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  1. #1

    "I think the Alliance has had strong moments this expac"

    "I think the Alliance has had some strong moments this expansion: Jaina's arc is interesting.... The Dalaran sequence was a pretty awesome Alliance win. We've spent more time with Varian and Anduin than in any other expansion." I like how Jaina acting like a psycho bitch is considered a "win" for the Alliance. Playing through the Dalaran "purge" left me feeling pretty sick with a bad taste in my mouth being Alliance.

    Dev goes on to say "The overall story depicts the Alliance drawing together while the horde is splintering apart." Umm? I see the Humans of the Alliance working against the Horde but I see a lack in the other races contribution? How is that Alliance coming together? Then he says the Horde is splintering? lol. If anything they're being united in their convictions against Garrosh. Darkspear, Sin'dorei and Tauren uniting against Garrosh.

    I don't know, it's just not hitting home for me. I don't feel rallied or "connected" at the moment with the Alliance. I think that's why I felt more in tune with the Horde's story and dilemma, that whole "we're grouped up to survive". The collective story of the Horde is just very much more interesting at the moment. I think it's because the Alliance does not at the moment have a clear "goal" in terms of story. If you look at the Horde each race's story is about surviving, and the story arc for the faction as a whole moves toward that direction. You don't really see a faction encompassing story holding all the Alliance's races together, that is what is missing imo.

    What can be done about it? The Alliance needs a Hero, someone like Arthas or Uther or even Tirion. A main backing point figure leading the charge for the faction. You could maybe argue that Blizz is trying to set Varian as this figure but yeah.....haha. The Alliance needs an "Aragorn", someone that I can rally behind and be proud to serve my "king" so to speak.

    Also they should bring back the Knights of the Silver Hand and the new Argent Dawn as major strong points of the Alliance. I've always seen the Alliance as the "Beacons of Light" type faction with their paladins and priests ect. Alliance races have more relation to the light than the horde races, even though horde races can be paladins and priests you generally connect alliance and those classes in the same vein of thought.

    Quote Originally Posted by High Priestess Ishanah View Post
    I don't like how Kosak cites the Dalaran purge as this alliance 'fist pumping' moment. it didn't make me feel very heroic.
    I feel the same. It did not make me feel heroic, which is usually how blizz tries to make us feel with our characters. I always felt that the heroes on both factions (ergo us the players) are beyond the petty conflict of the racial hate and conflict between the common rabble of Horde and Alliance peoples. It has been shown numerous time how the Heroes of both sides have come together and worked in unison to defeat the large evil at hand.

    In the quest A Celestial Experience Xuen brings out what your "Sha of Hate" is manifested as. Either Garrosh for Alli or Varian for Horde. I understand the hate for Garrosh because of what the Orcs as a whole have done to Humans and the Alliance in general. Mainly invading Azeroth and trying to conquer everything. Understandably they should be forgiven and the past should not be dwelt on because they are not like that now.

    But if you notice in the wowhead comments for the quest Horde players state that they don't think Varian should be shown for their characters. "One thing though; my characters -don't- hate Varian." "Indeed. My character couldn't give two hoots about Varian. On the other hand, as a troll, she despises Garrosh for what he's done to her people and the Horde in general. Should have been him appearing..." "My blood elf doesn't hate him, but he is terrified of Varian's truly outrageous chin; does that count?"
    Last edited by johnnyderpp; 2013-04-27 at 12:02 AM.

  2. #2
    We need the one true hero of the Alliance.

    We need Turalyon
    You fucking what mate?
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  3. #3
    Stood in the Fire High Priestess Ishanah's Avatar
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    I don't like how Kosak cites the Dalaran purge as this alliance 'fist pumping' moment. it didn't make me feel very heroic. in fact, in the SAME INTERVIEW, Kosak said in the RE: Horde Being Evil answer that Dalaran was one of the greyest and ambiguous things the Alliance has ever done.

    The Siege might be better. If Alliance gets the canon garrosh kill then it'll be a great victory.

  4. #4
    As someone who has lots of complaints about the Alliance story, especially with 5.3, I agree that we have had some good moments in Mists. I actually really liked the purging of Dalaran, and yeah, it was a big win for the Alliance. It certainly didn't make me feel "sick", the Blood Elves had it coming. It was really satisfying for Jaina to finally grow a backbone and stand up for herself after the Horde has been trampling over her for years.
    Last edited by jealouspirate; 2013-04-27 at 12:24 AM.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by jealouspirate View Post
    It certainly didn't make me feel "sick", the Humans had it coming.
    I'm glad you agree with the purging of South Shore.

  6. #6
    I hardly count the Dalaran purge as an Alliance victory, seeing as how the Horde get a quest right afterwards to storm the Violet Hold and free Aethas and a bunch of Blood Elves. If it was an Alliance victory, then the Horde quest shouldve been them trying and FAILING in their rescue attempt, or them doing something completely different. Im fine with it being a grey area, but I hate the fact that every Alliance 'victory' that we get is immediately reversed anyway.

  7. #7
    They're trying the hero thing with Varian and it is not working.

    They're talking a whole lot about the unity of the alliance and the splintering of the horde, but they aren't showing us. The alliance isn't unified, it's just humans doing things. Horde isn't splintering, they're uniting together to fight Garrosh. What they're saying and what they're showing are contradictory.

    I don't like the unity theme for the alliance. It doesn't fit. It's supposed to be an alliance, not a unified nation. Blizzard likes to draw on the 2nd war alliance, but that wasn't unified. You had Silvermoon, Stromgarde, and Gilneas bail the second the war was over. Alterac betrayed the alliance. Lordaeron was left on it's own to fend of the scourge. The alliance has never been about unity. They rallied behind Lothar to defeat the horde, they didn't appoint him High King and the SAC position was left vacant from then until MoP brought in High King.

    There's also a rift in the alliance. You have the gnomes, dwarves, and humans who have a long history of working together. Most of the important moments in their lore involve each other. Then you have the night elves and draenei who have long storied histories with no connection to the alliance. Most of their important moments don't involve the alliance. And on top of that a lot of their important moments in WoW have been neutral rather than alliance. So, from what I see, fans of gnomes, dwarves, and humans are big on that faction pride, while fans of night elves and draenei want racial pride. Night elves and draenei feel on the outside of the alliance, when the alliance does stuff it's usually human buildings, dwarf tanks, and gnome machines, you don't really see night elf or draenei themes in alliance bases.

  8. #8
    Elemental Lord Destil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by High Priestess Ishanah View Post
    I don't like how Kosak cites the Dalaran purge as this alliance 'fist pumping' moment. it didn't make me feel very heroic. in fact, in the SAME INTERVIEW, Kosak said in the RE: Horde Being Evil answer that Dalaran was one of the greyest and ambiguous things the Alliance has ever done.

    The Siege might be better. If Alliance gets the canon garrosh kill then it'll be a great victory.
    Neither side should've really been fistbumping during that time period.

    But, honestly, if I was taking the event for face value, I would have if I played Alliance.

    Why? Because Jaina basically said "Enough is enough I'm sick of this shit" and did something cool.
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandrox View Post
    I hardly count the Dalaran purge as an Alliance victory, seeing as how the Horde get a quest right afterwards to storm the Violet Hold and free Aethas and a bunch of Blood Elves. If it was an Alliance victory, then the Horde quest shouldve been them trying and FAILING in their rescue attempt, or them doing something completely different. Im fine with it being a grey area, but I hate the fact that every Alliance 'victory' that we get is immediately reversed anyway.
    Are you an idiot? The Alliance now hold Dalaran, that is a massive victory. Your prison is stuffed to the gills with blood elf hostages, preventing any major attacks. You didn't get to kill or imprison a few names characters, boo-hoo. If that's your measure of victory, then Theramore was a Horde failure since Jaina didn't die.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Darmalus View Post
    Are you an idiot? The Alliance now hold Dalaran, that is a massive victory. Your prison is stuffed to the gills with blood elf hostages, preventing any major attacks. You didn't get to kill or imprison a few names characters, boo-hoo. If that's your measure of victory, then Theramore was a Horde failure since Jaina didn't die.
    Alliance gets Dalaran and the Kirin Tor, Horde gets the Sunreavers completely committed to the Horde. Pretty much the same thing. Horde didnt really lose anything major here. Thats the problem.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandrox View Post
    Alliance gets Dalaran and the Kirin Tor, Horde gets the Sunreavers completely committed to the Horde. Pretty much the same thing. Horde didnt really lose anything major here. Thats the problem.
    The Alliance has Dalaran. DALARAN A great, big flying city of mages. The Horde didn't lose a city, but the Alliance gained one. Massive victory. Possibly too massive. It's basically a giant flying I-WIN button for the Alliance.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Darmalus View Post
    The Alliance has Dalaran. DALARAN A great, big flying city of mages. The Horde didn't lose a city, but the Alliance gained one. Massive victory. Possibly too massive. It's basically a giant flying I-WIN button for the Alliance.
    Considering Dalaran was a founding member of the Alliance, the possibly too massive victory just feels like a bit of territory and power coming back. It was just one of the "if it's important and Alliance, it's neutral" things.

  13. #13
    Pit Lord Sett's Avatar
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    If we got some actual use in game for Dalaran's current state it would feel like something. Right now it's just 'oh yeah we did that' sort of meaning. I still preferred having Theramore over Dalaran becoming Alliance-only.

    The Horde getting a boot from the Vale is certainly more gratifying than taking Dalaran over.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Espada View Post
    Considering Dalaran was a founding member of the Alliance, the possibly too massive victory just feels like a bit of territory and power coming back. It was just one of the "if it's important and Alliance, it's neutral" things.
    It's too massive in the sense that the Horde and Alliance need to maintain a 1 to 1 parity because it's an MMO. This means either the Horde gets something equally massive or the Alliance is set to lose something equal to Dalaran. Possibly Dalaran itself.

  15. #15
    Pit Lord Sett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darmalus View Post
    It's too massive in the sense that the Horde and Alliance need to maintain a 1 to 1 parity because it's an MMO. This means either the Horde gets something equally massive or the Alliance is set to lose something equal to Dalaran. Possibly Dalaran itself.
    Theramore was a huge blow. Not only to the Humans but to the Alliance itself. The history of the people that survived by going with Jaina instead of having to face the plague... The location for the port and trade... A lot was lost when Theramore fell. This wasn't a Camp T or a Southshore-level town. This was a busy port city. The routes the Alliance has in canon now on Kalimdor are terrible.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deuse View Post
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  16. #16
    I agree the Alliance victories have been somewhat lame and if what happened in Dalaran is considered badass by Blizzards standards... well yeah. The Alliance could do with a real old school military victory over The Horde. My hopes for 5.3 was the point that the war hit the boiling point, The Horde was still behind Garrosh and a battle of huge proportions occurred near the Horde heartland, The Barrens for example. Horde and Alliance heroes of old would join in to help turn the tide and even an epic cinematic at the climax, also a good chance for Rexxar to rear his head and get some action, and at the end of it all The Alliance win, the splintering of The Horde began because of losses on the battlefield and it was then when Vol'jin struck and the revolution began when the Horde leadership was beaten and confused.

    It would give more of a reason for more orcs to join the rebellion and add a concrete reason as to why Garrosh should be overthrown other then "lel so evul" it would show that he couldn't do the one thing he was supposed to be doing right, winning battles. I don't like Vol'jin appearing out of nowhere and somehow the Darkspear beating back the Kor'kron, I mean Thrall fucks off after Sen'jin wouldn't the armies of Orgrimmar just march in and crush Razor Hill?... I've strayed well off topic but yeah, The Alliance needs some ass kicking awesomeness installed in them, what Blizzard has provided is not what people are looking for and as you can tell I think the 5.3 story looks weak as shit and I see no sign of it coming.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Sett View Post
    Theramore was a huge blow. Not only to the Humans but to the Alliance itself. The history of the people that survived by going with Jaina instead of having to face the plague... The location for the port and trade... A lot was lost when Theramore fell. This wasn't a Camp T or a Southshore-level town. This was a busy port city. The routes the Alliance has in canon now on Kalimdor are terrible.
    You'd need to lose about a half-dozen more Theramores to equal what you would gain from Dalaran. Theramore may have been big in lore but in-game mechanical balance reigns supreme. In-game Theremore is basically a half dozen quests and a teleport point. It actually is just another Camp T, just with stone buildings instead of tents.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Darmalus View Post
    You'd need to lose about a half-dozen more Theramores to equal what you would gain from Dalaran. Theramore may have been big in lore but in-game mechanical balance reigns supreme. In-game Theremore is basically a half dozen quests and a teleport point. It actually is just another Camp T, just with stone buildings instead of tents.
    If Horde and Alliance need to be equal in game, then Horde needs to lose alot for the stuff they gained in Cataclysm. They gained for more than what the Alliance had over Horde back in classic.

    Also, Theramore is not just another Camp T. Camp T was a 3 tents and a quest hub of like 10 quests, that you quested through and never returned to again. Theramore had a bunch of quests after it was redone in BC, not to mention it was a major travel hub due to the ships there. You went through it all the time as Alliance. Its not even close to comparable. The only Horde city that could be compared to it is Grom'gol, and Grom'gol didnt see nearly as much traffic as Theramore did.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    We need the one true hero of the Alliance.

    We need Turalyon
    Yeah. It'd be cool if Varian steps back to lead the Alliance as a central figure, allowing another hero to fulfill the role of front line general.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Yak View Post
    Yeah. It'd be cool if Varian steps back to lead the Alliance as a central figure, allowing another hero to fulfill the role of front line general.
    Varian would become political leader of the alliance? I hate to tell you, but that's not how an alliance works.

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