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  1. #1
    Grunt
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    Savage Roar Buff

    Fantastic, I think this is what we needed guys. What do you think?
    -Savage Roar now Increases Physical Damage by 40% up from 30%

    Think this is the dps buff we needed outside our cooldowns, but do you think it will push us into the OP section with our CDs up?
    or is it nothing to worry about with the Enhance and Rogue burst buffs? Thoughts?

  2. #2
    Is SR no longer dispellable?

  3. #3
    Grunt
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    Believe so, may be wrong, would love if someone could confirm/deny.

  4. #4
    Not understanding why Blizzard buffing some of these classes which will further increase this "burst" issue in arena. Every class will soon have 100-0 burst really soon. Its a nice dps boost for ferals in the pve scene, straight up 10% damage buff. But I am worried about melee burst in pvp now.

    I do not believe savage roar is dispellable because it doesn't say its a enrage anymore. Now that this question is brought up, I am wondering what usage soothe has in the pvp scene since there aren't much enrages anymore aka recklessness. When I go bear form, and pop enrage, the tooltip on the buff for enrage will say it is an enrage. That is probably one of the few druid spells that another druid can soothe off, even though it isn't worth the gcd.

  5. #5
    The Patient Kreuz Kontrol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Williee View Post
    Not understanding why Blizzard buffing some of these classes which will further increase this "burst" issue in arena. Every class will soon have 100-0 burst really soon. Its a nice dps boost for ferals in the pve scene, straight up 10% damage buff. But I am worried about melee burst in pvp now.
    Feral damage is extremely lackluster, imho, outside of Incarnation.

  6. #6
    Mechagnome Shifthappens's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kreuz Kontrol View Post
    Feral damage is extremely lackluster, imho, outside of Incarnation.
    Yep, if you cant burst people down during incarnation (and you wont be able to if they have CDs up and not sleeping at keyboard) then outside incarnation our dmg is abit lacking. Could use Cylone to 10sec CD lowered, 20 sec is still too much right now.
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  7. #7
    Honestly, I wish they only put cyclone on cd IF and only IF you use it with predatory swiftness. So we can still hardcast it or nature's swiftness cyclone an enemy target. Also, I wish berserk and incarnation were shorter cds and duration which can help our "lackluster" outside of incarnation. Something similar to what they did with nature's vigil 3 min -> 1.5 min.
    From my experience, I don't think its too weak outside of cds as I have killed people without even popping my cooldowns sometimes. However, if I am left untouched or crowdcontrolled during my kill macro cooldowns, its pretty much a guarantee kill on whoever I am training.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Shifthappens View Post
    Yep, if you cant burst people down during incarnation (and you wont be able to if they have CDs up and not sleeping at keyboard) then outside incarnation our dmg is abit lacking. Could use Cylone to 10sec CD lowered, 20 sec is still too much right now.
    To all ferals who say burst outside of incarnation you guys are dead wrong we have a 30 sec burst cd all you have to learn to do is energy pool. simply pool energy to 80ish shred twice tigers fury shred more and ravage when low on energy and ferocious bite pretty simple

    PS save your free ravage for every tigers fury

  9. #9
    Stood in the Fire unrealeck's Avatar
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    I don't play PvP for now (because it's crap) but I remember not long ago Feral burst was crap and relied on using Incarnation and Nature's Vigil plus trinkets etc and you had to hope your opponents didn't CC you. Which is very improbable.

  10. #10
    Bloodsail Admiral LeyrHao's Avatar
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    I'd rather they totally revamped/reworked Savage Roar mechanic. It's clunky and pointless in my opinion. We could use a different damaging finisher, for once I'll like to have an ability such as hunters' Lynx Rush that causes their pet to jump between targets and apply bleeds, somewhat like rogues' Killing Spree, but weaker and with no cooldown, just based on combo points. That would be really awesome in AoE and cleaves, as our cleave damage is quite low, well, we actually can't cleave at all.

    Or a different finisher... Blizzard can imagine lots of ideas more useful and less clunky than current Savage Roar, Inquisition, etc...

    Now we will be 40% weaker than everybody else when we're not buffed with Savage Roar... sigh

  11. #11
    well thats retarded, they should of revert it back where savage roar don't affect bleeds and only white dmg
    because now it's really fucking annoying in pvp, have to always pre SR before applying bleeds or you won't kill anything wasting combo points, but well for pve it's great little but closer to OP ass rogues we need a little dps buff
    and savage roar was (is ?) dispellable, it was counted like enrage mechanic so bring hunter or druid and gg
    Last edited by Zstr; 2013-04-13 at 02:05 AM.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by LeyrHao View Post
    I'd rather they totally revamped/reworked Savage Roar mechanic. It's clunky and pointless in my opinion. We could use a different damaging finisher, for once I'll like to have an ability such as hunters' Lynx Rush that causes their pet to jump between targets and apply bleeds, somewhat like rogues' Killing Spree, but weaker and with no cooldown, just based on combo points. That would be really awesome in AoE and cleaves, as our cleave damage is quite low, well, we actually can't cleave at all.

    Or a different finisher... Blizzard can imagine lots of ideas more useful and less clunky than current Savage Roar, Inquisition, etc...

    Now we will be 40% weaker than everybody else when we're not buffed with Savage Roar... sigh
    why would you not be buffed with SR? There is just no reason to never have SR up with the glyph.
    I think SR is fine in PvE, we just need a new mechanic that helps us put rip faster
    or allows Ferocious Bite which is rarely used above the target's 25% hp to increase SR by x sec per bite or something
    Lynx rush as a short cleave cd would be awesome tho, allowing it to rake every target it hits or something cool.

    For PvP, there should be a set bonus that helps dealing with SR, there is no need to back to derp easy cata SR.
    Last edited by Skadovsk; 2013-04-13 at 02:25 AM.

  13. #13
    Bloodsail Admiral LeyrHao's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    why would you not be buffed with SR? There is just no reason to never have SR up with the glyph.
    I think SR is fine in PvE, we just need a new mechanic that helps us put rip faster
    or allows Ferocious Bite which is rarely used above the target's 25% hp to increase SR by x sec per bite or something
    Lynx rush as a short cleave cd would be awesome tho, allowing it to rake every target it hits or something cool.

    For PvP, there should be a set bonus that helps dealing with SR, there is no need to back to derp easy cata SR.
    You didn't get my point. Of course I'll never let Savage Roar fall. My point it's that we're balance around a 100% uptime of it, and whenever we let it drop we'll be dealing 40% less damage than everybody else, which forces us to use its glyph. In my opinion, having to manage to get a 100% uptime on a flat percentage damage increase is a bad and clunky design. They should just bake that 40% into all our damaging abilities and rework Savage Roar into something cooler/fun/interesing or whatever.

    Oh, and I prefer Cataclysm SR no matter what, because the damage loss when letting the buff drop was barely noticable (which also made the ability not interesting at all, btw...)

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by LeyrHao View Post
    You didn't get my point. Of course I'll never let Savage Roar fall. My point it's that we're balance around a 100% uptime of it, and whenever we let it drop we'll be dealing 40% less damage than everybody else, which forces us to use its glyph. In my opinion, having to manage to get a 100% uptime on a flat percentage damage increase is a bad and clunky design. They should just bake that 40% into all our damaging abilities and rework Savage Roar into something cooler/fun/interesing or whatever.

    Oh, and I prefer Cataclysm SR no matter what, because the damage loss when letting the buff drop was barely noticable (which also made the ability not interesting at all, btw...)
    Agree with that, ever since they added the SR glyph the whole point of SR has kind of been directed to an annoyingly active pseudo passive mechanic.
    They could always go the uncreative route and make it a dps cooldown of sorts: damage % buff for x seconds with y cooldown, or increase stat z for x seconds with y cooldown, etc.
    They could also do something cool like: Savage Roar - for the next x seconds your auto attacks give you a savage strike (or some other feral themed attack name) buff increasing your special attack damage by w% up to z times, with a y cooldown. The glyph for roar could then be something that decreases cooldown and duration of the savage roar buff (thus allowing you to use the ability more frequently but lowering the overall burst capability). That would provide less of an impact on pvp, as the only way to maximize the buff could be designed around relatively stationary targets.
    What are you willing to sacrifice?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by LeyrHao View Post
    You didn't get my point. Of course I'll never let Savage Roar fall. My point it's that we're balance around a 100% uptime of it, and whenever we let it drop we'll be dealing 40% less damage than everybody else, which forces us to use its glyph. In my opinion, having to manage to get a 100% uptime on a flat percentage damage increase is a bad and clunky design. They should just bake that 40% into all our damaging abilities and rework Savage Roar into something cooler/fun/interesing or whatever.

    Oh, and I prefer Cataclysm SR no matter what, because the damage loss when letting the buff drop was barely noticable (which also made the ability not interesting at all, btw...)
    I don't think you can say Feral is being balanced around 100% uptime, we don't what percent uptime Blizzard is balancing around. However it's not that hard to maintain a pretty uptime. It does cost combo points and therefore decreases damage but I don't think this is a reason that Feral has been low. I do think there is an issue with SR on a fight like Horridon with a lot of adds. I'm not really in favor of dropping SR and baking it in but those types of fights are problematic.

  16. #16
    Stood in the Fire
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    SR is a pretty horrible mechanic. Combine it with DoC and it feels even worse, its like playing a game of "watch the buff and press X" pretty much like juggling. And thing is even if i play perfectly i'm still leaps and bounds below my dk, rogue and even monk who all have much easier more flowing mechanics.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexton View Post
    SR is a pretty horrible mechanic. Combine it with DoC and it feels even worse, its like playing a game of "watch the buff and press X" pretty much like juggling. And thing is even if i play perfectly i'm still leaps and bounds below my dk, rogue and even monk who all have much easier more flowing mechanics.
    Surely thats just you not being very good at feral?

    I don't know why everyone is complaining about this buff really... Feral is already a strong PVE class, our Bleed cleave is very strong and our single target is amazing....

  18. #18
    Pandaren Monk Moosie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kreuz Kontrol View Post
    Feral damage is extremely lackluster, imho, outside of Incarnation.
    Most classes damage outside of cooldowns is lackluster, apart from spriests and rogues, I have no problem at all with anyone else, unless they pop CDs, that is. MoP pvp is all about proper cooldown management.
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Nidums View Post
    Surely thats just you not being very good at feral?

    I don't know why everyone is complaining about this buff really... Feral is already a strong PVE class, our Bleed cleave is very strong and our single target is amazing....
    It has nothing to do with being a bad feral. The main annoyance here really is that Savage Roar (and Ret Pally's Inquisition maybe, haven't touched mine in a year) is a very boring spell for some people. It having a massive effect on your dps means that you have to sacrifice sexier spells like FB or Rip to prioritise SR's uptime. It just doesn't feel as flowy as it should be, especially with multi target fights.

    That being said, doesn't mean I'm not grateful for the buff...

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Healarious View Post
    It has nothing to do with being a bad feral. The main annoyance here really is that Savage Roar (and Ret Pally's Inquisition maybe, haven't touched mine in a year) is a very boring spell for some people. It having a massive effect on your dps means that you have to sacrifice sexier spells like FB or Rip to prioritise SR's uptime. It just doesn't feel as flowy as it should be, especially with multi target fights.

    That being said, doesn't mean I'm not grateful for the buff...
    The flow feels perfect for me with Doc single target, not so much multi target but that's just feral as a whole, they're a dot class with no real way to spread their dots like other classes can or no way to put up their dots on a new target like locks and DKs can, they just need to update the concept of feral bleeds, I mean even rogues have a way to refund some energy when a enemy dies with a rupture still on it, why can't ferals have something like that or a cooldown that puts up rip and rake with one click like outbreak.

    Ferocious bite should also be cheaper, deal more damage or have additional mechanics above 75%

    But I still think SR is a good mechanic and can be easily fixed for PvP via set bonuses, there is simply nothing else to add to the feral rotation without going back to autistic cata feral unless they do a COMPLETE spec revamp.

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