazy. People were even saying it during ptr and they didn't listen.

    Natural blizzard/GC fashion to completely ignore people then not take responsibility later on when shit goes south.

    The answer isn't to nerf the old tier it's to make the new tier more attractive period. Right now t15 is just incredibly underwhelming.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBmNL...ature=youtu.be (#1 SSB Gold run on Bleeding Hollow)
    "Your lights will go out. The darkness will envelop you. And you will fear the shadows that move within it."

  16. #36
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Posts
    4,210
    Quote Originally Posted by Theholypally View Post
    They need to rework t15 sets not nerf t14. Just because they did a shitty job a designing the set bonuses doesn't mean all paladins have to suffer for it because blizzard is lazy. People were even saying it during ptr and they didn't listen...

    The answer isn't to nerf the old tier it's to make the new tier more attractive period. Right now t15 is just incredibly underwhelming.
    Overpowered Tier Bonuses just mean your class gets balanced around having tier, seeing as healers are often (and often should be) last to get tier, it means your effectiveness comes down to guild politics. I never got my T14 4pc partly because I started my new character in November which is really, really late, but fortunately I'm in a guild situation where I can hope that we'll get plenty of gear for everyone by the later bosses. Not everyone's in a boat where they are farming in tier week for week or in a guild where they don't lose tier due to turnover.

    I'd be fine with making Tier 14 baseline (or partially baseline, i.e. 5 second baseline CD on shock) but that would break PvP.

    I'm wondering if (per my post on another thread) the AoE heal fix will help the 2pc marginally. The fact that Daybreak's overheal % is so high is stupid.

  17. #37
    Pandaren Monk Freia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland
    Posts
    1,809
    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    I'd be fine with making Tier 14 baseline (or partially baseline, i.e. 5 second baseline CD on shock) but that would break PvP.
    I actually agree with lowering it to 5 seconds (and of course updating the t14 bonus to reflect changes like the penance buff+t14 nerf). I really think that would be all that is needed if that.

    Pretty much they need to make T15 at least good enough for the bonus + extra stats on gear to overtake T14 because right now it isn't. But it looks like they will go the route of breaking T14 and leaving T15 as is.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    I'd be fine with making Tier 14 baseline (or partially baseline, i.e. 5 second baseline CD on shock) but that would break PvP.
    So much for baseline. The current PTR patch notes quote that as the new 4pcT14 bonus. Rather than fix the crap that is T15, they took the easy nerf route.

    Mastery scaling is also taking a 16.67% hit in the next PTR build, and Daybreak is nerfed by 25% (but stacks up to 2 times!). No nerfs to Mistweavers or Disc Priests listed thus far. Bow before your priest and monk masters, holy paladins!
    Last edited by Kaeth; 2013-04-16 at 12:13 AM.

  19. #39
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Posts
    4,210
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaeth View Post
    So much for baseline. The current PTR patch notes quote that as the new 4pcT14 bonus. Rather than fix the crap that is T15, they took the easy nerf route.

    Mastery scaling is also taking a 16.67% hit in the next PTR build, and Daybreak is nerfed by 25% (but stacks up to 2 times!). No nerfs to Mistweavers or Disc Priests listed thus far. Bow before your priest and monk masters, holy paladins!
    Pretty much this. Daybreak is honestly fine even with the nerf (it was difficult to use Daybreak off CD anyway without T14). Baseline was simply not going to happen with PvP as I noted. That I will admit is OP.

    The mastery nerf however, will hurt a lot. And in all honesty is pretty unwarranted, especially as you pointed out, it's really needed for us to compete with MW and Disc.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •