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  1. #541
    The Lightbringer Danishpsycho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    I guess them having to use their resource (rage) for pure defense doesn't help their threat generation much (Shield Block / Barrier) while, for instance, Paladins still do damage with their own AM (ShotR) so, yeah, that's another thing that keeps their DPS down since they have to tunnel most of their rage into defense while other tanks can still be on the offensive while keeping their mitigation up.

    Idd which leads us back to this whole "nerf Prot Paladins". Imo they do scale a bit too well with Haste but had it not been for underpowered Prot Warriors and DK's in terms of dps, silly design for Guardians (forcing us out of form to use several utility abilities) and a Tier of bosses that heavily favor Paladins in general, I doubt people would have been complaining about them tbh. Cause Monk tanks are doing the same if not more dps than Paladins, Guardians can match a Paladin in dps as well. And people just forget, how Paladins mitigation works - they do a lot of self healing.... Just like DK's who too can do a lot of self healing. Imagine that DK's would scale with Haste just as Paladins.....

    But oh well, kinda pointless to argue with people who barely knows anything about tanking and just glares at Recount and see numbers.

    Tl;dr: Bad game design makes Paladins of all specs OP, only real nerf PROT Paladins need, is how well Haste scales for them.

  2. #542
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    But Haste tanking is so much fun
    Fallout 4 Hype!

  3. #543
    The Lightbringer Danishpsycho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    But Haste tanking is so much fun
    And it's not about removing Haste tanking from Paladins, it's about how well it scales. I'm all for the active mitigation tanking style and secondary stats being valuable but it needs to apply for all tanking classes in order to be balanced. Imo Brewmaster dps is over the hill as well, when comparing to Paladin and Guardian. But you just can't compare Paladin, BrM and Guardian to DK and Warrior tanks as it stands right now.

  4. #544
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akylios View Post
    Since this seems to have turned into a general tanking discussion thread.

    Do warriors need a huge DPS/TPS boost, or has every warrior I've ever tanked with just been doing something wrong? They all seemed to know what they were doing, and were definitely good players, but every time I've tanked with a warrior (as a druid) I've had to hold back quite significantly while offtanking, or risk stealing aggro back. This can be a bit frustrating, as I'm not able to play my own class to its full potential while tanking alongside a warrior.

    I've never had this same problem when tanking alongside monks or paladins.
    Complete opposite for me, my offtank(drood) cant keep aggro on me for shit...its annoying...
    And he's not a bad bear at all, even after the growl hotfix its quite frustrating

  5. #545
    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    Complete opposite for me, my offtank(drood) cant keep aggro on me for shit...its annoying...
    And he's not a bad bear at all, even after the growl hotfix its quite frustrating
    He might be doing something wrong with his rotation, or maybe he's stacking mastery instead of crit?

    If not, then I need to see your WOL so I can see what you're doing that my warrior co-tanks have not been doing.

  6. #546
    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    Complete opposite for me, my offtank(drood) cant keep aggro on me for shit...its annoying...
    And he's not a bad bear at all, even after the growl hotfix its quite frustrating
    Which is funny because my druid can keep threat from me as a paladin.

    Hate to break it to you, but your druid is not playing correctly or his item level is 450.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

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  7. #547
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    Which is funny because my druid can keep threat from me as a paladin.

    Hate to break it to you, but your druid is not playing correctly or his item level is 450.
    Tbh, i've never questioned his skill, he does everything else correct. his dps has been lacking abit but i'm a vengeance hog, contributed it to that.
    i've never played drood of any spec so cant say much besides that he's stacking crit at least.
    Last edited by santa666; 2013-05-17 at 03:17 PM.

  8. #548
    Dreadlord Lethora's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    Tbh, i've never questioned his skill, he does everything else correct. his dps has been lacking abit but i'm a vengeance hog, contributed it to that.
    i've never played drood of any spec so cant say much besides that he's stacking crit at least.
    Turn off RF when he's tanking. I found that the best solution since I tend to rip agro from my druid co-tank during early stages of the fight.
    Lethora, 100 Protection Paladin, Shadowsong-EU
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  9. #549
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lethora View Post
    Turn off RF when he's tanking. I found that the best solution since I tend to rip agro from my druid co-tank during early stages of the fight.
    I main a warrior, going battle stance just sucks, since i cant generate rage

  10. #550
    The Lightbringer Danishpsycho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    I main a warrior, going battle stance just sucks, since i cant generate rage
    Wait, so your Guardian co. tank can't hold threat from a Warrior tank? Sorry, but he's doing something very wrong or you outgear him by miles. No way in hell a Guardian should struggle to hold threat from a Warrior lol.

  11. #551
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    You guys are ruining my friday lol ;(
    He's the best cotank i've had in a long time, he outgear me by 2 ilvls, tho i tend to use dps meta where he mostly uses tank.

  12. #552
    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    You guys are ruining my friday lol ;(
    He's the best cotank i've had in a long time, he outgear me by 2 ilvls, tho i tend to use dps meta where he mostly uses tank.
    Ouch. He missed out on the "bugged" meta proc for Guardian Fixed now, but still miles better than tanking for 10man.

    And you can be good at positioning but suck at damage/threat. Is he using DPS cooldowns appropriately? His damage should be miles ahead of yours.
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  13. #553
    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    Tbh, i've never questioned his skill, he does everything else correct. his dps has been lacking abit but i'm a vengeance hog, contributed it to that.
    i've never played drood of any spec so cant say much besides that he's stacking crit at least.
    I met several tanks who are great at positioning, surviving, using cooldowns etc, however they are terrible at doing their rotation.
    Like, he can be a 10/10 tank in all aspects, except dps and threat generation. Maybe that is also why he is good? Because he is ignoring the dps part of his tanking job.

    Very possible he is a good tank. However to be a great tank you also need to dps well.

    There are examples on this even in top tier guilds. Just as an example fraggoji from paragon when he used to play protection paladin. He probably used his defensive cooldowns well, positioned himself well, moved from shit, but his rotation was abysmal.
    Like watching this video from his PoV
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1GVEa8VyaI
    made me shiver being a prot paladin myself seeing spell usage that bad. I can understand why he rerolled.

    Point is, some tanks can be awesome tanks but terrible at dpsing as a tank. When a a tank your jobs are.

    Survive
    DPS
    Position yourself
    Help raid and cotank as much as you can with cds and stuff
    Pick up mobs

    Being 1/10 in DPS and 10/10 in the other categories you can still seem like a great tank, but you can notice it when a tank loses aggro that he is not 100% sure what he is doing. And as said before, one of the reason a tank can seem good is that is completely ignoring his rotation responsbilites allowing him more effort to focus into the other parts. Its easier to joggle 4 balls than 5.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

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