I am curious.. Are you happy with the state and direction of shadowpriests right now?
If not, what would you change?
It is perfectly fine
Could be better
I am curious.. Are you happy with the state and direction of shadowpriests right now?
If not, what would you change?
Pve wise SP dps is fine this tier (OK mostly because fights permits it, but we won't complain).
But I would kill for any kind of mobility, having to recast a dot as the only option on the move feels crappy, especially when you see that Hunt / lock / Sham having almost no penalty, and mage / Moonkin both having a blink.
I'm kinda happy I guess, PI and especially solace makes the rotation significantly more interesting. I kinda enjoy that positioning/minimizing your movement matters so in theory I don't really mind that we suffer in that aspect, I just find it a bit silly that most other specs don't suffer nearly as much/at all (but I'd rather see most classes suffering from movement than buffing everyone to ignore it). Balance wise I would like to see a small single target buff (and possibly a nerf to ToF), we are fine this tier due to the fight design (and our tier pieces being insanely good), but I'd rather have us be good without "gimmicks" (not the perfect word, but close enough).
It's nice when you can pull off turret style DPS well, but as one of the few (or are we the only now) classes with that large of a movement penalty I can see it being an issue in other tiers. Overall though, I am happy with Shadow in PvE, I am competitive in my guild, and feel like I bring sufficient damage and utility to my raids.
I like the new Devouring Plague. I like the talent choices generally - though there is room to improve on many of them, so I'll list some thoughts on that:
Psyfiend - still doesn't feel right, I'm not sure what it should do instead - but the current incarnation fears randomly, is easily swapped and killed (and needs to be), and has either too long a cooldown or too short a cooldown. I'd like it to be something else entirely rather than a random-fear-totem.
Dominate Mind - I love this ability too, if it has a flaw though - it's that channelling a CC in MoP isn't what it used to be in TBC / WotLK - it's perhaps worthwhile during a kill cycle as Disc pvp, but CC'ing ourself as Shadow is almost never worthwhile to CC even an enemy healer - possibly because burst damage / healing is still so high
FDCL - I don't like this at all, I dislike proc play - but it's often needed when we are getting tunnel to maintain our pressure in PvP. In PvE I hate it, even when it's the right choice for a fight, because again - I dislike proc-play: that could be a personal thing though.
Mindbender - I <3 Shadow Octopus I think I'd prefer it if he hit harder than Shadowfiend (and possibly had a longer cooldown as a result), Shadowfiend's cooldown is too long though nowadays too. I'd rather see Shadowfiend CD reduced to 2 minutes (with corresponding damage and mana return reductions of 1/3rd each, so its not a buff), and then Mindbender CD nerfed to 2 minutes (same as Sfiend), but damage and mana return doubled. Then all damage / mana return stuff would be identical to how it is now, except Mindbender would feel more potent while active
Divine Insight - I like this a lot more than FDCL - the procs are rarer and so feel more special, they also award Shadow Orbs and so feel like a more valuable gain than just a random low priority damage proc.
Shadow Orbs - I feel like the devs thought this up in five minutes, someone made a point form note about it, someone implemented the point form note - and then nobody ever returned to look at this mechanic ever again. MoP Shadow Orbs are probably the worst designed DPS resource mechanic in the game now, we can spend it on only two things - one of which (Psychic Horror) should NOT involve Shadow Orbs at all, which means the other (Devouring Plague) is Always the right call in any situation. This isn't because DP is so good, it's because Psychic Horror is a utility spell that you need situationally and only in PvP. In PvP, when you need it, you need it NOW - you can't generate an orb to use it - and it gains essentially nothing from having multiple orbs active versus a single orb, but consumes All active orbs when used. Horrendous design.
Psychic Horror should be disconnected from the mechanic entirely, no shadow orb cost. 60 second cooldown, 10 second disarm.
Devouring Plague should be the only Shadow Orb mechanic.
Vampiric Embrace - could use some work too, I'd like to see it be more like Ancestral Guidance, 2minute cooldown, 3 target smart heal for 60% of damage done each.
we still can't compete with warlocks in pve. demonic gateways are just as useful and stackable this tier, and our dps gets demolished if we have to move during DP uptime. we can come close on some add fights when our latency and positioning is perfect. yet, still, we're not as useful as a warlock. hilarious how our double damage DoTs from UVLS was deemed too OP to go live and yet it was totally OK for warlocks to have 50% wild imp damage on council.
completely regret not maining my warlock this expac. silly me thinking that since they had spriest in such a good/useful spot at the end of cata that we'd be just as useful in MOP. unless something significant changes by the end of the expac, my most useful contribution to progression this expac will be the ability to respec disc.
fights like tortos make me just want to delete comparing class mechanics of my main and my destro lock alt. being able to drop a rain of fire on bats *and* have it be a damage increase on your shell assignments or boss burn? not being screwed out of damage (and potential resources if mindblast is off cooldown) due to dodging shells? i mean, hell, on my warlock i don't even have to dodge shells since i end up with a 500k absorb on me for basically the entire fight with all my extra cinders and not having to worry about getting interrupted on chaosbolts. KJC procs while i'm falling through the air and falls off by the time my cast finishes, refreshing my soul leech to near full.
1 of the following shadow orb generating mechanics like....(not all...just 1 or 2)
haste reduce MB cd
mindflay tick has a chance to generate orb
SW generating orb and useable anytime and does 50% increase damage when enemy below 20%
damage done by mastery proc have 30% chance to grant shadow orb
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I'd say I'm happy with it at the moment, could be better, but it's not bad. I don't feel stupidly underpowered in many fights, but when it comes to purely single target Patchwerk fights I feel it a bit more than multi target fights. I feel like I'm still doing sufficient DPS however, it's not like I'm causing my raid to wipe due to enrages, I've just accepted that I might not be top DPS simply because other classes are better for some fights than others. It would be nice to compete directly with the Hunter and Mage in my team, but I always fall behind.
I'd love a bit more mobility, I don't see why Blizzard couldn't give us a Glyph to allow us to Mind Flay while moving. I still see that as better than nothing, (and it also isn't too over powered IMO). Even if it was just Mind Flay, and not MF:I, that way we would still have to manage our DP. Another suggestion would be to Glyph (or talent) your VT to no longer have a cast time, that way we could properly multi-dot on the move.
Like I say though, I bring the correct DPS to the table (and when I say "I fall behind" I don't mean by an incredible amount, maybe 3-4% to 4/5th place) and offer a good amount of utility to still feel like I'm doing something worth while. End of the day I still have a HUGE amount of fun playing my Shadow Priest, so until it becomes a factor of me directly affecting our raids wipes due to low DPS, I'd never want to play something else, I've played SP since BC and never looked back really.
Melting faces since 2005.
pvp wise its perfect. it can take some determination to get good at it tho
a good spriest can almost carry a 3s team to an okay rating. not because of mongo-damage but by everything a spriest provides for a team
MDs, purges, bubbles, offheals, good livability(although melees can prove to be a hard hitter) decent peels along with great cc, phenomenal damage if played right and a swap if needed.
spriest is just very different from the swifty one shot classes, i mean 3 orb dp does do big damage on a single hit but you gotta know when to do it and if rolling insanity to avoid getting CC'd and if rolling fdcl to wait for your procs before going hard
Last edited by Ralikon; 2013-04-17 at 05:47 PM.
Kickin Incredibly Dope Shit
I'm very happy with our talent tree, especially the last tier talents.
Without making any comment as to how strong / viable etc we are; I'm not particularly happy with the changes over the last couple of expansions. The shadow orb resource still just feels odd to me due to not having any choice in how to use them. If they removed Sorbs and added a CD to devouring plague you'd have the same thing essentially.
I thought the spec felt a little 'hollow' when devouring plague was removed as a conventional dot, the dot clipping mechanic - whilst nice for DPS also lowered the skill cap and is something I miss.
Whilst I'm sure I complained at the time about ramp up on DPS, I do kind of miss the whole evang / AA mechanic and going back further I also miss shadow weaving / misery. Keeping stacks rolling felt like a core part of spriest from when I started playing the spec - losing that felt like losing some spriest identity.
I also miss MF crits reducing Sfiend CD.
So yeah, Adding all that stuff in would surely break the spec but I certainly wouldn't mind seeing some things that interact more with what we already have.
Mostly I just dislike having a secondary resource that isn't really a resource for anything.
If I could change things; I'd bring back evang / AA. Add MF crits reducing sfiend and have MB scaling with haste(or something?) to add some kind of variation on sorb management / spending.
Could be better, more mobility in pve and a baseline dps cooldown is what i would like to see, a shadow version of archangel would be awesome, although i can see that creating some issues in PvP.
people keep alluding to our being too strong in multitarget... have you guys ever raided with a competent destro warlock? shadowburn + rain of fire resource generation is roughly a thousand times stronger than anything twist of fate can do.
Single target could be a bit better, we're not dead bottom now, we hover around the middle I'd say.
I'm quite happy with this tier. All the heroic fights I've done (10/13) have a mechanic involved which aides us in staying competitive.
If anything, I feel next tiers design style will be the thing to make or break us with competitive DPS.
Shadow is a redundant spec right now. There's nothing we can do that a warlock wouldn't do better and more stylishly. There's a lot of changes required for the class to get on par.
1. Single target dps buff. Mind Flay doing ~15% more dmg baseline and losing part of it for every additional SWP you apply or something along these lines.
2. Mobility. Get rid of FDCL and give 1 charge every 10sec, capping at 2, baseline.
3. Baseline dps cd. Bring back archangel or make PI baseline.
4. Shadow orbs generation out of combat. They fixed the problem for locks, moonkins, ele shamans. We're the only ones left looking for critters.
5. Apparitions are just bad. So many problems with them that I'd just be glad to see them gone for good.
6. An additional raid buff/debuff. Crit, Bloodlust, Spellpower, Magic vulnerability, anything will do really.
Overall the class is quite fun to play, but compared to the utility and throughput of our counterparts, there's a lot of work to be done.
Once you get LMG, FDCL becomes a wasted GCD unless you are moving. So buffing mf wouldnt be bad, although it wouldn't solve our problem of dpsing and moving.
As for having haste reduce MBs cd, that would be really dumb considering how much haste we currently have. We're going to get GCD cap on mf in a full bis this tier. We would have like a 1 second MB cd.
I don't know.... my 10 man grp is progressing on Lei Shen normal and the last tier of bosses are just painful...on lei shen p2 things get a lil better with orb adds but I'm currently getting smashed by a destro lock, assa rogue and frost mage on Quon, twins, etc... I can stay competitive on multi dots, but that's it....
I feel like there is no reason to bring me to the raid other than having good awareness, I don't die in shit like most.... I feel like even our utility can be replaced anytime.
well... our biggest problem right now is that using tier is a dps loss. = /