View Poll Results: Do you think it might happen?

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  • Yes

    13 4.09%
  • No

    166 52.20%
  • I hope this happens!

    86 27.04%
  • I hope this never happens!

    53 16.67%
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  1. #161
    Legendary! Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KaPe View Post
    They aren't going to be left alone since they actively spread undeath in order to "bolster their ranks". No sane leader is going to tolerate a neighbour who will keep killing their people and turn them into walking dead.
    And maybe they should, since alliance failures in silverpine, hillsbrad and WPL were pretty pathetic and pointless. The sooner humans learn that forsaken are the ones who set the rules, the sooner they will stop whining about looses.

  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by Zuben View Post
    I hate the concept of someone having a birthright to a ruling position. One of the things I like about Sylvanas is that the Forsaken themselves have chosen her as their queen. She's essentially a complete foreigner to Lordaeron, she doesn't have any kind of right to the position she holds. She's only there, because it is the will of her subjects.
    Not all Forsaken follow her though, some have even started to rebel against her.

    http://www.wowhead.com/npc=45828#comments

    I believe the latest Q.A also mentioned that Sylvanas is up to something big, which really can't be anything good. I believe she will go down the same boring way Illidan, Kael'thas and Lady Vashj went down, by becoming a boring boss villain.

  3. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadite View Post
    By my logic plenty of Orcs remained on Draenor even after the vile Draenei led the Burning Legion to them and got them corrupted. They never gave up their claim. Does make you wonder tho that all the Alliance bases there is fine but Orcs on Azeroth makes them evil invaders hmmm.
    Sure...the Alliance invaded....in response to the orc invasion. Context and reason. Important.

    That "non-Lordaeron native" freed them from the Lick King
    No. Illidan did that. She grouped them together and led them. She didn't free them.

    NO OF COURSE NOT! Because she is one of the aforementioned people that ran away. I can be magnanimous about it tho. If she comes back we can put it to a vote.
    Is it really better to die cowering like a dog in a basement? How many of the Forsaken also "fled"...but were caught? Likely most.

    EJL

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaozu View Post
    Not all Forsaken follow her though, some have even started to rebel against her.

    http://www.wowhead.com/npc=45828#comments
    You cant count few confused individuals as rebelion.

  5. #165
    Mechagnome Thulyn's Avatar
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    This will never happen. Alliance wont get Lordaeron back, never.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    You cant count few confused individuals as rebelion.
    I said that they have started to rebel against her, not that they were an entire rebellion...

    I would also argue that he is one of the few Forsaken, who is not confused.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaozu View Post
    I would also argue that he is one of the few Forsaken, who is not confused.
    Undead Light worshiper. It burns him, it is destroying him, yet he believes it is his benefactor.

    Not confused at all...

    They called such anomalies "rotbrains" back in Tirisfal.

  8. #168
    Brewmaster Zeverin's Avatar
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    It will never happen.
    Princess Calia Menethil (Arthas' sister) is nowhere to be seen. She lost the rightful claim over her kingdom. Years have passed without any kind of serious attempt from the Alliance to retake Lordaeron, for the Menethil lineage. Perhaps they feel it is not worth it, I don't know.

    Maybe she could rule in Lordaeron, over the minority of humans that perhaps still live scattered there, but I doubt her (now undead) subjects would accept her.
    And also, because of Sylvanas.

  9. #169
    Warchief Byniri's Avatar
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    Lore doesn't really matter here at all, the biggest hurdle this would have to clear is game mechanics and balance.
    PEPE SILVA, PEPE SILVA

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post


    No. Illidan did that. She grouped them together and led them. She didn't free them.
    True enough i guess. Illidans attack did weaken the Lick King sufficiently for them to break free of his control. She did find them and unite then and lead them for victory against the Dreadlords and retook Lordaeron. So while technically Illidan did free them from the Lich King it was Sylvanas's actions who freed them from the Scourge.
    I'm a Forsaken. I kill firstborns while their mamas watch. I turn cities into salt. I even, when I feel like it, rip the souls from little girls, and from now till kingdom come, the only thing you can count on in your existence is never understanding why.

  11. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    You cant count few confused individuals as rebelion.
    In Wowpedia he seems to be one of the few good Forsaken existing

  12. #172
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haven View Post
    It's their own people now? Interesting. Where? I thought Wrynn driving his people to such poverty that they ate mud or migrated to warzones was harsh. Or night elves twisting nature to grow Teldrassil for the sake of returning their immortality was selfish.

    A plague to destroy all life? Manabombs can be used to destroy all life. Spells are used to destroy life. Swords are used to destroy life. Any weapon is as good as any other, it's the user's intent that matters. And you have nothing on Forsaken's goals. They want only Lordaeron, judging by game and not by fanboyish rants.
    In the Arthas novel they also use Forsaken. Not that it really matters, because experimenting on anyone is wrong. But it shows just how much Sylvanas really cared for her people. Varian did not drive his people to poverty. It was the war against the Lich King that had that effect. So you would have to argue that fighting the Lich King was wrong. And the Night Elves did not twist nature in any way.

    Yes the plague was meant to destroy the undead and the living alike. The plague is very different from normal weapons.

  13. #173
    Stood in the Fire Satanous's Avatar
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    I hope it happens, and the forsaken/horde march on Stormwind.

  14. #174
    Elemental Lord Haven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaozu View Post
    I said that they have started to rebel against her, not that they were an entire rebellion...

    I would also argue that he is one of the few Forsaken, who is not confused.
    Vanessa VanCleef is among the few humans who are not confused. She merely tries to make things right for all the people who were wronged by Wrynn's regime.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    In the Arthas novel they also use Forsaken. Not that it really matters, because experimenting on anyone is wrong. But it shows just how much Sylvanas really cared for her people. Varian did not drive his people to poverty. It was the war against the Lich King that had that effect. So you would have to argue that fighting the Lich King was wrong. And the Night Elves did not twist nature in any way.
    And wasn't it war against Lich King that made Forsaken invent such weapons? And I wonder why good guys are never to blame for anything wrong that happens under their responsibility, while everything wrong that happens north of Thandol Span is blamed on the vile evilness of the Forsaken and their despot Sylvanas. Also, you should've done vanilla quests in Darkshore and Teldrassil. Name me the reason why elves created it other than their desire to become immortal and why Nozdormu, Ysera and Alextrasza didn't bless it (Nozdormu still hasn't IIRC).
    Yes the plague was meant to destroy the undead and the living alike. The plague is very different from normal weapons.
    Bombs are used to destroy the undead and living alike. Swords are used to destroy the undead and living alike. I still don't see your point. The only difference I see is effectiveness, and jealousy in the eyes of enemies.
    Last edited by Haven; 2013-04-30 at 10:20 PM.
    "A NAME IS A CLOAK OF LETTERS THROWN UPON A MAN. IT MEANS NOTHING." - Transcendent One, Planescape: Torment.

  15. #175
    Pretty sure blizzard has so no to this several times.

  16. #176
    I don't think they'd re-use Lorderon as a capitol city, most likely Varian and many others would burn that city to a smoldering crater first, to make sure no traces of the undead remain. Following that they'd rebuild one of the other cities, maybe even put Dalaran back in its proper place and turn it into a full out city and have Jaina take command of northern Alliance territory. Then it'd be Kirin Tor vs Sunreavers.
    Blizzard on the other hand would NEVER do this, despite the fact that they could easily write it off, I mean most of the Blood Elf territory is under Undead control as is, as is the Plaguelands. The Forsaken could easily transition over to Eastern Plaguelands to solidify their position on that side, as well as be closer to Silvermoon. New Forsaken then start in Eastern Plaguelands, move to Ghostlands, and then both parties move to Silverpine, then Southshore, then Western Plaguelands. Everything in that region is then more pvp orientated (have high elves and high bourne (night elf mages) start in Dalaran) and life gets a lucky gold star.
    What are you willing to sacrifice?

  17. #177
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haven View Post
    Vanessa VanCleef is among the few humans who are not confused. She merely tries to make things right for all the people who were wronged by Wrynn's regime.

    And wasn't it war against Lich King that made Forsaken invent such weapons? And I wonder why good guys are never to blame for anything wrong that happens under their responsibility, while everything wrong that happens north of Thandol Span is blamed on the vile evilness of the Forsaken and their despot Sylvanas. Also, you should've done vanilla quests in Darkshore and Teldrassil. Name me the reason why elves created it other than their desire to become immortal and why Nozdormu, Ysera and Alextrasza didn't bless it (Nozdormu still hasn't IIRC).

    Bombs are used to destroy the undead and living alike. Swords are used to destroy the undead and living alike. I still don't see your point. The only difference I see is effectiveness, and jealousy in the eyes of enemies.
    When are "good guys" not blamed for what they do. Or, who do you even mean by "good guys", and what are the specific things they've done they're not getting blamed for? Of all the player races the Forsaken are doing the worst things. What you're saying just sounds like an excuse for that. "Other people do bad things too"

    To grow a new world tree is hardly a horrible and evil act. For a race, that used to be immortal to wish for that immortality to return is hardly an immoral thing. To compare it to the torture and the terrible experiments the Forsaken are doing is simply ludicrous.

    There are several things about the development of the plague that make it different from just normal weapons.

    1. In order to develop it, it was tested on living (or undead) subjects.
    2. Its purpose was to destroy all life. Usually weapons are not meant to destroy all life indiscriminately. In addition to that the original intention was that it would also raise the fallen as undead, like the original plague did. So far that did not work, but I assume it's still on their "planned"-list. At that point their really is no difference to the Scourge, other than their loyalty and that subjects are not completely mind-controlled. Still they are awakened in a state where they are probably confused and easily susceptible. Even Garrosh, who used terrible weapons like manabombs did not approve of using the plague.
    3. It destroys the land. It is a plague and it does what a plague does. It defiles the land and life itself.

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    3. It destroys the land. It is a plague and it does what a plague does. It defiles the land and life itself.
    Just like nature itself? Every plant and beast is a parasite.

  19. #179
    Elemental Lord Haven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    When are "good guys" not blamed for what they do. Or, who do you even mean by "good guys", and what are the specific things they've done they're not getting blamed for? Of all the player races the Forsaken are doing the worst things. What you're saying just sounds like an excuse for that. "Other people do bad things too"
    I listed some of them, many times, over and over. Westfall rebellion, Teldrassil, Garithos vs. blood elves, camp Taurajo...
    To grow a new world tree is hardly a horrible and evil act. For a race, that used to be immortal to wish for that immortality to return is hardly an immoral thing. To compare it to the torture and the terrible experiments the Forsaken are doing is simply ludicrous.
    Teldrassil itself was an experiment, its victims got washed ashore in Darkshore. Vanilla quests actually indicate that carcasses of sea animals are an effect of Teldrassil. It's about the hypocrisy of the nature-loving Circle that screwed the nature as soon as there was a boon of immortality in doing it. Just because there you weren't explicitly shown sobbing victims, doesn't mean there weren't any. I, for one, was impressed by that mud pie quest and peasants blaming Wrynn for it. You were impressed by Undercity.
    There are several things about the development of the plague that make it different from just normal weapons.

    1. In order to develop it, it was tested on living (or undead) subjects.
    The evolution of any weaponry suggests casualties, because the ultimate test is in combat. Testing the plague, as a WMD, can at least be contained to one subject at a time.
    2. Its purpose was to destroy all life. Usually weapons are not meant to destroy all life indiscriminately.
    You know, when manabomb got dropped on Theramore, I didn't notice that someone got spared by the blast wave. Also, one can take a sword and gut anyone and anything with it - women, children, pets, their flesh is just a bit softer than warrior's.
    In addition to that the original intention was that it would also raise the fallen as undead, like the original plague did. So far that did not work, but I assume it's still on their "planned"-list. At that point their really is no difference to the Scourge, other than their loyalty and that subjects are not completely mind-controlled.
    Lolwut? It's just an average hater conjecture, good luck trying to prove anything of that. I've been hearing it since vanilla, eight years and it's still just fantasies.
    Still they are awakened in a state where they are probably confused and easily susceptible.
    Two out of three awakened Forsaken that you talk to in starting quests, choose a different path.
    Even Garrosh, who used terrible weapons like manabombs did not approve of using the plague.
    That was in Cataclysm, when he still wasn't insane and stupid and had some honor. Now he uses radioactive manabombs and Sha possession, he's a different character now.
    3. It destroys the land. It is a plague and it does what a plague does. It defiles the land and life itself.
    You know what a bomb does? It leaves a charred, smoking crater in which nothing survives. And plague is a form of life, too, it's just different from your fluffy bunnies. Bacteria (which provides contagiousness) and parasites are also alive, whether you think it's pretty or not - and in withering and decay of one organism, there's a triumph of thousand more. That's the wisdom of Nurgle.
    Last edited by Haven; 2013-05-01 at 07:23 AM.
    "A NAME IS A CLOAK OF LETTERS THROWN UPON A MAN. IT MEANS NOTHING." - Transcendent One, Planescape: Torment.

  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haven View Post
    You know, when manabomb got dropped on Theramore, I didn't notice that someone got spared by the blast wave.
    You didn't notice Jaina? Have you not been playing the new quests, that was a central plotline of Landfall and purging the Sunreavers of Dalaran

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