1. #1
    Grunt
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    [Feral] PvP bleeds/damage feeling a bit week?

    Hey guys, first time posting, and this is not a whining thread just an honest question

    Do you think Feral damage is a little weak?
    I feel like my bleeds in full malev, with two pieces tyrannical vs any class in the same gear aren't doing much.
    Compared with other classes dots (DK, Deep Wounds etc.)
    Do you think Ferals damage outside cooldowns feels a bit weak, or is it just me?

  2. #2
    not you at all, My rip bleeds are ticking for an average of 9k (crit 17k if very lucky) - Rake ticking for 6ish k (crit for 11k)

    This is fully geared with 3 piece Tyrannical mastery reforge and full pvp pwr gem etc. Our bleeds feel extremely weak and are not imo what puts up enough pressure, we do have other means tho

  3. #3
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    No way. My rips are ticking 27k crits with DoC spec and around 21k rake crits MAXIMUM and I'm gemming almost full resi.. no pure pvp power gems.. you sure you're using 5 combo points and savage roar? Maybe reforging mastery will also help. You're both definitely doing something wrong here. Feral sustained damage may be a bit lower than some classes that come to mind (DK for example) but it's still fine.. usually do top damage of 3s at 1.9-2k mmr unless there's a dk... then.. yeah.
    Last edited by Crass1096; 2013-04-01 at 07:50 AM.

  4. #4
    Ferals bleed damage isnt bad as dmg ,but ferals are realy wery weak for switches . and DK ofc, they dots have same damage but to all team and they unstoppable so with cyclone nrf , and nerf all keys feral comps feral is trash atm.

  5. #5
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    Feral isn't "trash" it's just not as strong as it was last and the previous season. Wouldn't say it's "good" either but definitely not trash. I'd call it a better version of a ret. Not all feral comps got nerfed, I can only think of kittycleave.. FPS is strong, same as FMP. loljk thugcleave instaglad. Seriously though, some people need to try out DoC spec in PvP since NV got nerfed. It's actually pretty damn good if you can use it
    Last edited by Crass1096; 2013-04-01 at 08:00 AM.

  6. #6
    FPS is good yea , but its associate with gaycomp (like all comps with sp) and anyway rogue is much stronger in grls , fmp you can play with DoC , there is rly awesome heal vs thug and Dk+2 random cleaves . the problem that there are moments when we can help mage to survive....

  7. #7
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    Yeah there are moments when you can't help the mage to survive... especially with the CD on cyclone now. But that's why it's 3s and not 2s so it doesn't just rely on you.

  8. #8
    Keyboard Turner
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    Though the inital buff announced to rip damage would of been nice it might of put things a little over the top. i wish they would of changed it from its orginal to maybe like only 10% the new DoC spec is actually viable now that the CD on cyclone is greater then your ability to generate PS procs and the buffed our healing you can use extra PS procs on Healing Touches as well as Roots for additional melee peels in a hurry if needed and benifit from the extra 25% dmg. if timed correctly you rips and rakes will be greatly increased and allow you to put more pressure out by applying it to multiple targets if needed sense your bleeds alone will be doing more dmg to make up for the lack of melee hits on a target your not on. Fearl is alot more abou raw control and forceing cool downs / trinkets by peeling then doing pure damage. I've been playing feral sense season 2 and have 2500+ Exp and i've always felt more like its my control that secures kills more so then my damage.

    However feral is not trash, its just a class that requires alot more additional setup for our rotations then most other classes out there so it takes practice and alot of paitence to get things right but when it all connects you'll know instantly.

  9. #9
    Grunt
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    To be honest I think that its alot of build up time to get our maximum damage out, especially when not playing with glyph of Savage Roar, compared to any other class i.e. nova into deep from the opener and that can happen every 30 seconds. I'm talking about damage outside of cooldowns(when you just spam Ravage) because to me it seems like in the chain somewhere you will get cc'ed or stopped. You open and can get a rake and full 5 combo rip up before the savage roar ends (if using the glyph), but then you have to build up a full 5 combo roar, then you can have DoC proc cause you used your first PS on clone and its on cd atm, but no 5 combo point rip to use it on cause you just spent your combos on the roar, so unless you have you pop cds for ravage spam DoC seems useless there (yes I do love the healing from it but it just seems broken you can't realistically use it on a rip or ferocious bite without about a minute of sitting on one target not getting peeled.)

  10. #10
    Keyboard Turner
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    My answer is for the OP, To be honest I was actually wondering how to beat feral druid teams. For some basic background info, (this should help you understand my PoV of it), I am terrified of a feral druid as a warlock. I cannot find ways around the amount of damage you guys place out. The sheer fact that you have cd's that you hold onto (like a warrior waiting to use his swifty macro at 50 percent of your hp) I am placed in defense right away and so is my team. Even playing with a sham/mage/lock against feral is very hard. We attempt to get rid of your Pred Swift, (clone magic/purge/ss) and 90 percent of the time if you have it covered we never get it. Even if we do get it the first time around it doesn't help because were just delaying you to get an instant clone, If you still want to get the clone out even with the dispel to Pred Swift, you could NS clone leaving us still on defense. Your Teammates have enough personal dps cd's to push us low enough prior to then with all the instant cc. To force defensive's. The only solution I have found thus far is to get lucky with demonic gateway vs feral and even then it's a long shot.

    As far as personal druid output id 100 percent agree with you that the bleeds can be a bit stagnant/low/lack luster apart from your cd's. So i don't personally feel your damage is OP I do think that the comps feral can be in cannot be beaten by a large portion of the community. Including lock/feral/priest or paly (sym for clone or bubble). This may be another example of blizzard making what i would consider A carry spec. While your damage isn't out of control when placed with some of the other classes there is no way to stop the damage, due to the amount of sheer utility.

    Im not sure if this is done by poor pvp design by blizzard or if we should demand that blizzard use feral as a rubric to attempt to restore some legit balance in arena. I feel like feral is in a great place in 3's and mabye 2's... but in rbgs and 5's cannot be used. I don't like this for you guys. If you're bleed damage was higher rbgs would allow for that feral dps(non guardian) play, people will then make the argument that you have resto/boomkin thats already op in rbgs as well as guardian FCing. Which is where I call blizzard out on this one. If you want to play feral dps, it should be viable in every pvp situation. Not a subset of 3's/2's so I feel for you guys on that, mabye they should spend some time working in gear tweaks so that you have the option to choose any spec based on the pvp gear you earned, since you do have 4 specs. I don't see the reason for having to obtain 4 different sets of gear.... its kinda like trapping you into a spec. If a nerf were to be thrown out at you mid season, the way pvp catch up has been it ends your season. I find this to be a massive problem. Anyways hopefully I was able to give you a decent idea of how I feel about feral play currently, and hopefully i answered your question. Im gonna read back into this forum post, hopefully someone wouldn't mind shedding some light on how lock's can play vs druids to try and prevent them from really countering us in 3's cause im stumped.

  11. #11
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    How isn't feral usable in 5s?

  12. #12
    The Lightbringer Ermahgerd's Avatar
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    You sure savage roar is active? It's pretty much known DK dots do more damage because they're a sort of multi-class spec.

    Though I agree that warriors shouldnt be doing more damage with their ONE bleed. An undergeared warrior hit me for 11k per tick, every second on my DK in blood presence (-10% dmg reduction) with 67% pvp resil.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Terahertz View Post
    You sure savage roar is active? It's pretty much known DK dots do more damage because they're a sort of multi-class spec.

    Though I agree that warriors shouldnt be doing more damage with their ONE bleed. An undergeared warrior hit me for 11k per tick, every second on my DK in blood presence (-10% dmg reduction) with 67% pvp resil.
    What does that even mean, why are DKs entitled to stronger DoT's? And yes even with savage roar bleeds are craptastic. It's only thanks to incarnation+berserk that feral damage isn't dismissed entirely.

  14. #14
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kojo View Post
    What does that even mean, why are DKs entitled to stronger DoT's? And yes even with savage roar bleeds are craptastic. It's only thanks to incarnation+berserk that feral damage isn't dismissed entirely.
    I'm pretty sure it's an issue of "just you"

    Feral damage IS NOT useless I don't understand this whole thing really.

  15. #15
    Stood in the Fire Kals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crass1096 View Post
    I'm pretty sure it's an issue of "just you"

    Feral damage IS NOT useless I don't understand this whole thing really.
    People just not knowing how to set up giant bleeds I guess. Just playing between my Feral, Disc and Shaman I see so many ferals at around 1700+ MMR that a) let their bleeds fall a lot even when on target and b) prefer bite over rip when I'm nowhere near in danger of dying.

    It's really just lining up your agi procs/on-use with TF and (if you're playing it) tossing up a doc and bam giant rip/rake. Too many people take burst for granted and it seems they're thinking along the lines of "WELL IF FB CRITS IT'LL DEAL LIKE 70K DMG" and then it doesn't crit and you just wasted 5cps and a boatload of energy on a 30k FB instead of a 100k+ Rip. Sustained damage isn't dead, it's just so overly shadowed by burst that people forget about it.

    Just my 2 cents I guess.

  16. #16
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    I guess.. a lot of people I know that tried feral said they couldn't get the whole damage thing.

  17. #17
    Yea , everyone feel it , dkeys DoT damage is the same like ferals have (in single target lol ) but they for put this dots need to press only one button , but feral can be better if they will give back cyclone or redisign glyph of silemce (to be usable in cat form for ferals) and also we need to cc escape ability (antifear in bercerk will be old good thig and will stop us from nobrain pam hur dur dur hur burst , cause with new dispel we are so bad vs fear ) in pve i think if they will make dot base time 32 sec to RIP and 24 for Rake and improve Haste for them that will be awesome ,reason why - is simple CATS ARE USELESS only damage what we making let us stand in PVE.
    in pvp they should make Necrotick dispelable , remove hunters mass pet omg zerg , and they allready doing good job with sp.

  18. #18
    High Overlord Crass1096's Avatar
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    Well I wish I could read that

    Please don't reply just to criticize someone's grammar/spelling. Infracted.
    Last edited by Sunfyre; 2013-04-12 at 10:47 PM.

  19. #19
    Try pvping as affliction warlock for 1 day and you will never complain about weak damage ever again
    Ferals damage is ridicolously good in comparison to other dot-classes.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Terahertz View Post
    You sure savage roar is active? It's pretty much known DK dots do more damage because they're a sort of multi-class spec.

    Though I agree that warriors shouldnt be doing more damage with their ONE bleed. An undergeared warrior hit me for 11k per tick, every second on my DK in blood presence (-10% dmg reduction) with 67% pvp resil.
    Probably cause deep wounds damage varies depending on the damage they put out where feral bleeds are just static damage modified with buffs. I seen deep wounds tick for crazy amounts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    If rogues become shit, all they can become is a different type of shit.

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