1. #5161
    Quote Originally Posted by Shennanigans View Post
    Won't happen and I'm 100% sure of that.
    I am pretty much 100% sure he will forfeit his US citizenship when all is said and done. since the immigration laws have those provisions in them for naturalized citizens

  2. #5162
    Quote Originally Posted by araine View Post
    Right on the money. we frequently hear the noise of how all Muslims are bad and should be deported. Just remember the frontpage "news" from NYPOST this week and you can see how some groups really like to stereotype certain groups. regardless if it was based on facts or not ( which it wasnt since they where wrong on pretty much everything they reported)
    I don't think we need to deport all muslims.

    I beleve we need to deport any immigrant/legal resident/ naturalized citizen who commits violent crimes while here.

    I also believe that we need to be more discriminating with who we are letting in. I think we should eliminate immigration from any country who sponsers/finances/supports terrorism.

    No school

    No tourism

    No nothing.

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-20 at 03:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    Wasn't me who said that revoking citizenship could/would be an issue in regards of UN regulations if the suspect becomes stateless.
    Besides I am not sure if that would be the case.
    I know that it is part of the USA's naturalization requirements to have only US citizenship. But then, that doesn't really concern Russia, his country of birth.
    They can declare him a Russian citizen as they please, rightfully so even.
    My bad than wildtree.

    I know i usually don't agree with ya, but we may be seeing a little closer on this issue.

  3. #5163
    Titan Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    I say we stand up for our principles, give this asshole his trial, and then throw him in jail and forget about him.

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  4. #5164
    The Lightbringer Istaril's Avatar
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    Just in-case anyone missed it (It was at the bottom of the last page admittedly) the currently-alive bomber's twitter: https://twitter.com/J_tsar

    Point in case, this quote in particular from him: https://twitter.com/J_tsar/status/323950071777472514
    Quote Originally Posted by Vizardlorde View Post
    Guns don't kill people deranged dogs and cooking ovens kill people.
    Quote Originally Posted by lockedout View Post
    We went to Iraq in search of WMD's but found none. I guess they dont have pressure cookers over there : (

  5. #5165
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    I'm sure that as a white guy if I was walking through downtown Boston in a bad neighboorhood things may happen to me which I would not like. Why not him?
    Because both are illegal? Why, are you into entrapment? Or would you look the other way and break the law? You don't want to be a criminal I assume.

  6. #5166
    Titan Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Istaril View Post
    Just in-case anyone missed it (It was at the bottom of the last page admittedly) the currently-alive bomber's twitter: https://twitter.com/J_tsar

    Point in case, this quote in particular from him: https://twitter.com/J_tsar/status/323950071777472514
    Oh boy, he likes AGoT . . . in before "A Game of Thrones makes you violent! BAN ALL THE TV VIOLENCES!"

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  7. #5167
    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzly Willy View Post
    Because both are illegal? Why, are you into entrapment? Or would you look the other way and break the law? You don't want to be a criminal I assume.
    I'm about as far from being a criminal as you can get...unless your a extreme leftist, than you might have a problem with what i do for a living.


    Anyway, nope just saying if he got off on a technicality......why not let him free somewhere that may be hazardous to his health.

  8. #5168
    Titan Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    I don't think we need to deport all muslims.

    I beleve we need to deport any immigrant/legal resident/ naturalized citizen who commits violent crimes while here.

    I also believe that we need to be more discriminating with who we are letting in. I think we should eliminate immigration from any country who sponsers/finances/supports terrorism.

    No school

    No tourism

    No nothing.

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-20 at 03:34 PM ----------



    My bad than wildtree.

    I know i usually don't agree with ya, but we may be seeing a little closer on this issue.
    lol it's okay....
    As for the handling of immigrants. Your requests here are actually pretty well in the works.
    At least the criminal portion.. We residents or any other legal immigrant have to pass background checks. And the INS is a touchy bunch.
    While some things take time to complete, one better makes sure not to fall into the radar of even rather trivial things like forgetting a drivers license and such.
    A simple traffic issue can be the immigrants downfall in regard of his/her current or future immigration status.
    A clean record is really a must have. I hope that pleases you to hear. But my lawyer was in my ears with such stuff times and again. lol

    As for the discriminatory part...
    The problem at hand is the same for the USA as it is for Europe's countries.
    The people you'd like to restrict from entering are usually here as refugees. Just like our two bombers in this case, they enter the country on the refugee program.
    And this is where it gets tricky. Whom to grant asylum and whom not to grant asylum..
    Our countries just take the risk for the benefit of the thousands rescued that way.
    "The pen is mightier than the sword.. and considerably easier to write with."

  9. #5169
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    I'm about as far from being a criminal as you can get...unless your a extreme leftist, than you might have a problem with what i do for a living.


    Anyway, nope just saying if he got off on a technicality......why not let him free somewhere that may be hazardous to his health.
    So entrapment then. You want to get him killed. Don't see why you're tip toeing around that.

  10. #5170
    Bloodsail Admiral Aurabolt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    Why hes not a witness.

    Im just saying, if hes set free on a technicallity...fine. Drop him off somewhere he may not like. Like downtown ghetto area of Boston, or the middle of the nevada desert.
    Boston doesn't have any Ghettos. No seriously.

    Not saying Boston is populated by clean freaks but Boston's version of The 'Hood (which would be more appropriate to use to describe Boston's inner city) can be compared to its "Rich Neighbor" equivelant of Beverly Hills (in this case Hyde Park) where the Mayor lives. NO ONE'S afraid of the 'Hood.

    The Waterfont at night's a different story. If you wanted him to disappear in Boston, drop him off at the waterfront after dark. The scary-ass thing is there doesn't even need to be any people nearby to fuck with him. Literally people just disappear from time to time and in his case I doubt the Coast Guard would bother combing the water for his corpse, or what's left of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    World of Warcraft has been played by so many people that it's hard to get a reliable source of new players into the game. Add to that a toxic community that expects perfection out of people who have never played and you have a recipe for decline.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amry View Post
    Only one faction receiving something completely new? Absolutely not going to happen. The QQ is so massive it will break the QQ Pillar in the Elemental Plane of QQ and unleash Kiukiuwing, the Aspect of QQs.

  11. #5171
    Quote Originally Posted by araine View Post
    I am pretty much 100% sure he will forfeit his US citizenship when all is said and done. since the immigration laws have those provisions in them for naturalized citizens
    I was referring to the point that US immigration won't revoke his citizenship. If he chooses to, so what he is spending the rest of his life in cell in orange jamies.

  12. #5172
    Titan Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Oh boy, he likes AGoT . . . in before "A Game of Thrones makes you violent! BAN ALL THE TV VIOLENCES!"
    And he likes Whitesnake.


    Was always one of my favs from them.
    "The pen is mightier than the sword.. and considerably easier to write with."

  13. #5173
    Scarab Lord ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    Read more...
    Read what you wrote yourself to begin with!

    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    He is a naturalized citizen. The status can be taken away at any given time when applicable circumstances (severe disregard or breach of the laws) are given. That is given, and they can take the citizenship from him. But that would technically make him a Russian again. Which enables Russia to lay it's protecting hand over him. And since Russians and Americans are still happy to piss at each others leg, where ever they can, I wouldn't rule that out. I rather suspect him to get trialed as an American. After the verdict they likely open another trial at the immigration courts, and the citizenship gets revoked there and then.
    Sure, he can lose his citizenship after a trial. That's been my point all along. You implied above that it can be "taken away" before trial. The law you're quoting agrees with me that losing your citizenship requires a trial.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    (7) committing any act of treason against, or attempting by
    force to overthrow, or bearing arms against, the United States,
    violating or conspiring to violate any of the provisions of section
    2383 of title 18, or willfully performing any act in violation of
    section 2385 of title 18
    , or violating section 2384 of title 18 by
    engaging in a conspiracy to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by
    force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against
    them, if and when he is convicted thereof by a court martial or by a
    court of competent jurisdiction.
    (I snipped Section 2384 Title 18, since it has no bearing on the loss of citizenship.)

    If you agree that, while the suspect can lose his citizenship if found guilty, he cannot lose it without a trial, then we're just arguing past each other and can stop throwing law quotes back and forth.

  14. #5174
    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzly Willy View Post
    So entrapment then. You want to get him killed. Don't see why you're tip toeing around that.
    I fail to see how thats entrapment.

    If we have the responciblity to let him free on a technicallity, fine, let him off the bus somewhere he not like. We wouldn't have a responciblity after he was released.

  15. #5175
    regretted my post :P

  16. #5176
    Quote Originally Posted by Aurabolt View Post
    Boston doesn't have any Ghettos. No seriously.

    Not saying Boston is populated by clean freaks but Boston's version of The 'Hood (which would be more appropriate to use to describe Boston's inner city) can be compared to its "Rich Neighbor" equivelant of Beverly Hills (in this case Hyde Park) where the Mayor lives. NO ONE'S afraid of the 'Hood.

    The Waterfont at night's a different story. If you wanted him to disappear in Boston, drop him off at the waterfront after dark. The scary-ass thing is there doesn't even need to be any people nearby to fuck with him. Literally people just disappear from time to time and in his case I doubt the Coast Guard would bother combing the water for his corpse, or what's left of it.
    Thanks for informing me. Ive only been through boston once and I was passing through on the I-95.

    I grew up in Baltimore, and I know i wouldn't want to be walking around anywhere by myself after dark....or in the midday for that matter....especially as a honkey.

  17. #5177
    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    Thanks for informing me. Ive only been through boston once and I was passing through on the I-95.

    I grew up in Baltimore, and I know i wouldn't want to be walking around anywhere by myself after dark....or in the midday for that matter....especially as a honkey.

    Agree'd, the waterfront is a dam scary place to end up when you are wandering around lost....

  18. #5178
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    I fail to see how thats entrapment.

    If we have the responciblity to let him free on a technicallity, fine, let him off the bus somewhere he not like. We wouldn't have a responciblity after he was released.
    So you're going to put him in a dangerous situation knowing full well he may get killed. Sounds like manslaughter.

  19. #5179
    Titan Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    If you agree that, while the suspect can lose his citizenship if found guilty, he cannot lose it without a trial, then we're just arguing past each other and can stop throwing law quotes back and forth.
    yeah that's what I said from the start..
    After the verdict they likely open another trial at the immigration courts, and the citizenship gets revoked there and then.
    I only really pointed out that there are 2 courts involved, for those who aren't familiar. The criminal court that handles the crime, and the immigration court. Of course assuming the criminal trial verdict results in guilty.
    Last edited by Wildtree; 2013-04-20 at 09:55 PM.
    "The pen is mightier than the sword.. and considerably easier to write with."

  20. #5180
    Quote Originally Posted by Rethul Ur No View Post
    This isn't some gangbanger who is killing other dirtbags and probably couldn't care less about Joe Schmo the Plumber...this is a person who has made it very clear that they are intentionally in the business of killing and maiming civilians.

    People were justifiably worried that this person posed a serious threat to their own safety and while having your house searched is certainly stressful, it beats walking out on your lawn and finding an improvised explosive sitting there with your name on it.

    I get the "police state" angle, but based upon the spontaneous reaction Law Enforcement received in Watertown after the capture, I'm going to hazard a guess and say that they were pretty understanding of what happened at their own expense.
    What I see is that as a country we are just taking another step down the slippery slope of abandoning our rights and freedom in exchange for 'safety'. Sure the media narrative makes these guys look absolutely guilty, but the truth is the media could make a ham sandwich look guilty. Nobody here has first hand information, everyone assumes they know what happened because of blurry photos and what the government/media told you. To me it is a complete shame that after all the BS of the last decade the wider population still lines up like a bunch of jingoistic cattle doing their best imitation of Pavlov's dog.
    Most people would rather die than think, and most people do. -Bertrand Russell
    There is not a flag large enough to cover the shame of killing innocent people. -Howard Zinn
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